Realistic targets for a 40 something

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02/05/2012 at 14:54
^That's just a theory by the way. It may be a red herring...
02/05/2012 at 15:04
Maybe something in it - I lived in Edinburgh for a few years - my ITBS was worse there - either it was the cold, or it was because it's a much more hilly place.
02/05/2012 at 15:10
^Leeds is also much more hilly than I am used to....

I will be going to NZ in a few weeks for 2 months. I always train well there as I have good training routes on flat roads near where I stay. Here in Leeds, it is hilly, cold and I have to run on uneven pavements for 2 or 3 miles each run... just to get to a nice flat running surface on a country road... maybe it's a combo of these factors affecting me.

I am de-railing Jake's thread a bit here. Apologies Jake.
02/05/2012 at 15:28

I guess its all part of the "How fast can a 40 something run". Tthe recovery time between runs increases with age, and trying to push for more can tip us into the injury zone. I seem to be teetering on the brink at the moment and may need a couple of lighter weeks.

Enjoy NZ

Edited: 02/05/2012 at 15:49
02/05/2012 at 15:37
Andrew. Your last post sums it up. I think I do push it too much sometimes. Maybe I should back off as soon as I get the first warning signs. Unfortunately I try to run through pain... hoping it will go away (because often it does!).
I just hate going backwards in training... especially when you get on a roll. Your are running well, mileage is up, speed is up... you feel good. Then one day you wake up... aaaahhhh what's that pain? Old age pain... haha.

I know this guy isn't 40... but I have started reading his blog from Day 1 - in early 2009. He was 366 pounds in weight and could barely run a mile. Then 9 months later he ran his first marathon in 4hrs 20mins... and had a fat percentage of 17%. 5ft 11 inches. Same height as me.... but he weighed TWICE as much as me... and yet he now does Ironmans...

His video...

His blog site...
02/05/2012 at 16:03

Wow a great thread I am soon to be a 47 year old and got back into running about 3 years ago. After devoting the last 15 years to football coaching. Did my 1st marathon Edinburgh last year and was very lucky this year to get a place in the VLM through my running club. The point I would like to make is both times I have stepped up the training and followed a plan I have got injured and ended up paying a fortune on physio. I work 12 hr shifts 2 days 2 night  and only mix training with my shift days when I start to follow  a marathon plan. After 2 attempts my old body is telling me hey a 12 hr shift is enough So next year a different way to train (I do get 6 days off) just got to decide which marathon next year !

   Some awsome times from you all well impresed

02/05/2012 at 16:10
Hi RRR_Caz. Out of interest, what new schedule have you got planned for next year that is different to currently? Presumably designed to avoid injuries?
02/05/2012 at 16:27

Hi LeedsNick This year i tried to follow a sub 3.30 marathon plan from runners world. The issue I have is that when I start training on work days I break. Throughout the year i just go for a steady  run on my change over day. So at the moment I am promising myself to keep doing that and not run after work. It is very hard to find a plan designed for shift workers I have to work weekends so cannot even plan a long run every Sunday and every plan I read has that.  What plan for next year ?as yet not sure. I am going  to speak to the knowledge in my running club. Also my physio got me out on a bike and swimming which I hope to keep doing . Also although recommended I struggle with hill training probaly to do with the way run (Like John Wayne I am told) the going down bit always brings strange aches n pains!    

02/05/2012 at 16:33
Sounds good RRR. You need to be relaxed for training, so a good idea not running on your long shift days. 3.30 is a good time to be going for! I've never been able to run further than 13 miles... though I'd love to! I'm a similar age to you, so will interesting to see how things pan out for you...
02/05/2012 at 17:03
Yep after 12 hrs on feet it is enough and the added factor the body clock has to change on the night shifts. I have two local 10k this month and plan a easy June and will do a half in Sept . See you are off to NZ lucky you anything planned race wise when you return?
02/05/2012 at 17:21
I'm doing a half marathon a couple of days before I leave in early June... and when I return I hope to be in better shape to run the Robin Hood Half in September...

If there are any races on while I am in NZ I may do one or two of them...

Good luck with your 10km races. What sort of times do you aim for in these distances?
02/05/2012 at 20:32

Think RRR_Caz has hit the nail on the head that as we all get older and ricketier avoiding injury is the bigest challenge. I took up running age 39 (now 43) and it's only really in the last 6 months I've had a decent chunk of injury free training time. Never had anything major - just nuisance niggles which stuff things up in a low level way ! Hitting the balance between hard sessions that lead to improvement and just "ticking" along with easy miles is the hard bit though eh !

Good luck in your endeavours Jake

02/05/2012 at 20:37
Fraser... exactly right. Finding that balance is key... and as you get older... the margins get finer...
02/05/2012 at 23:35
LeedsNick will be looking to be around 46mins for 1st one the second is a club championship race so hoping to go for it and get below 45mins (hopefully )
02/05/2012 at 23:40
Good luck RRR. Would love to get below 50mins for a 10k... one day...
02/05/2012 at 23:52
LeedsNick & Andrew Jones 72, with the mention of ITB problems and not being able to run more than 2-3 times a week/ rest needed...

Do you do any gym sessions or core work? Other stuff apart from running.

ITB you're usually recommended exercises for knees/ glutes and strengthening legs overall, single leg squats or similar. Keeping injury free for Andrew, maybe similar improving the body overall.

My 20miler on Sunday went really well, didn't go flat out, took the hills easy too, finished in 2hrs 37m... Thats a 10minute PB and with 700 ft of hills, previous one was a flat course.

I do 3- 4 runs a week, one circuit, one speed strength session.
03/05/2012 at 06:09

Excellent news with the PB, FRC. If you are going to beat a PB, you might as well do it in style

A friend has suffered with ITB for ages, and after reading up extensively, switched to some minimal running shoes and has adopted a midfoot strike. Took him a little while to get used to the shoes, but now he cannot run in his old Brooks without all kinds of niggles. He says things have never felt better and the ITB problems have totally gone away (in training at least).

(Not sure why my replies have an acre of white space?)
Edited: 03/05/2012 at 06:09
03/05/2012 at 07:47
Jake, when I had Achilles tendonitis problems I switched from heel to mid/ toe strike, then gradually strengthened overall with gym classes.

Can be something mechanical so ITB can be helped I guess by running style change too. Over pronating or support wrong also?

No substitute for doing exercises on legs though
03/05/2012 at 09:18
LeedsNick wrote (see)
I do my long easy runs very slow. ie. anywhere between 10.30 and 11 min miles... Shorter runs of 3 to 8 miles I vary between 10min pace and 8.30 pace depending on what my aim is. I seem to be fine until my weekly mileage creeps above 20 miles per week. ... it's more like 3 miles, 6 miles and 11 miles say.

I'm 45 and also have to cope with the danged Leeds hills ... and weather!

The problem may well be that your long run is too long based on your weekly mileage. An11M LSR in a 20M week is looking for trouble ... that's over 50% of your mileage in one run and you are not doing enough running to support this LSR. I would typically do an 11-12M LSR as part of a 40M week!

You would be better off doing a 6M long run and 3 other runs of 4-5M. If that's still too much (from a recovery point of view) reduce mileage evenly (eg. 3M, 3M, 3M, 5M). Keep all your runs easy until you're comfortable and recovering well ... as you improve, you increase mileage gradually and evenly over all your runs. Don't just make the LSR longer ... make sure your longest run is only 20-30% of you total.

JakeUK wrote (see)
A friend has suffered with ITB for ages, and after reading up extensively, switched to some minimal running shoes and has adopted a midfoot strike. Took him a little while to get used to the shoes, but now he cannot run in his old Brooks without all kinds of niggles. He says things have never felt better and the ITB problems have totally gone away (in training at least).

Yes, avoiding heel-striking can really help to reduce the stress on the knees ... and minimal running shoes can help to break the heel strike habit. I was a heel-striking ITBS sufferer but I spent 6 months in VFFs a couple of years back and converted to forfoot striking ... have not had ITBS since. I run in racing flats now.

03/05/2012 at 09:34
Hi Dr Dan,
You are right my long run is too long now. But without writing a book... it didn't start like that. 6 months ago it was like 2,3,2,4 (4 runs per week). Gradually increasing so it was 3,4,3,5 (last long run being on a Sunday). So over the months I'd get up to something like 4,6,4,8... and I am real comfortable at this mileage... but around 20 to 22 miles... I can stay at... week after week. But it's not really enough for a half marathon. But once I move up to 4,7,4,9 (24 miles per week) my problems start... I don't ever seem to be recovered. Even though I am adding barely a mile to the weekly total to get there... so I ease back to 4,6,4,8... (22 miles per week) and all is fine again... but I know it isn't enough... ok... 4,7,4,8... (23 m/w) borderline... niggles start... back to 4,6,4,8... (22m/w) ok again... try again... but this time... drop a day... 4,6,9... (19m/w) I'm ok as my weekly mileage hasn't changed much.... then 4,7,9... (20m/w) still ok... 4,7,10... (21) borderline but ok... just... 4,7,11 (22m/w) starting to get uncomfortable again... so I drop another day... 7,11 and I feel ok... but I know it's only a matter of time...

I just can't work out a way to get past 20-22 miles a week... consistently... without getting injured/recovery fatigued.
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