Simple Training Forumla, would it work?

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18/06/2013 at 13:35

In order to improve my 10km time i first of all still need to improve my base fitness.

If i run 10km once a week in around a time currently at 61-66 minutes, then try to run 2 lots of 5km at a time of say 30 minutes will that ultimately improve my 10km time for september?

I know i should be doing interval training and hills etc, but in all honest it all seems a little complicated and i want a simple forumula.

My aim would be to improve the 5km time to say 28 mins and my 10km time to under 60 minutes.

All I want to achieve is 10km in under 60 mins by September.

cougie    pirate
18/06/2013 at 14:17
So you would do three runs a week. All flat out ?
I think you'd improve for a bit - and then burn out.
Running flat out everywhere is not the way forward.
18/06/2013 at 14:19

formula for disater i'd say JJ

18/06/2013 at 14:52

JJ, actually it doesn't need to be that complicated, but answering your question re what you are proposing - no - that's not best use of your time.  Assuming you are still running currently at 60min+ for 10k and only want to run 3 x per week

Slow down your 10k to between 7 - 7.5 mins per k.  Start extending the 10k run approx 10% per week until you are running your LSR 13 - 15k @ 90mins+

Take one of your 5k runs and slow it down to 6.5 - 7mins per k and start extending that until it is 8 - 9k.

Take the 3rd run and start running some sprints.  Use the 1st 1.5 - 2k as a warm up (7mins per k)  for 2ks alternate running at 75 - 80% of 'flat out' for a minute or so at a time and jog easy until you feel ok to do it again.  Pay attention to your posture and gait. Use the last k to cool off.

That would be a better combination.

Once you've done that for 6 weeks or so you'll be bored and ready to look at how to step it up again, I'd guess .  Why not kick the whole thing off with a personal time trial.  warm up 2k, fast as you can timed for 1k, then cool off.  Do that again at the end of 6 weeks and see how you've done.  Or do a Park Run hard as you can as your 5k trial. 


18/06/2013 at 15:02

Thanks Louise, as helpful as always

So on the basis i did 10k on Saturday night, I could attempt the a slower 5k tonight and then the interval running you suggest on say thursday and then the 10k again on Saturday.

I will try that and see how it goes

19/06/2013 at 09:52

Last night I attempted this and would welcome feedback to see if i am doing it right.

I did 5km run and ran at a pace of 7.30 mins per km. After 2km I put in a sprint of around 150 metres (pace of around 4mins per km) then slowed back to 7.30 mins pace for around 200 metre, then sprint etc and did 4 repetitions.

I found that going slow my legs were burning more than normal.

Overall i completed the 5km in 34 mins with the final slow being pretty slow as the sprints took alot out of me.

Probably i did it all wrong, so help would be welcomed.


19/06/2013 at 09:58

JJ8, that sounds perfect.  You could extend the reps each week, which will push the distance up a bit, but keep the paces at around that level for the moment.  Your target would be to get up to around 12 reps.  Try to keep the 'sprint' pace consistent.  No problem if the final cool off is very slow.

19/06/2013 at 10:00

just by the way - it's a good illustration of why the next session needs to be done at 'easy' pace - too much flat out work leads to fatigue and injury.

19/06/2013 at 10:05

Thanks. I will do an Easy 5km on Thursday or Friday, then  do another easy 10km on Sunday,

I will then try to build up the reps to 12, the 5km run to 8km and the 10km run to 15km.

Thanks again.

19/06/2013 at 10:10

My pleasure - let me know how you get on

19/06/2013 at 15:38

"In order to improve my 10km time i first of all still need to improve my base fitness"

you start off with an assumption...

anyway, if your immediate goal is to get a better base then you need to do long runs...that's a simple enough plan surely? progressively longer until you can do 90 minutes.

if you want to complicate it I would personally figure out your heart rate zones and then ensure that the faster components of your long runs go under and over your aerobic threshold.

if you then want to get fast; you need to train fast doing intervals/hills etc.

http://the5krunner has lots of plans on it (mostly from other people) and yes people do complicate things quite a lot. my site has a straightforward 5k plan (which is pretty much the same as reqd for 10k) however it is for runners who are currently sub23 and better over 5k


19/06/2013 at 16:43

Thanks 5k Runner,

My assumption is based on the fact that after 10km i am shattered and i am running 63 minutes for it. That clearly doent show good base fitness. But it is a HUGE improvement from January when I couldnt run for 100m (seriously i couldnt).

Also your link doesnt seem to work. Perhaps you can check this and i can review your site.

20/06/2013 at 10:27

s/be   dot com doh!

anyway, you CAN already run for 63 minutes which to be frank is more than most people so that is an achievement in itself.

it depends on how much time you have.

if you have more time then consider running a tad slower but further

consider running at your 10k pace for 30 minutes then resting 5-10 minutes then repeating that 2 more times ie running approx. 15k


consider running 2x 20 minutes (with a 5 minute breather) at a slightly FASTER pace that what you are doing at present.


VARIETY is what we should ALL be looking at in our training.



23/06/2013 at 18:55

So have now done the following :-

10km LSR

5km interval

5km slow

11km LSR

next is interval again.

Quesiton though. i ran my 11km today at a pace of 7.03 and was pretty good at the end. Should i keep 10% rule or go for 12km next weekend?

23/06/2013 at 19:31

JJ, the 10% rule is not about pace, it is about allowing physical adaptation of muscles / tendons et cetera to take place, keeping yourself fresh for the next session, and avoiding injury.  As a rule of thumb, 10% increase in individual run / total weekly distance - keeps you on a good safe curve.  Every 3 - 4 weeks, dropping your distance back down a little is also recommended; so the sequence might be something like 11 - 12 - 13 - 11 - 13 - 14 - 15 for the LSR.  The elusive (?) point is that after doing the 6/8 weeks of steady training, you have built a solid physical infrastructure that is equipped to take you further and faster. 

If you are feeling good, you should find yourself able to push the intervals session better than last week.  You might also add to the 5k slow rather than the LSR at this stage if you feel underchallenged, and take that up to 6k.  You want the midweek run to be around 66% of LSR distance.


23/06/2013 at 19:44

cheers, will look to up the interval with more intervals and run 6km on the slow one,

23/06/2013 at 20:44

include a hill session. Running up and own a few hills will improve you with no complicated timings or pacings. 

23/06/2013 at 20:51

fair point that Kev, there is a nice park near me with a good hill to run up and down.

27/06/2013 at 15:34

Already feeling good after a couple of weeks and just did my PB at 5km of 28:48. Not super fast i know but smashed my PB by nearly a minute. Damn those intervals hurt though.

Next up 12km run - not looking forward to that lol.


29/06/2013 at 09:04

That's great JJ.  Persist with the low pace on the LSRs though, they pay off remarkably quickly.  How many intervals are you managing in a session now?

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