Believing in God

LB you are doing the right thing. They will choose their own paths. If God is to play a part in their lives he will. No matter what anybody says or does will change that.

It goes to show that a majority of people who do the Sunday school thing very rapidly stray from the church. Kids do not want to be afraid and lie to their parents thats wrong. Kids will make their own minds up. What good is Religion if you have to lie to somebody about it. Its not doing these kids any good whasoever. Such a shame. I know these places exist to teach kids about God that you just do not get at school or anywhere else anymore. But some places can be a bit OTT. Its trying to get the right balance. Its a difficult one

I always end up liking your post vicar even if we disagree on the fundamentals. I get the feeling you want to do good things and that is how you are going to run your church. I hope there are lots like you in the church and that you manage to stay grounded and don't get sucked into the other side of christianity. 

And see - there you go talking about the best bits about christianity without a single ' I believe' in sight.

Ninety quid a WEEK? Our congregation has gone down to about 80 a week and our roof is literally non existent now. There is plastic sheeting where the felt used to be and when it rains, we get soaked. The church building is a 1960's perfab that was designed to last ten years. It's done well but we've been saving for about 15 years for a new church. So far we've got £300,000 off the congregation. We need double that and then half again. I am a lone voice in pointing out that the new building is a red herring because the current church is NOT meeting the needs of the younger generation at ALL so by the time we've saved up all the youth will be disillusioned and gone and the wrinklies will be dead. I was 40 last week. They think I'm wet behind the ears!

And we take between £3k and £4k a month on the collection.

GA  - I'd go to his church! I wonder where he is?

If you lived round here you could come get your church roof paid for by me. I work with a fund that pays for stuff like that and spend so much of my time talking to churches doling out money to help the fabric of their buildings - oh the irony of my atheism.

I see how churches can have a real positive impact in their communities regardless of the religious side. I therefore would not condem religion out of hand - there is a clear need for some sort of community organisation that has a vested interest in the well being of the community.  In our village everything (and I mean EVERTHING) happens in the church hall (paid for by my company's fund  - kudos to us  ).  It was worth every penny and I have only been in the actual church a handful of time (lest I be stuck with lightning).

http://www.entrust.org.uk/home/lcf/funders-directory?region=63

Go onto this site - see if there is a landfill site near your church (within 10 miles) and then you would be eligible for help with the church roof from the Landfill Communities Fund.  Whether or not you would get through the application process is another matter but it is an avenue to try. 

now this is what I call religion giving religion a bad name

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-19893309

shooting a 14yr old girl for "promoting secularism"???  40 years of trying to get rid of the Taliban by the Yanks and Russians (plus others) and still this shit carries on.   how the hell anyone who is a Muslim can condone the Taliban's actions is frankly beyond me

GymAddict wrote (see)

s about christianity without a single ' I believe' in sight.

A friend of mine is a retired Arch Deacon (or something in the church anyway - I think it's Arch Deacon).   I remember him describing his former job to me - it didn't seem to require belief and when I mentioned that he said - "oh we don't bother with all that God nonsense" - only half jokingly.  

That's the kind of religion I like - ones that don't bother with all that God nonsense. 

Our vicar had a vision of being at the heart of our community and when the school next door was closed down we bought it and turned it into a community centre. I must admit I was sceptical at the time but 12 years later (and I volunteered in it for three years until recently) I am SO PROUD of what it is and the impact it has on lives round here. It is always full of people using it for various things including computer courses, French classes, art classes, bereavement counselling, indoor bowls, day centre for disabled adults, zumba, you name it, we've probably had it. Going in there you WON'T have the gospel rammed down your throat and you'll get a bloody good dinner in the cafe. I think our Oaks centre says FAR more about who we are than the church next door to be honest and I'm not trying to be deliberately disrespectful. I'm dead proud to be a part of it.

GymAddict wrote (see)

http://www.entrust.org.uk/home/lcf/funders-directory?region=63

 

Go onto this site - see if there is a landfill site near your church (within 10 miles) and then you would be eligible for help with the church roof from the Landfill Communities Fund.  Whether or not you would get through the application process is another matter but it is an avenue to try. 

We have ARPLEY landfill site within two miles GA! Thanks for that - I shall look into it!

popsider wrote (see)

GymAddict wrote (see)

s about christianity without a single ' I believe' in sight.

A friend of mine is a retired Arch Deacon (or something in the church anyway - I think it's Arch Deacon).   I remember him describing his former job to me - it didn't seem to require belief and when I mentioned that he said - "oh we don't bother with all that God nonsense" - only half jokingly.  

 

This is a good little book - Godless Morality: Keeping Religion out of Ethics, and it was written by the former Bishop of Edinburgh! 

LB.........just had ours roof etc sorted..............luckily had lots of grants as apparantley it is rather unique as it was built betrween the wars...........so CADW listed.....

I reside in the sunny county of Somerset. They are all God fearing down here as we haven't got TV or internet or even newspapers. So I just tell them what I want and they say yes otherwise I tell them they are going to hell

LB thats what a Church should be all about and its really positive hearing your story. Its the religions, or deifferent denominations, that are do not want to help anybody other than theirselves that are a problem.

GA to be honest a majority of Religion is BS. I live by the hard and fast rule of love God and love your neighbour. Everything else is extra baggage. Now not everybody can love God but everybody can try to love one another or try to like I do. I fail everyday but I do try.

PS yes Arch Deacon is correct. One undera Bishop if you like. Yes I know a few Vicars who would say they do not believe in God how you and I thin kthey should be. I like to think the Priests are the glue holding it all together. The Priest I work under went a good few years not believing and praying. Its not uncommon. None of us are sure ourselves, its pretty bloody hard work trying to hold on to your faith if the truth be known. But its not meant to be easy.

Whenever we have these arguments Phil its always interesting hearing from you because I just cannot get the angle you are coming from.

When my son was about 5 or 6 he said to me "I like Father Christmas better than God". Slightly suprised I enquired "why's that?!" . "Well" he explained, "Father Christmas gives you presents.. God just gives you nothing!!" I don't know if I believe in God or not but I thought it was hilarious.

TheVicar wrote (see)

 

Whenever we have these arguments Phil its always interesting hearing from you because I just cannot get the angle you are coming from.

  Either because it's not all black and white, or I'm too diplomatic for my own good!

I posted a link to that book mainly because of all the things that I irritate me about some religious people is the idea that morality without religion - or God - is impossible.  As if atheists walk around all day carrying out selfish, senseless acts without any concern for their fellow humans (or animals, or the environment, come to that.)  I recall Jesus is supposed to have said something along the lines of "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you."  Wise words, but my guess is that this principle (the "golden rule") occurred to people naturally a lot earlier.  Apart from being social creatures and cooperation going a long way, we are capable of empathy.  "Billy, don't punch little Jonny in the face. How would you like it if he did that to you?"

Seems like a very obvious and basic thing to say, and yet the Pope and numerous cardinals - Cormac Murphy-O'Connor's a good one - are forever bleating on about "aggressive secularism" and virtually equating lack of religion with complete lack of morality.  It does my nut in that some people can feel so fundamentally morally superior when their own religious doctrine contains so much intolerance.

Dave The Ex- Spartan wrote (see)

I do have an issue with the Catholic Church... One of the richest organisations on the planet , so why not sell the lot and feed the poor ?

And how can a bunch of (supposedly celibate) men decree that contraception is wrong, therefore condemning women in Africa to untold horrors...

Seems to be a pretty fecked up God

But it could be argued that it's not God that's fucked up but the interpretation of religion by people.

Ghost thats extremely true!

I think the idea of a Pope is completely and utterly wrong. I think the Catholic Church needs to really have a look at itself and try and drag the church into this century and stop living in the 1800's. Just my view And yes I have said it before, we have a load of Tudor silverwhere kept in a bank in our town. I said we should flog it and give the money away. Oh you cant do that lol. Its the same as chucking money at this wonderful building we come to on a Sunday morning. Its amazing and we should look after it but you think how much better it would be to spend that money on other things. However in saying that we managed to give 15000£ to charities last year so we do some good now and again.