Ethics are not just for Sundays

new archbishops has to back track

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seren nos    pirate
26/07/2013 at 17:56

after slating wonga..( and I personally think that the payday loan people should be banned)........The new archbishop now has to try and explain why the Church of England have shares in the company.....

what happened to ethical investments.........

 

His new way forward is to have the church set up credit agreemenst for the public.......but will have to charge around 30% apr to make a profit,,,,,,,,,surely with families in so much desperate need the church could afford to run them without making a profit

26/07/2013 at 18:08

Wonga was started by an old running partner of mine. He came to this country in 2006 with the idea of offering loans, short term to pay day and charge for it. They are not meant to be affordable long term loans. The Wonga website is upfront and explains exactly how much you will pay back if you borrow x amount and pay back in x time. No hidden charges and fees charged by banks and other financial institutions. 

 

seren nos    pirate
26/07/2013 at 18:24

the rates are just unbelievable and the whole system then just gets people into a cycle of debt

i think there should be much more provision in the communities at similar help but with people face to face who can also give advise on how to get out of the cycles......at very low rates

27/07/2013 at 06:26

We got charges £75 by our bank for going a couple of hundred quid overdrawn for a few days. If I calculated the apr on this I'm sure it would be in the thousands.

I don't think its really appropriate to apply the same measure to these high risk, high admin loan as you would to a 25 year mortgage.

I do think there needs to be some control other than market forces. However, the banking industry is very risk averse at the moment, so if you have a poor credit history you either pay through the nose or go without.

As for the church being involved in unethical practices, well what is new there?

Edited: 27/07/2013 at 06:29
27/07/2013 at 07:15

I imagine the £75 includes charges for the over draft as well as iinteresting

 

i really think this is a good thing for the church to get involved in, and if it dives pay day loan companies out of business great

27/07/2013 at 07:33

@seren nos - not necessarily cyclical. It depends how stupid the borrower is.  There's plenty of help "in the community" already.

seren nos    pirate
27/07/2013 at 09:13

I also noted that the church ethical p[olicy means that they invest in conpanies that deal with porn as long as its not more than 3% of the business.and tobacco and gambling etc as long as its not more than 25%...the same with alcohol and embryo research......

so if its a big massive corporation you can deal in just about anything and still be considered ethical........

 

and the church invest 125Million a year in spouses loans..wonder why they loan to the spouses and not the employees

27/07/2013 at 09:24

If you are looking for logic and reasoning then don't go looking in the church

27/07/2013 at 12:48

It would be fascinating to see the church get into the moneylending business

27/07/2013 at 13:27

Wonga has simply taken advantage of the fact that vast numbers of people spend all their money as soon as they get it. 

And always will.

Savers they're not.

27/07/2013 at 13:43

This seems to be as much about usury as it is about the convoluted and sometimes hard-to-fathom ownership structure of many businesses.

27/07/2013 at 13:52

Wonga was funded by 'venture capitalists'.

So I read somewhere.

I don't understand the systems these businesses use either. Its like they are controlled by aliens. A bit like the film ,The Man who Fell to Earth.

27/07/2013 at 14:59

I don't know about venture capalist.Was just some straight up bloke I ran with on Sundays. Nobody forced these people to take out the loans. The terms are clear from the start.

27/07/2013 at 15:03

I don't think the ethical issue is with Wonga.  Its a reflection of society. People shouldn't be put in a situation where the services of companies like Wonga are required.  We don't teach our children (as parents or at school) how to manage our money and there is getting less and less stigma attached to being in debt.  Once upon a time it was considered shameful but these days it is the norm.

seren nos    pirate
27/07/2013 at 15:03

no one forces people to take drugs.apart from circumstances maybe.......so lets leave the drug barons and pushers alone.....

27/07/2013 at 15:42

The illegal loan sharks would welcome the demise of Wonga. Better legislation is needed to control them but they must be careful not to play into the hands of much worse unregulated lenders.

seren nos    pirate
27/07/2013 at 15:44

true NRL

 

seren nos    pirate
27/07/2013 at 15:45

I can honestly say that I do not agree with the way they are run........But I can also confirm that whilst slagging them off I do not own any shares in them 

27/07/2013 at 15:49

Are you sure Seren?  Do you have a pension or ISA and if so do you know exactly what investments they make?  My point is that it is almost impossible to know what companies you are supporting indirectly

27/07/2013 at 15:51

In the late 80's I attempted (for 3 months) to persuade people to take out personal pensions. Waste of time. They just weren't having it. They had a lifestyle to maintain & aspire to and that meant keeping and spending all their money.

The long term implications of their actions wasn't something they wanted to know about. So I left them to to it and took my own advice.

Early retirement anyone?

 

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