Missing Maths Teacher

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26/09/2012 at 08:24
Rickster wrote (see)
XFR Bear wrote (see)

How is it treating law-abiding people as criminals?  It's treating them as an unknown quantity, which is actually what they are.

 

The only way I can see of not making innocent people wait for the CRB to come back will also let people with paedophile convictions teach/whatever while you wait for the CRB to come back - that seems quite a risk to take.

 

What exactly are you proposing as a better alternative Rickster?

I'm proposing that they drop the price a bit, as it seems like a money making excercise. Surely it shouldn't cost £44 to check a couple of records.

So you actually have no idea how much work goes into a check as you seem to think its only checking a couple of records.

26/09/2012 at 08:28

What is it then?

gingerfurball    pirate
26/09/2012 at 09:21

The thing that gets to me is that on the pictures from the CCTV on the boat that girl looks really young to me...I mean she looks like a young girl holding the hand of an obviously older man...I wonder if any of us had seen them would we have done something about it?

26/09/2012 at 09:28

I doubt any of us would see anything wrong unless they were bahaving in a way to suggest GF/BF and even then who could realistically judge ages well enough to intervene.

kittenkat    pirate
26/09/2012 at 09:31
gingerfurball wrote (see)

The thing that gets to me is that on the pictures from the CCTV on the boat that girl looks really young to me...I mean she looks like a young girl holding the hand of an obviously older man...I wonder if any of us had seen them would we have done something about it?

Most might assume it was father/daughter?

kittenkat    pirate
26/09/2012 at 09:31

A young father!

26/09/2012 at 09:32
How can this be considered a failure of the CRB system. The CRB picks up on people with passed criminal convictions. How can you prevent what people will do in the future? This is real life not Minority Report.
kittenkat    pirate
26/09/2012 at 09:38
Ghostrider wrote (see)

I guess my angle is, how can someone shoot them selves in the foot with such power.

 


4) He is going to do some serious bird.

Will he? What law has he broken? I guess sex with a minor might be proved (well it's rape I think because under 16s can't give consent as far as my limited knowledge stretches), hard to prove, but what would constitute a long time in jail when you really look at the law?

We know there are many breaches of trust and professional responsibility, but what actually in law, I don't know. Anyone know about child law here?

26/09/2012 at 09:56

Devil's advocate question, what happens if they come back and both claim no physical contact?

I assume it's still inappropriate behaviour from a teacher and his job would suffer but could he avoid jail?

26/09/2012 at 10:04

GFB - To me the pictures look like a teenager rather than a young girl holding the hand of a man about 30.   I might wonder but she could easily be 17 so what complete strangers are meant to do I'm not sure - it's not like you can challenge someone because his girlfriend looks like she might be under 16 but could easily be over that age.  I know what you mean about people often not intervening in things but in this case I'm not sure they could be expected to.

If they come back and claim not to have had sex and it can't be proved they have then I suppose he gets sacked and charged with some less serious offence which to be honest would seem fair enough to me.   

seren nos    pirate
26/09/2012 at 10:06

border control would have the passport and so the date of birth.......

26/09/2012 at 10:08

They went on a ferry Seren.....  When we went to France on the ferry they didn't even bother to take the passports out of my hand when we left the UK, and coming back it was a holiday in France so only the girl at the ferry company office looked at them...

26/09/2012 at 10:16
kittenkat wrote (see)
Ghostrider wrote (see)

I guess my angle is, how can someone shoot them selves in the foot with such power.

 


4) He is going to do some serious bird.

Will he? What law has he broken? I guess sex with a minor might be proved (well it's rape I think because under 16s can't give consent as far as my limited knowledge stretches), hard to prove, but what would constitute a long time in jail when you really look at the law?

We know there are many breaches of trust and professional responsibility, but what actually in law, I don't know. Anyone know about child law here?

Assuming the worst from the facts all these offences could apply:

Rape (it is illegal to have sex with a person under the age of 16.) I think there is some prosecutorial discretion where the defendant is also quite young (e.g. a 18 year old having sex with his 15 year old girlfriend) to charge them with a "lesser" offence, but I doubt very much that any court would see a situation where a man in his 30s had sex with a 15 year old pupil as a situation that calls for a "lesser" offence.

Abuse of a position of trust (if you are in a position of trust, e.g. teacher, the age of consent is 18 not 16, to protect vulnerable 16 and 17 year olds that might be unduly influenced by someone in authority). It's not just a question of professional ethics or morals, it is a criminal offence under the Sexual Offences Act.

Child abduction (removing a child from the lawful custody of the parents)

Kidnapping (you can't "consent" to kidnap if you are under 16, the same way you can't consent to sexual intercourse)

26/09/2012 at 10:18
EKGO wrote (see)

Devil's advocate question, what happens if they come back and both claim no physical contact?

I assume it's still inappropriate behaviour from a teacher and his job would suffer but could he avoid jail?

Kidnap and child abduction for starters? He still removed her from the custody of her lawful guardians, whether or not she went willingly is irrelevant. 

26/09/2012 at 10:25

I'd like to think it was something you couldn't get away with

26/09/2012 at 10:31

I can't imagine that the CPS would think that this situation didn't call for SOME form of prosecution. This isn't a niave teenage boy running off with his underage girlfriend, this is a grown man who has disappeared with a 15 year old girl entrusted to his care.

Whether they have been spending their time in France having sex or playing Monopoly, is there anyone who actually thinks that his actions should avoid some form of prosecution?

Edited: 26/09/2012 at 10:32
WiB
26/09/2012 at 10:42
gingerfurball wrote (see)

The thing that gets to me is that on the pictures from the CCTV on the boat that girl looks really young to me...I mean she looks like a young girl holding the hand of an obviously older man...I wonder if any of us had seen them would we have done something about it?

To be honest, unless I recognised them from the images on the news then I doubt I would give it a second thought if I saw them.

WiB
26/09/2012 at 11:09
Apparently it all started when he asked her if 30 could go into 15
26/09/2012 at 11:20
If a teacher and a pupil travel to France on a boat at 20mph and it takes 4 hours what's the probability the pupil get sh@gged?
26/09/2012 at 11:29

God gave man enought blood to operate a brain and a penis, Sadly not at the same time.

 

Walked past the queue for the school bus in the village this morning, and whished I was 30 years younger

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