Missing Maths Teacher

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26/09/2012 at 09:56

Devil's advocate question, what happens if they come back and both claim no physical contact?

I assume it's still inappropriate behaviour from a teacher and his job would suffer but could he avoid jail?

26/09/2012 at 10:04

GFB - To me the pictures look like a teenager rather than a young girl holding the hand of a man about 30.   I might wonder but she could easily be 17 so what complete strangers are meant to do I'm not sure - it's not like you can challenge someone because his girlfriend looks like she might be under 16 but could easily be over that age.  I know what you mean about people often not intervening in things but in this case I'm not sure they could be expected to.

If they come back and claim not to have had sex and it can't be proved they have then I suppose he gets sacked and charged with some less serious offence which to be honest would seem fair enough to me.   

seren nos yn canu    pirate
26/09/2012 at 10:06

border control would have the passport and so the date of birth.......

26/09/2012 at 10:08

They went on a ferry Seren.....  When we went to France on the ferry they didn't even bother to take the passports out of my hand when we left the UK, and coming back it was a holiday in France so only the girl at the ferry company office looked at them...

26/09/2012 at 10:16
kittenkat wrote (see)
Ghostrider wrote (see)

I guess my angle is, how can someone shoot them selves in the foot with such power.

 


4) He is going to do some serious bird.

Will he? What law has he broken? I guess sex with a minor might be proved (well it's rape I think because under 16s can't give consent as far as my limited knowledge stretches), hard to prove, but what would constitute a long time in jail when you really look at the law?

We know there are many breaches of trust and professional responsibility, but what actually in law, I don't know. Anyone know about child law here?

Assuming the worst from the facts all these offences could apply:

Rape (it is illegal to have sex with a person under the age of 16.) I think there is some prosecutorial discretion where the defendant is also quite young (e.g. a 18 year old having sex with his 15 year old girlfriend) to charge them with a "lesser" offence, but I doubt very much that any court would see a situation where a man in his 30s had sex with a 15 year old pupil as a situation that calls for a "lesser" offence.

Abuse of a position of trust (if you are in a position of trust, e.g. teacher, the age of consent is 18 not 16, to protect vulnerable 16 and 17 year olds that might be unduly influenced by someone in authority). It's not just a question of professional ethics or morals, it is a criminal offence under the Sexual Offences Act.

Child abduction (removing a child from the lawful custody of the parents)

Kidnapping (you can't "consent" to kidnap if you are under 16, the same way you can't consent to sexual intercourse)

26/09/2012 at 10:18
EKGO wrote (see)

Devil's advocate question, what happens if they come back and both claim no physical contact?

I assume it's still inappropriate behaviour from a teacher and his job would suffer but could he avoid jail?

Kidnap and child abduction for starters? He still removed her from the custody of her lawful guardians, whether or not she went willingly is irrelevant. 

26/09/2012 at 10:25

I'd like to think it was something you couldn't get away with

26/09/2012 at 10:31

I can't imagine that the CPS would think that this situation didn't call for SOME form of prosecution. This isn't a niave teenage boy running off with his underage girlfriend, this is a grown man who has disappeared with a 15 year old girl entrusted to his care.

Whether they have been spending their time in France having sex or playing Monopoly, is there anyone who actually thinks that his actions should avoid some form of prosecution?

Edited: 26/09/2012 at 10:32
WiB
26/09/2012 at 10:42
gingerfurball wrote (see)

The thing that gets to me is that on the pictures from the CCTV on the boat that girl looks really young to me...I mean she looks like a young girl holding the hand of an obviously older man...I wonder if any of us had seen them would we have done something about it?

To be honest, unless I recognised them from the images on the news then I doubt I would give it a second thought if I saw them.

WiB
26/09/2012 at 11:09
Apparently it all started when he asked her if 30 could go into 15
26/09/2012 at 11:20
If a teacher and a pupil travel to France on a boat at 20mph and it takes 4 hours what's the probability the pupil get sh@gged?
26/09/2012 at 11:29

God gave man enought blood to operate a brain and a penis, Sadly not at the same time.

 

Walked past the queue for the school bus in the village this morning, and whished I was 30 years younger

27/09/2012 at 09:18

saw this posted elsewhere:

You are 30 she is 15 do the maths teacher 

You are 15 he is 30 do the maths teacher 

27/09/2012 at 09:54
In the news this week we have had reports of mass rapes in Syria. Grooming of young girls in Rochdale for sex. These two have gone off by mutual consent. She is below the age of consent but only just. Rightly so there will be a prison sentence waiting for him and his life will be in tatters. In many ways he is a victim too. He will be paying the price for this long after she has forgotten about it. But compared to other crimes in the news this week this is not so bad. I just hope they both come home safe. He needs to pay for his crimes and she needs to get on with her life.
WiB
27/09/2012 at 10:11

I am interested in how he is a victim?

WiB
27/09/2012 at 10:49
I don't think he has done this as some violent hate crime. I'm sure he has done it out of love for the girl. He is probably in a very confused and mixed up state too. He has done wrong and should be punished but he isn't a " Ian Huntly" . His life will be devastated by this. How strong must his feelings be to risk everything in his life for the girl.
WiB
27/09/2012 at 11:01

ok, I agree he is no Ian Huntly and it appears the girl's life is not in danger from him. However, that is something the justice system should take care of when deciding on his punishment and not be a reason for him to be considered to be a victim. 

From reports on the matter so far he appears to be capable of making decisions and understanding the outcome of them. As such, feelings aside, he has knowingly broken laws and removed a young girl from her parents without consent. That is bad enough without gonig into other possible crimes.

Given her age, she will not be deemed responsible for any actions they carry out as pair. That doesn't make him a victim it just makes him foolish if he was so easily influenced by a young girl.

I see your point, but I think suggesting he is a victim is probably the wrong way to describe it.

WiB
27/09/2012 at 11:17
Victim of himself and the situation in as much as he will pay the biggest price. A huge price which I'm sure he will regret for the rest of his life. Rightly so in as much as there should be huge deterrents for such behaviour. But rather than turning him into Freddie Kruger like the likes of Seren Nos does in her black and white world I prefer to have a little compassion.
WiB
27/09/2012 at 11:32

Yes, if they returned right now the girl will not get any punishment. Anything she is deemed to have done wrong she can simply say "he made me do it". In that respect his is a victim of his own choices, but they were his own choices.

WiB
27/09/2012 at 11:34

My wife is a teacher, and I must say her stance on this surprised me.  Neither me or her have read all the reports, so can't confirm (or otherwise) her arguments, but she feels a bit sorry for the teacher in this instance and pretty much summed her views up as Sussex Runner has, whilst still acknowledging that the teacher has done wrong and must face any punishment etc.

Her view (with no knowledge of the ins and outs of the case) is that she would be very surprised if the school hadn't acted if they knew for sure the two were in a relationship.  There was a report that said the girl's friend and reported the relationship but my wife's view was that school can't generally act on every report they get from a teenager.

Her main point was that because the school had been mixed up in cases previously, they should be even more careful when something like this comes to light.

 

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