Liverpool Marathon 2013

Nick Windsor 4 wrote (see)

Alan a serious question, if you held the Marathon last year successfully, obviously the route was a decent one.

What would prevented you using the same route this year, and has the change come about by

1) Have you changed your preferred route

2) Has something happened to prevent you using the 2012 route

There has to be a level of intransigence (possibly on both sides) to have had such a monumental bust up.

Sorry for two things, 1) For raising the issue of stereotypes and 2) Mortal sin of quoting my own post

However drop the Liverpool stereotype images that both BTR and Council are displaying, stop the intransigence and show some responsibility to your people (Council and BTR) and put the race back where it should be. Nobody really cares about the aesthetics of the route (Let's be honest) as long as we get a run

Nurse Gladwys - it saddens me that you continue to doubt my honesty and integrity but never mind, you can't please all the people all the time.

For the record (not related to this thread) the Women's 10K was losing £30,000 each year when managed by LCC. As a consequence they didn't really want to host it and we took over the management in 2006. In the first year three years it was noticable that there was decling interest in the event as women were preferring to run in Race For Life type events. Women racing over 10K had become less attractive and RFL tried to create their own 10K and it just didn't happen.

Over the following 3 - 6 years the numbers continued to fall and the introduction of the 5K was to try and increase participation. It didn't work and as of last year the event was considerably under funded with just 700 or so entries.

The running market is quite sophisticated and clearly there is no demand for women only races over 10K, there is no interest in business team events (old Corporate Cup) and there is no interest in football supporter based events (Big Heart 5K). That is why we have dropped them and are looking at other events that fill market requirements better. The Port Sunlight 10K is the first of several new events we hope to develop.

Conversely, the Half Marathon has increased again this year (8,000), the Santa Dash was the biggest we have done in nine years (8,500 in total including the Mini Dash) and the Tunnel 10K has grown from less than 700 when we took it over to around 3,500.

Where you like it or not there are commercial demands on every event which have to be addressed and as far as you suspicion about my motives goes, I can only say I'm comfortable with what I do and how I conduct my business affairs.

Regarding my 'friends' on the forum they all tend to support my efforts because they have taken the time to talk to me in person and have a gained a greater understanding what actually is required to get events on the road. You haven't.

My committment remains intact and your right - I'm no saint but have never claimed to be.

I hope you continue to enjoy your running wherever it may be.

FYI - I have just sent LCC a further revision plan for the marathon which will retain the city centre profile and integrity of the race (as I believe it should be retained).

Although I haven't been formally asked I have made a further suggestion which I hope will be given due consideration by LCC. Let's see what tomorrow brings.

Hopefully this will allow the event to go ahead after all. Before anyone comments can I add the last proposal put to me was not negotiable and no further options were to be considered. Clearly the fallout from the cancellation has led to a more considered approach to negotiation?

It's looking like the run went well, is growing in name and popularity, and organiser and Council would like it to continue,

However Organiser wants a new route, Council wants a new route, but both want different routes.

Compromise and fix it, not rocket science, you'll both look bigger than you look now.

By the way I don't think it's appropriate to throw insults about when something like this could disappear through petty decisions.

EKGO - I don't want a new route. I just want the one we have.

So you dig your heels in and that's that, no way to negotiate successfuly, but a sure way to fail,

In my Opinion of course

If you want to take financial responsibility for a race that has no future then you are welcome to take it on. There was no negotiation. I was told to run the event out of town and finish on Wirral. I don't believe that is in the long term interests of the event.

There was no alternative and there was no discussion.

Nurse Gladwys - there is nothing wrong with the course as it stands and there is no need to change it. The changes proposed were not in the interest of the event and it is my responsibility to ensure the event has a future. 

no more womens 10k ? that is sad it was one of my favourite races i had run 18 in a row and was feeling fed up as i have a serious injury so no running for months and i was sad that this would be the first time in 18 years that i couldnt do it i remember when this race was packed and loved to do it the first time i ran took an hour and 20 mins and then i got down to 47 mins i felt it encouraged women of all ages and sizes to have a go at running what a shame its gone .

The demise of a women-only event is nothing to shed a tear over.

The idea that it's OK to discriminate against 50% of the population is not right.

It may actually be illegal thanks to the Equality Act 2010.  You cannot discriminate when providing goods and services on the grounds of gender (and other protected characteristics).

AlanRothwell wrote (see)

Nick - for your information I have had several approaches about corporate buy-outs over the last year or so and I have turned them all down. I don't do this for money. I never have. I've opted not to consider selling out because I believe in the integrity of the events and do not want them turned into monster races which just create revenue.

I take great personal responsibility for what I deliver for runners in this city and that clearly extends to protecting the integrity of the marathon. There is a point where compromise after compromise becomes unacceptable and detrimental to the event.

Nick Windsor 4 wrote (see)

 Nobody really cares about the aesthetics of the route (Let's be honest) as long as we get a run

I disagree I wanted to do this event this year, it would mean me driving for 6 hours and a two night stay. Ive never been to Liverpool and was interested in seeing the place. So as a tourist I care about the aesthetics. I don't wont to run around some boring industrial suburb I can do that at home.

Alan I hope a compromise can be found.I salute you for standing up to the council.I know from personal experience that councils cannot see further than their nose.The real world, business and running doesnt compute in their eyes

Mmm I sense that a compromise is essential but both sides need to draw in their horns. As for Goldbeetle, I'd travel for the Marathon but I'll leave someone else to comment on the tourist value of the area

If wanted a fast marathon i would do Berlin or Abo if Liverpool is not worth a visit I will decide for myself. If a the marathon doesnt run through any good bits what the point?

At the risk of being treated to one of Alan moderate and well reasoned responses...

Wasn't the Liverpool Marathon put out to tender, probably under the EU rules for tendering?  If so as someone who has managed contracts and tenders I'm sure I'd be checking the public disclosure elements before continuning a debate in a public forum.  If not for this tender, then for others... Google is used by many to check things out.

And genuinely that's trying to be helpful - I don't do RunLiverpool/BTR events following experiences similar to Gladys (though via electronic comms rather than phone).

Paul

ps As an observation the Three Graces are better viewed from the opposite bank - you see their glory and composition...

Anyway did anyboby do the southport 10k today. what a fantastic event and the goody bag medal and t shirt says it all.