That link is very useful, Alan - thank you v much for posting it! I agree that a run out along the Golden Gate Bridge sounds a good idea, PhilPub, as it will mean I can easily do an out and back loop without getting lost, although I will curse you if that song does pop into my head as I hadn't thought of it until you mentioned it now (up to now I have been humming about flowers in my haaaaair!) I really appreciated your link Chomski. Another vote for the GG Bridge has definitely persuaded me to run it at least once!