Am I the first?
Hi all. Just posted on labral tear thread and then saw this...not sure which I am best suited to!
I was diagnosed with labral tear and impingement on the left hip 4 years ago. At the time I also had a Gilmore's groin issue and so had surgery on that rather than the hip and after 6 months of core work was able to get back running and not have the more intrusive hip surgery. Have to say that everything was great and have been running 100 milers, doing Ironmans and the like. However, the tear and impingement obviously do not repair themselves and so when I started to feel pain again a few weeks ago I started to fear the worst. Went to see a sports doc with lots of experience in hips and following an MRI she is referring me to a consultant but thinks I will certainly need the labral tear repaired and the impingement shaved.
I suppose I was expecting this but having started to search the net for others experiences I was horrified by the number of bad news stories. My doc told me to expect up to 4/5 months without running (conservative), which I can live with as I like to bike as well, and that ideally i should not be looking to run marathon distances and up in the first 12 months. I could also deal with this as long as I know I can get back to the ultra running at some point.
What are people's experiences of getting back to the longer distance racing following FAI and tear surgery? Am I crazy to be hoping that I can get back to running those distances.
Well Giggsy, sorry that you're in this club. I'm for the impingement shaving and labrum/cartilage repair surgery on 19 dec on right hip. A further worry is increasing pain over on the left hip (xray showed bony impingement but was largely asymptomatic at that time).
Used to run marathons, now have just been using exercise bike to keep a bit of fitness. Will be doing core every day now until the surgery!
Would love to get back to marathons but after the last 18 months i suspect ill have to lower my sights, will post as i go..Running pain free would be ace again!
How did it go, parklife? Yes, I went on the bike every day, if I could. I tried to do it twice a day from a week or two post-op.
Hi Giggster. Don't know about getting back to distance racing after the surgery but am interested in finding out. Impressed with your all your distance running. Never done any ultras but have done 7 marathons. I'd love to do another - not in 2013 but sometime the year after.
I've been doing a bit of running in the past week (I'm now 3 months post-op). Most runs are 1-3 miles. At the start of the week, I went very slow and stopped quite often to stretch and give the hips a rest; now I can run non-stop and at a comfortable pace that I'm surprisingly happy enough with at this stage (8-8:30 min miling). Hope to do a parkrun in January.
Ok, so the hip is not totally pain-free, but it's getting better and better the more I run. That may be because I'm so much better about doing my physio exercises when I know I can reward myself with a run. I saw the surgeon again last week - he's happy that the recently operated hip has settled down, after the sharp pains of 7 weeks ago. He's now being attentive to my complaints about the other side (operated a year ago), and agrees with me that it sounds like tendonitis. He has referred me for a scan, with a view to doing a cortisone injection.
Rebecca S - how was your injection and follow-up?
Happy Christmas everyone. Hope 2013 is a better one for those, like me, who have had a bad running year in 2012.
Hi pipes and everyone , happy christmas!
Pipes that is really positive that you can run 1-3 miles at that nice little pace, i'm sure you are loving it after all you've been thru. Just forget about marathons and the like for now.and enjoy that feeling, and a non-fast parkrun im sure will hit the spot.
Well, im sitting here exactly 1 week post-op. I really don't want to scud myself but i'm feeling relatively optimistic about the whole thing and that i made the right decision to have the op, and to go private - the most ostentious thiing ive ever done but if your'e going to empty your savings it may as well be for your health and happiness than anything else.
I felt the care i got was really top drawer. Very attentive professionals. On incision and sticking the camera in the surgeon diagnosed-
1. labral tear at chondrolabral junction anterosuperiorly
2. Chondral flap at chondrolabral junction anterosuperiorly
3. Cam-type impingement lesion
The following procedures were undertaken
Partial acetabular labrectomy
sealing of chondrolabral junction
excision of cam impingement lesion.
In laymans terms i believe there was a tear in the cartilage on or beside the labrum, and that the cartilage had been pulled off the bone a bit and was 'flapping'. There was also a bony abnormality on the, er, bone. So the surgeon went in and repaired the tear and using glue stuck the cartilage back on the bone, and shaved 3mm off the bone.
Pain wasn't too bad, i was reducing on painkillers by day 3-4, and could have almost done without any pkillers today. I was able to walk on both crutches the next morning My mobility and ROM has improved a little bit day on day, i can get about a little without any crutches at the mo, though with a bad limp - i am gen using both crutches.
I have a number of little exercises to do such as squeezing glutes, holding the bad leg in air, the pilates based transversus breathing exercise etc. Due to see my own physio tomorrow.
I went to see my GP 5 days post op and she was very surprised at how well i was doing at that time. She gave me a 3 wek sick line for work. Im not getting carried away, too many times over the past 18 months have i thought i'd turned a corner only for another hurdle to be put up, and i have a little concern about my other hip, which has been dianosed with FAI but isn't particularly painful - is the little bit of pain i feel there due to overcompensation or a build up of FAI symptoms in that hip??
Flight home was good fun, i got a friend to fly over and escort me home, apparently i was talking 'up the left (effects of tramadol) but the nice budget airline people were more than happy to put me on an earleir flight on one of the busiest travel days of the year.
Hows everyone getting on ?
I loved reading the detail in your post, parklife. You sound very positive about it all, which is brilliant. I hope your recovery continues to go really well. Your op, exercises, mobility, time off work all sound pretty smiliar to mine (except for the 'flapping'/ glue stick bit). How are you doing now? Have you been cycling? I continued to take ibuprofen for a few weeks, even after I felt I didn't need it anymore, as I was told it helped reduce the inflammation.
Sounds like you were lucky with the flight (and having a nice friend) as well!
I got a cc'd letter from the surgeon to my doc saying he was really pleased with the progress in my recently operated hip, after the little setback. It also named the pain in the left hip as iliopsoas tendonitis - good to have a name for it (although it's what I'd already suspected after googling symptoms). The scan will be an ultrasound and they should be able to do the injection at the same time, which is good.
Hi Pipes and everyone happy new year!
12 days post op. Had my first downer yesterday. I had been improving incrementally day on day, doing my exercises (which seemed like quite a lot), going about on crutches though often down to 1 crutch and sometimes none(walking about kitchen leaning onto worktop etc).
Got up yesterday morn and did my exercises, found the bridge exercise difficult and have always had diffs with hamstring stretch. I felt these 2 aggravated the operation site - the place where ive always had pain - and also started getting a little pain at the top of my adductor just below the great trochanter. Very offputting when youve had 12 'improving' days on the trot.
Anyway, took a couple of ibprofen (haven't had any painkillers in about a week), and rested. Wasn't as bad this morn, but luckily i had physio arranged today and feel much better for it. Basically, my adductors have been tightening due to more being asked of them and also due to me being overprotective of my right leg when i hobble on crutch. Time spent by physio massaging this area (was lovely) and then her moving leg out to angles to stretch the adductors and other muscles in that leg. Seems to have soothed it, and am to back off on the bridging.
A lesson ive learned - the rehab protocols are important but shouldn't be adhered to rigidly if your body is telling you something else. At times the exercises have seemed a little on the strenous side.
Have started exercise bike cycling - just 10 mins a day now to go up by 2 mins a day. After i get stitches out (in 2 days time) physio very keen for me to do swimming pool exercises next week.
Pipes - i note with interest your longer term marathon running hopes. Ive had interesting converstaions with my physio about this. My surgeon had told me i would be able to do marathons in the future and that i should be running at 4 months. However,my physio said that marathons should be out for me due to long term hip preservation needs - said that 'no physiotherpist' would recommend me to do marathons in the future. I pressed her (i have her head turned about this tbh) and she said shorter distance, mid tempo running would be possible, but this is 1 year away. she felt 5 miles x3 weekly would be my absolute upper limit and she was a little reluctant about this. However, she said that cycling, long distance, should be fine.
I'm a little gutted about this but after the past 18 months i guess ive been in a process of adjustment. I had been cycling 60 miles on a saturday (round strangford lough) and using the exercise bike so it looks like i may embrace this and join a cycling club, though 25 miles on a bike does not make me happy in the same way 5 miles running does. I guess getting back to parkrun would be good, just no sprint finishes. Am reading cycling books whilst laid up - just finished brad wiggins - they are good but just doesnt inspire me the way running does!
I have to say i'm minded to trust my physio over the surgeon on this issue of longer term aims. I have found this physio to be excellent, she sorted out groin problems before the hip prob was exposed, and she is very reassuring and grounds all her work in theory. Unlike a first diabolical physio i went to. I guess the surgeon could be strictly correct - its possible that i could be running in 4 months and could do a marathon in the medium term and he would be right and his surgery a success, but with little thought given to longer term needs or effect on my hips.
Hope everyone had a good xmas and all that, sorry it's been a while since I've posted but I have still been checking back on occasion...
Parklife - what you've had done is pretty much exactly the same as me (even the tear is in the same spot - anterosuperior chondrolabral junction - though I didn't have the flap issue). Glad to hear it went well - I take it you went with Richard VIllar in the end as the surgeon? Please remember that this is a marathon and not a sprint, and that overdoing it can be counterproductive at this stage. You are spot on with the rehab guidelines being just that - guidelines!! Everyone responds to this differently, I guess...
I don't know if you know how badly inflammed your joint was at the time of surgery (synovitis), but I would urge you to keep taking the anti-inflams as a precautionary measure for a little while yet as, with the benefit of hindsight, I think I came off mine too soon and basically further inflammed an already inflammed joint (the surgery adds to the inflammation, unsurprisingly), thus causing me the massive issues I've had post op.
Sounds like you have a clued up physio (equally as important as the surgeon selection, I think) and this is half the battle. The soft tissue massage is really important and it helped me immensely with hip flexor tendinitis. You are going to be on a rollercoaster with this for the next few months, but dig deep and you will get through it! Hope it continues to get better for you, and enjoy all the glute and core work!!
Pipes - really pleased that you are over that issue now and that things are heading in the right direction for you. From research, it seems that very few people get away from this op without some form of residual tendinitis (adductor/rectus femoris/psoas), but it does go eventually apparently...
As for me, I have made it back to front line duties after passing a fitness assessment (6.4 on the bleep test, so nothing too strenuous) last month and I feel like it continues to get better with each passing week (I am now 7.5 months post op). For me, the turning point was finding a clued up physio who could address my issues, comprising mostly of a weak core, poor glute activation and cranky hip flexors. It has been a hard slog with me putting in 2hrs + of rehab work each day - hard when you're working 12hr shifts etc - but it has been worth it. At the moment, I am not back to recreational running in any form, but use the elliptical and cycle and am still focusing on building up my lower limb strength to previous levels (mostly glute work, I am obsessed with them, they are key to hip issues it would seem!!) before I make a concerted effort with running. I could probably go back to it now, but I'm being cautious and am in no rush at the moment.
The jury's out about the long term prognosis until I go back to see the surgeon in the New Year, but I have resigned myself to the fact that I will probably not reattain my previous running form, but instead will be happy with a 'plod' every now and again... The way I see it is that to do so would only probably serve to accelerate the destruction of the joint over a prolonged period, and at the moment I am thrilled to be able to sit, walk, stand, cycle, drive, work and do all the normal things we take for granted without pain. So, for me, as much as I would like to go back to running sub 40 minute 10ks, the reward isn't worth the risk, if that makes sense?
Thanks for all the support I've had from people on here, and I wish you all the best for the New Year. Will let you know how I get on with my next appointment!!
Hi everyone and Happy New Year.
I saw Mr Conroy just before xmas, he has agreed to do the surgery, so hopefully it should come up around April.
The alternative was to just live with it, but I want to at least try something rather than do nothing, hope I have made the right decision.
How are you all doing, Pipes, sounds like you are doing well post op.
How are you doing this week, parklife? Have you been in the pool yet?
Dav0 - I'm inspired by your core work and will do my glute work even more religiously based on your recommendation. Thanks, too, for your reassurance that tendonitis is common after these operations - I do find that relieving. It has, strangely, eased up this week more than it has done since the op last December - I wonder whether the running is helping. I also wonder whether is would clear up completely without the injection. Hmmm...another decision to make.
I managed to run parkrun this morning in around 23 minutes. Loved it and felt no bad effects. I'll see how I feel tomorrow.
I hear what you are both saying, dav0 and parklife, about possibly having to settle for the occasional 'plods', but I (stupidly? short-sightedly?) don't think I can just to accept the possible risks to longer term health of the hip. Knowing me, I will probably push that little bit further/ harder, until I know for sure that I can't do (for example) another sub 40 10k. I won't step up too quickly, though, as I realise I have a lot of weaknesses to address first.
Rebecca - Good to hear that you and Mr Conroy have agreed on a course of action and hope surgery time comes quickly for you. Keep us posted.
Hello everyone and a happy New Year!! Let’s hope 2013 is the year we all get back to doing what we really want to do. It has been a while since I last posted, I have had a sneaky peak a couple of times but didn’t want to bore you all with the seemingly never-endingness of my situation. Pipes, I’m v impressed that you are back running, you must be so pleased that you are back doing the thing you love even if it isn’t quite at the speed you long for at the moment. I’m just a little bit jealous if I’m honest with you!!
So for an update – beware, it’s long, very long …. well for those that don’t know, I had a second hip arthroscopy on my right hip in April 2012 (the first was done in 2004) with Mr Villar and, reading back this thread, basically had the same done as Parklife (including the flap bit which, yes, they do apparently stick back to the bone using glue!!) It was in the same place as Parklife and Dav0 as well. The only difference was that my impingement was caused by a lump of fatty tissue as opposed to bone, so no bone shaving for me! Anyway, surgeon’s office pleased with progress at 6 week post op check-up but suggested more work was needed on glutes. So did more glutes exercise under guidance from physio. 2 weeks afterwards in late May got an intense ache in RHS groin to be followed by a less intense ache in LHS groin about a month after that.
Surgeon’s office determined it to be illiopsoas tendontitis and bursitis so I stopped all exercises for a period of about 4 months (as everything seemed to aggravate it) in the hope it would clear up – this included having a jab of steroid into the illiopsaos sheath at the end of July but made no difference to the pain levels. Desperation, in terms of both the level of pain, and an inability to sit down, sent me back to see the surgeon in mid-Sept and we agreed that I should try introducing some exercises for a couple of months, monitor the pain levels and if no improvement be booked in firstly, for a jab of steroid guided by xray directly into the bursa (at this stage I could quite clearly feel what felt like fluid sacs both sides which hurt more on flexion), and if still no change then a more major op which would remove the bursa and look at the same time to do a soas release if needed.
I have to say that the thought of more surgery just frightened me silly, not least the additional complications that could arise and also the logistical nightmare of looking after my 5 year old son whilst on crutches for a period of time again.
I had a particularly bad week in early November when I decided enough was enough so having spoke to Mr Villar’s office, sourced a new physio (I hadn’t seen my existing physio since June, deeming it to be pointless) who I started to see at the end of November. She’s taken a completely different approach paring everything back. Interesting, she doesn’t think the pain stems from the illiopsoas specifically, but is being caused by a severe muscular imbalance resulting from the two hip scopes, childbirth (I ran throughout my whole pregnancy) and long term back problems from 2 decades of competitive racket sports that were never resolved. She also identified a lateral pelvic tilt which is hopefully now corrected but only served to add to the imbalance. I have little glute functionality, non-existent core muscles which, along with the tilt, resulted in overloading the hip muscles / tendons causing the groin pain. Ramping up the glutes exercises was the straw that broke the camel’s back!
So Dav0, your post above is of great interest to me. It is great to hear that you are feeling better and your hip is feeling stronger as
Hello all, good to hear from everybody!
Dav0 - that is brilliant about you being able to get back to a normal life with your work and being pain free-congratulations because you bloody well suffered!. You must be made up about it. Good advice about the anti-inflams am now taking 400mg ibprofen after my main evening meal and its doing no harm, and also about rehab protocols. Yes i went with Dr Villar.
Bumble - very interesting reading as we both had the same surgeon, and very similar issues with FAI/labral tear. It hits home what you say about physio - I have a lot of confidence in my physio, I saw her previously for a number of sessions earlier in the year before my FAI was diagnosed and my pain was thought to be solely groin issues. Well it was partly groin issues caused by a poor core - poor transversus abdominus and poor right glute - this physio noticed these problems with a thorough first assesment and got work on them straight away teaching me pilates-based strenghthening exerises as well as glute work. The result was that 3 areas of groin pain reduced to 1 lingering area which eventually turned out to be the hip causing this. So, as well as sorting the groin, i hope that this work serves as a sort of 'prehab' to aid the FAI surgery recovery, and minimizes risk of bursitis etc. Going by Davo's overall story optimum physio really is very important.
What also strikes a chord about your story, Bumble, is your ineffectual first physiotherapist and how this has contributed to your problems, which the 2nd physio had to fix. I too had a useless first physiotherapist who was a bluffer and a bullshitter and didn't know anything about groins or hips, in hindsight. With being off work at the moment and having a little time I think I will do a separate thread on this website about this. Watch out for it!
And Pipes your progress is great! How I look forward to a return to parkrun though I will have to make to with slower times i think! Keep posting as I am interested in post op running abilities.
As for me, am wary of jinxing myself and am aware from this thread that problems may ensue post op, but am relatively pleased with how things have gone, at 18 day or 2.5 weeks post op. I have now largely dispensed with the crutches, and walk with a limp but a limp which i think has reduced slighly from yesterday.I can't say I am in pain, get the odd twang but generally OK. Get the odd twang in an adductor or two, and a sensation in my greater trochanter. Hope it settles further thus.
Pipes, I do 20 mins on exercise bike with no resistance, and today was my second day in the pool. Do simple walking in water, then do some stretching exercises (that i have thus far been doing on dry land), some holding on to side of pool and kicking exercises as per front crawl. I also go into the deep end, and without moving my legs, tread water to do a wee bit of CV and upper body. On dry land am contining with glute squeezing and other exercises.
I also continue with physio where they are happy enough but notice my adductors tightening, they massage and stretch these for me. God himself only knows what that 1st physio clown i went to would attempt to do.
My (good) left hip I have this feeling will end up being scoped.
Am reading a lot of cycling books, just finished 'the flying Scotsman' by Graeme Obree great story would recommend it. My head is pondering how to get that long distance endurance buzz I used to crave. I will pester my physio again tomorrow for her opinions on my future running limitations.
Just a question for people to mull over - so we have had this bit of bone jagging into labrum/ cartilage and destroying it. The bone is now gone, the cartilage repaired. Logic would dictate that no more damage can be done to the hip in this way as the bony per
Just a question for people to mull over - so we have had this bit of bone jagging into labrum/ cartilage and destroying it. The bone is now gone, the cartilage repaired. Logic would dictate that no more damage can be done to the hip in this way as the bony perpetrator has b
Quick question for you parklife .. you mentioned some groin issues you had in your post above caused by a poor core which, following exercises prescribed by your physio, reduced to just the pain from the labral tear. How long did it take for the pain to improve once you started these exercises and, also, how long before it disappeared completely? Didn't have a good day yesterday pain-wise so you get a bit fixated as to whether this damn groin pain is ever going to go. Maybe I'm being impatient (no change there then!) as the physio has said she expects it to be at least the middle of this year before I'll be able to run. Thanks.
ps glad to hear you think your recovery is going OK. Better to take it steady and take a bit longer to heal properly than try to do too much too soon and pay the price!!
Hi Bumble, i would say the groin pain diminished over a matter of weeks, getting rid of the pain in 2 groin areas, and leaving me with discomfort from what was then discovered to be labral tear/impingement. I think it would have been sessions of physio for approx 4-5 months back then, however, the first sessions the physio concentrated on getting rid of a lot of scar tissue that had formed around the adductors - through a 'frictioning' technique which was sensitive to have done - like a pinching quick massage on the adductors. It also included 3-4 sessions at the end where she tried grading me back to running but the little bit of discomfort persisted re labral.
I hadn't even heard of pilates or core back then, unbelievable as it is now, and so i was an absolute beginner when she came to teach me the transversus abdominus breathing/pilates and glute work which she methodically built up session after session. I didn't have the I.T or bursitis issues that you are having, though with this surgery theres always the risk.
I think your physio is being realistic, but in my case i could feel the groin gradually getting better, and could feel my core and glutes getting stronger. It was also reassuring for me to be under a physio who knew what she was talking about and who was very methodical and grounded all her work in theory, unlike the first timewaster i went to see. Really is worth setting aside time each day to religiously do the exercises, boring as they are. Its the thought of them which is boring, but once i got on with it was alright each day. And ask you physio about anti-inflams, but also if its middle of the year before you can run, can you use exercise bike and go swimming before this?
Good physio is essential, as i have learned.
OK, am 4 weeks post op tomorrow. Have a bit of a downer last 3 days.
I seem to have plateaued. I am recovering well from the incision/operation etc, every day I limp a little less.
However, the groin irritation/discomfort which I had pre-op and just wouoldnt go away and which was eventually said to be referred pain from labral tear/impingement, seems to have remained at exactly the same level.
Only since the incision pain has diminished have I been able to diminish this. This is worrying me a bit - has operation not been able to clear up the source of the pain, resulting in ongoing groin pain?
Alternatively, it could still all be in the process of healing post-op, I hope this is the case. Nonetheless, but a bit demoralising to have exactly the same low-level dull sensation and twinges of pain in exactly the same area as i did pre-op, while everything else improves. Worrying.
I will step up my ibprofen to 400mg x3 daily. I continue to use exercise bike 20 mins a day with slowly increasing resistance, and am in the pool walking around or running widths with hips just below water line. I might just ease the physical stuff.Also doing little exercises re glutes and core etc
Prob back to work monday.
Hi all, Parklife, sorry to hear you are still having pain post op, must be demoralising, hope it fixes itself and is just in the healing process as you say.
I am still waiting for my op date. For those of you who have had surgery, how long did it take before you went back to work, want to advise my employer of what it might be.
I can work from home and do so now when hip not so good, but not sure what docs/surgeon might advise (I realise we all repair at different rates) but just wandered how others felt post op and what you did.
Good advice Davo just what i needed toi wind my neck in! Have stopped the exercise bike and the swimming will give this a miss for a couple of days and just concentrate on glute and core exercises. With bumping up the anti-inflams today it all doesn't feel quite so angry.
Rebecca, I'm 4 weeks post op today and am considering to go back to work on Monday, but I also might wangle another week off. Still walking with a limp though discarded crutches over a week ago, i'm out and about in my job, both office based and on my feet.
Happy New Year everyone! Good to ctach up on everyones progress.
Parklife - i echo what Davo said, 4 weeks is still very early so don't be disheartened. It took me a good 4 months to really feel any difference, even now at 5 months things still aren't right; less painful but still the discomfort is there. Still get the stiffness and still have the lack of ROM but think its probably more the arthiritis.
Had some time out, not been to the gym or swam since early November after my shoulder impingement diagnosis. Had some physio and the symptoms have settled down. I have been doing a good bit of walking, did a good 5-6 mile hilly walk over christmas so keeping my fitness levels up that way.
Got my left hip arthroscopy secheduled for 11th February with Mr Conroy at Harrogate, pre-op on Friday. Get this one out the way and then I hope I can get back on my bike and in the pool!
Pipes - how is your recovery?
Davo - How are you doing?
Rebecca - any news on a date yet?
Hi Loverunning,so you are with Mr Conroy too.
I live in Leeds but there aren't any surgeons here that do this op.
No news on a date, when I saw him in Dec he said it would be 3 months, but his secretary tells me 4 so hopefully April time. Wishing you luck for Feb 11th!
How long did it take you to get a date?
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