A bit like sub-4 (but 15 minutes quicker)

Sub 3:45 Group

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23/02/2004 at 11:24
I got pb of 1.48 this weekend for the brighton half - this is my 1st race of this distance - training for FLM - strange thing is i run further than this on my long training runs yet this is the hardest run i've ever done by a long shot - any ideas why ?, Also with this time (which is a pb) is it realistic to think i can run a sub 4 hour marathon ?

Adam
23/02/2004 at 13:01
I've always found vaseline works better than micropore tape. Just have to make sure you use enough of it, unlike me yesterday.

Puggers, have you tried any of the anti-blister socks like twin skin or 1000 mile? I switched to them when I got my new shoes earlier this year. I was getting some really juicy blisters. But once I switched I haven't had another. (Bet I will now I've said that). Not the cheapest socks in the world but well worth it.
23/02/2004 at 15:54
Adam, the rough rule is: Take you're most recent 1/2, times it by 2 then add ten. So by my maths that gives you a 3:46 FLM. This is just a rough guide but as long as you get the miles in( at least 18 to 20 ) b4 hand it seems you'll have no probz bud.

Keep up d good work everybody

Woony
23/02/2004 at 15:57
thanks Woony - that's cheered me right up that has
24/02/2004 at 08:02
hi adam, 1.48 for your first 1/2m is pretty good, my best is 1.43 2 yrs ago, my last one in january for the york brass monkey was 1.49. If you're like me the reason why it was so much harder than a longer training run is that I can't seem to help running the first 2-3 miles too fast.In jan my first 3 miles were all between 7.30 and 7.45 and you pay the price later on. A good thing about the FLM is that you can't run too fast at the start as there are simply too many runners.

As long as you get in at least 3-4 runs of 20+ miles you should be getting towards 3.45 let alone sub 4.

good luck

pete
24/02/2004 at 09:43
Good morning and hello to all the newcomers

It's a low mileage week for me this week (aiming for a bout 30 miles I think). Sunday managed to cover those 24 miles in about 3 hours 27 again so although no faster than the week before quite pleased as it was really windy.

Fairly tough recovery run yesterday, 5 miles seemed like a long way. Off to the track this evening. Hopefully the low mileage will pay dividends with my speed work this week.

Slightly concerned how I'm going to get to Richmond Park this Sunday for the RW pacing run by public transport for 7:30!

What have you all got planned for today/this week?

24/02/2004 at 09:47
Puggers - I do the same as Swerve, have a couple of shoes on the go at the same time so blisters are in different places and get time to heal. Otherwise it's cushioning with plasters and stuff.

Big Bob - can you explain a bit more about what you were saying about time on your feet with Yasso 800s? Or is there somewhere on the web that explains the longer interval theory?
24/02/2004 at 11:57
Hi Donna

I'm new to the thread, from the sounds of it you'll find the 3.45 no problem. Doing a sprint sesh today, no track nearby so running laps round Ilkley Lido in the rain. It takes around 2 min a lap so I'm guessing 500/600 metres and I'll do 3 or 4 sets of 3 laps, 1 lap jog recovery. Not very good at speed, prefer the long slow runs, they seem to feel easier.

If you're doing 24 miles in 3.27 you're already there in terms of training.I'm aiming for 20-22 miles this saturday. There's a nice flat reservior near where I live that's 1.4 miles round so I can always tailor the distance to how I'm feeling or if the weathers too bad.

Is this your first FLM ?, if so put your name on the front of your T-shirt, they'll shout out your name all the way round, very handy for the last few miles

cheers


pete
24/02/2004 at 12:08
I'm back! I had a weekend away with no running at all. I managed a quick 5 miles yesterday inside 38 minutes. I'll do a steady 10 miles tonight in 1 Hour 20.

It's sort of difficult fitting in long runs at the moment as I have my first triathlon this weekend so I can't really go long this week. I'm aiming for about 30 miles in total this week (Monday - Friday) then after my triathlon fun this weekend I'll increase the distance for a big week next week.

Donna, you can read about Yasso 800's at:
Yasso’s

24/02/2004 at 13:22
PPB - Thanks for the link. It still doesn;t really explain why they work or why you need to take such a long recovery. Anyone know the science behind it?

Good luck with your triathlon this weekend. I do admire you taking on at traithlon and a marathon within a couple of months of each other!

Pete - Do I understand you to mean that you will be running 20 -22 miles round the same 1.4 mile course?!
24/02/2004 at 14:14
I read that same Yasso's link and while it does say the recoveries should last the same as the intervals it does not state this is the essential part of the session. I think it's okay to shorten the recovery of you can manage it. I cannot see the point of jogging extremely slow to make the recovery last longer.

Donna - I'm actually tackling a second triathlon just 3 weeks before London. But I'll worry about that one after I get the first Triathlon out of the way. By the way, congratulations on last weeks long run. You're well on course to cruise 3:45. I'll be very much in the unknown as I doubt I'll do any long runs beyond 20 miles due to a lack of time as well as the dodgy knee.
24/02/2004 at 14:34
3 weeks before? Are you mad? 20 mile runs are supposed to be long enougth though aren't they, in preparation? I just panic and want to rehearse before the event!
24/02/2004 at 14:42
PPB I like your style - good luck with the triathlons.

Donna, I don't think you have any need to panic based on your training to date. You've still got another 8 weeks, so just think what you could achieve - Paula R watch out!

While we're on the subject of madness, I think I forgot to tell you guys that I have a new baby (9 weeks old), so my training is interspersed with feeding/winding/changing nappies/not sleeping!!

24/02/2004 at 15:01
Wow Puggers. And I thought I was permanently tired!

Who's got a GB place, who's in from the ballot and who's got a club place?
24/02/2004 at 15:37
hi donna

you're right in that I do 20-22 miles round a 1.4 mile reservior. It may sound boring but it's not. The views out over the countryside are superb, on clear days you can see emsley moor transmitter over 20 miles away. Also there are loads of people walking their dogs, running, or just out for a stroll who chat asking how many laps today?, hows the training going? etc, they all know me pretty well as I've been using this route for 6-7 years.

Another big plus is that it's pretty flat and you can really pace yourself well even over 20+ miles. I keep a record on my HRM of the time for each lap plus max and average heart rate which gives me a good picture of how I'm doing. 12 min laps equals a 3.45 marathon, 10.40 laps equals a 1/2 marathon in 1.40. dead handy for practicing your race pace.

This is the first timne I've got in on the ballot, the last 3 years have all been GB places, I managed to raise just over £5,000 for epilepsy action (not in fancy dress though !!)



24/02/2004 at 16:50
Wow PB, £5k that's some going. Any tips seeing as I'm strugling to raise a decent amount of money? I've got a ballot place but would still like to raise as much as possible.

Donna, great going, 3.45 will be a breeze for you. I managed 22 miles on Sunday in 2hrs 58mins. Although the pace was alrignt I felt really drained at the end. The wind and the hills were a nightmare. Night off last night and speed work tonight. Looking out the window now it's chucking it down with rain. I can't wait. On the bright side though my MP3 player finally arrived today so I'm looking forward to trying it out tonight.

A friend of mine has just given me an application form for Trimpell 20 on 21st May. Anyone else doing it? I was planning a 23 miler that day anyway so a race might be better!
24/02/2004 at 17:08
is it really necessary to run these 20 mile plus distances if you seriously are looking at 3.45 ? - it's making me nervous as that's kind of my goal yet i've not yet exceeded 16 miles. Did the brighton half on sunday in 1.48 and that was a killer !!!
24/02/2004 at 17:25
Yes.




Well, maybe not - I suppose you could be one of those people who tolerates extreme pain very well!

You'll get round OK, but to get under 3:45 you'll really have to be able to keep performing after 3 hours, and that means training past 3 hours.

Long ones should be slow. Racing a half ought to kill you, as should racing any distance. If you had lots of miles left in you, you would have been slacking. To go long, you need to go slower, and there's really no advantage gained in getting quick times for the long run other than the confidence gained from having performed at somewhere near the level you'll need on marathon day.

So take it nice and easy - 9:00 pace, 9:30, maybe even 9:45, and just keep going through the pain. The ticker will be fine, the joints will hurt. It'll make the next one much easier.

Finally, a piece of advice that I think is extremely wise is not to get too hung up on a time for your first marathon. Play it conservatively and enjoy the day.
24/02/2004 at 17:38
thanks swerve, problem is, if you're a competitive guy you start thinking about just enjoying the day then before you know it you've got specific goals - just in your blood i guess. I intend only doing this once as i'm not sure my body could go through it again so it's important for me to give it my best shot.
24/02/2004 at 17:48
Yup, understand completely.

In which case, it's extra-important to prepare right. Get those long runs in!
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