Fuelling long runs without gels/powdered drinks

I'm not looking for a quick fix Tim, and I know that training for a marathon is neither easy nor quick.  I also appreciate that it's not just a physical journey but also a mental one and in order for me to cope with mental challenge I need to feel comfortable about how I'm running and how I'm fuelling those runs. 

I just do not function without breakfast and I do not function when hungry, it's the way my body works.  I have friends who cannot eat in the morning, it makes them feel ill and they are happy to run on empty until 10 or 11am before having something to eat.  That works for them, but not for me.  I have tried running on an empty tummy first thing in the morning and running longer runs without fuel but it doesn't work for me; getting dizzy and nearly passing out on the road is really not fun.  Everyone's body works in a different way and mine works differently to yours, but that doesn't make how often I need to take on board fuel or how my body reacts to being hungry wrong, it just makes it different.  If running on empty works for you then that's fine, but it doesn't work for me.

I currently have a bowl of porridge before I go out, but I am genuinely hungry around three hours later.  For you this wouldn't be a problem as you are near the end of your long run, but I could still have an hour or so to go with mine.  I just don't like the gels, I don't like the taste, the texture, the sweetness, nothing at all about them.  I'm not the sort of person who can consume something that I don't like and as there are alternatives I don't see why I should have to.   I'm not dismissing your advice, and I've already apologised for over reacting and said thank you.  I just needed some advice to help me through the training in a way that will work for me won't see me dreading it.   I will have enough struggles doing this and I just don't want fuelling to be another one.

TST - i used to use clifbloks (like jelly babies) or cliff bars (like flapjack) as alternatives to gels when i couldnt face taking a gel on.  they were easy to eat and never caused any drama with my stomach.  Also have you tried SIS isotonic gels (they are easy to quaff).  What about a handfull of dried apricots?

an alternative could be ice cream and beer....it fuelled eddie izzard on his multi marathons.  if you dont try, you dont know

i used to run with a 500ml sports drink and at least 2 gels on anything over 10m in training when i first started. I was convinced i needed it and it didnt do any harm so whats the problem.  But as i got stronger i wanted to stop my reliance and now dont use anything for training runs of 15m or lower.

If your body works so differently to everybody elses, being so special, then I can't see the point of wasting so much time and effort on posting your enquiry to what are mere humans.

Two-Stroke Tart wrote (see)

...

I currently have a bowl of porridge before I go out, but I am genuinely hungry around three hours later. 

...

I'm genuinely hungry when I wake up.

I just feel that you've missed the most important part of your training so far, which is to build up the mileage while taking on little energy and getting your body used to it.

Your body only works differently to everyone else's because you've trained it that way.

Are you eating well the rest of the week and the evening before you run? Are you on a diet? Dieting and marathon training are a bad idea. Are you drinking enough water during the week and on the run? Have you calculated how many calories you use on a run? Simple formula is cals = weight (kg) x Distance (km) x 1.1

I can understand you feeling hungry, I'm ravenous when I get in and will eat all afternoon, I use well over 2000cals on a run. There's no way I could consume anywhere near that many, nor could my body absorb that much. It's the dizzyness that is a worry.

Thanks for the suggestions Dean, and apricots was something that had crossed my mind.  Can't fuel it on beer though as I don't drink anymore, otherwise I would have fuelled it on champers! 

Tim, I eat well during the rest of the week as a rule and the dietician is happy overall that what I'm eating is fine for marathon training.  She would like me to eat some more carbs overall, which I'm attempting to do, but I don't really like bread, rice and pasta much so it's difficult.  I drink plenty of water all the time, with hardly any coffee, only a bit of tea (green, white or mint) and no alcohol so I'm not dehydrated.  My Garmin tells me how many calories I use on the run.

I was assuming that I would just need to top things up, as Cougie suggested earlier, with around 100 calories an hour so I'm not talking about going along constantly chomping.  This will be my one and only marathon, after that I'll be going back to shorter distances, so I just want to be sure I'll get round, properly fuelled and without it being something I need to worry about.

Two-Stroke Tart wrote (see

 

Perhaps before presuming what I'm up to you should take a little time to consider that not everyone spends half their waking life on here, and we may actually have other things to do with our lives so do not always respond quickly all the time..

Yeah you lot!

What a fricking hilarious read !! 

RicF wrote (see)

I once tried a diet (briefly) that involved an element of starvation for 9 days out of 10. The 10th day was an 'anything goes day'.

It was a great way to lose body fat...

I tried that diet and put weight on.  

Mind you, I thought the 10th day was starvation and the first nine days were "anything goes".  And I gave up after nine days anyway.

Tenjiso wrote (see)

RicF wrote (see)

I once tried a diet (briefly) that involved an element of starvation for 9 days out of 10. The 10th day was an 'anything goes day'.

It was a great way to lose body fat...

I tried that diet and put weight on.  

Mind you, I thought the 10th day was starvation and the first nine days were "anything goes".  And I gave up after nine days anyway.

 

My diet would be double what it is if I didn't keep an eye on it.

I went to New Zealand once for 17 days and returned 17lb's heavier. All day breakfasts, booze, peanut brownies and everything I could eat on the flight home.

Night Nurse wrote (see)

What a fricking hilarious read !! 

 

The read would probably continue in that vein if not for the OP posting a rational and sensible offering. Sort of nullifies the comedians does that.

Does anyone remember the guy complaining about the Police picking on him for going commando?

A classic thread for laughs.

Ric, from meeting you, I took you to be one of those chaps who'd struggle to put much weight or muscle on like me. Ectomorphs.

Great if you're a runner. Terrible if you're trying to get beefed up

ps Yep remember that chap Ric. He was obviously some kind of pervert intentionally trying to distress old women or something, as no copper is going to make you wear pants however much jiggle you have downstairs

My Ultra distance clubmate (international) and me go for post race warm downs at around 8 to 9 minute mile pace while stuffing our faces with bagels and chatting.

He developed this skill on account of running last year across America.

Me, because I'm a pig!

TST........

If i get too hot my body stops functioning too well.........Not sure why when everyone is still comfotably running.......I am in shorts and vest in winter in the snow and they are dressed up like snowmen,..........Now they could say that i should train up to cope with the heat or that the others should train up to run without tights and jumpers etc.......

but why should we not listen to our bodies and adapt........i couldn't run on empty.....I often have sausage sandwiches before training and more.......As i wasn't racing london last year ( Knee problems ) i had the full cooked breakfast in the hotel prior to the race....everyone was looking at me weird.......i also took all the sweets on offer as well as stopping for half an hour for some beers and sausages and cheese etc at mile 17.........in the end i had an enjoyable race and finished in 5:17 feeling good

Tenjiso wrote (see)

RicF wrote (see)

I once tried a diet (briefly) that involved an element of starvation for 9 days out of 10. The 10th day was an 'anything goes day'.

It was a great way to lose body fat...

I tried that diet and put weight on.  

Mind you, I thought the 10th day was starvation and the first nine days were "anything goes".  And I gave up after nine days anyway.

 

 great to see you are spreading that GSOH around the forum  Ten and that P&D isnt leaving you too worn out to laugh!!

 I heard that Chicken Tikka Massala with Pilau and Garlic Nan is good for anything after the 12 mile marker , It can be difficult to transport but there are a lot of RW helpers that may be of assistance on the day if you ask....maybe some Nacho's or a jumbo bag of popcorn.

You should give anything a go if it works for you ...don't listen to this lot on here taking the mick.

Sod the drinks table at the London Marathon.

This is where its at. Get in there.

Enjoy.

 From last years event at the 2 mile mark.

You never know 'When hunger may strike!'

cougie wrote (see)

Why do you have a dietician TST ? Is there something I've missed ?
If I was running all the way I don't think my tum could cope with sandwiches and sausage rolls. That's why I use gels. As you are run walking I think your tum may be able to cope with solid food better.

How long are your long runs now ?

I'm a recovering alcoholic Cougie.  It's common for addicts to have issues with food when they quit and as I was having problems my doctor felt it best to send me to see one for a while.  I've been seeing her since the summer and she's been very helpful, things are very much under control now.  I don't really want to eat sarnies and sausage rolls on the run, would be a bit too much even for run/walking!  I was just keen to see what other practical alternatives others have used and I'm grateful for the useful suggestions that people have made.  My long run on Saturday will be 9 miles, then 10 the following Saturday, dropping down to 6 for following week for recovery.  I'm following the plan in Marathon Running for Mortals as that will suit me and was one of the ones my running club coach recommended.  It schedules a longer, increasing mileage run one week and then a shorter one the following week, which is much less daunting for me and will allow the muscles in my knee to recover much better.

seren nos wrote (see)

If i get too hot my body stops functioning too well.........Not sure why when everyone is still comfotably running.......I am in shorts and vest in winter in the snow and they are dressed up like snowmen,..........Now they could say that i should train up to cope with the heat or that the others should train up to run without tights and jumpers etc.......

but why should we not listen to our bodies and adapt........i couldn't run on empty.....I often have sausage sandwiches before training and more.......As i wasn't racing london last year ( Knee problems ) i had the full cooked breakfast in the hotel prior to the race....everyone was looking at me weird.......i also took all the sweets on offer as well as stopping for half an hour for some beers and sausages and cheese etc at mile 17.........in the end i had an enjoyable race and finished in 5:17 feeling good

lol Seren, I would be one of the ones dressed up as a snowman!  I feel the cold quickly from years of being a chef in hot kitchens and my body never seemed to adapt back when I stopped doing it.  I always marvel at the ones in shorts and vests while I'm all wrapped up!   Sounds like you had an amazing race last year, I'm tempted by the idea of sausages and cheese at mile 17 now!

TimR wrote (see)

I would follow your dietician's advice. Eating more carbs may mean that your glycogen stores are fully charged before you run. Maybe you're running them down during the week.

What sort of pace are you running the run parts at? It may be that they're a bit too quick.

I do eat a fair amount of carbs and have them at all main meals, it's just she feels that with the amount of training involved it would be good to try and increase them for the next few months.&n

Two-Stroke Tart wrote (see)

I do eat a fair amount of carbs and have them at all main meals, it's just she feels that with the amount of training involved it would be good to try and increase them for the next few months.&n

Which is pretty much the crux. You're still very early in your training 10miles although it may seem a long way at the moment isn't a great distance in the grand scheme of things. You've got a lot of training ahead of you and your body WILL adapt. You're doing things the right way. Just make sure that the running part of your walk/run training is done slowly. At the pace that you could hold a conversation at. That way you will use less of your Glycogen/carb reserves and more of your fat reserves and probably won't find you need.to fuel on the run.

Good luck.