Paris marathon 2013 here we go! A.W's Sub 3 attempt!

Asics Target 26.2 PB Hunter A.W

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24/02/2013 at 20:36

Wow, great running AW. Quality finish to the 22m. Looking at your schedule i see you are down for either 'Rest' or '5m' tomorrow. With a session like today what do you expect to do tomorrow? I personally find I always need a day off or light cross training  only the day after a long LSR (+18m). This said everyone is different and I'm some way off your pre-marathon training base.

While still nursing a tight hamstring my week's tally improved to 40.5m (50m planned) with an general aerobic (8mm+ pace) 8m yesterday and a slow 20.5m today. I suspect I've got another week of saunas, swimiming and stretching ahead with Silverstone Half on Sunday. I planned to race this flat out but suspect I might have to lower my expectations as at the moment even mara pace feels like abit of a gamble.  



Edited: 24/02/2013 at 20:38
24/02/2013 at 21:05
Good that you've still got a fair bit done despite the hammy AndyV, nice 20.5 today too. Keep up the stretching!!! Hopefully by Silverstone it will have eased for you.

I always like to do a 5 miles easy on Monday rather than rest. I do this for two reasons, first I find it helps loosen me up after the long run ready for the Tuesday speed work. Secondly I like a rest day after all the hard sessions in the week so I'm a bit fresher for all the miles at the weekend, I find a day off works better for me after fast running than a recovery run.

It seems to work for me that way round.
24/02/2013 at 21:38

Good 22 mile run AW, you must hve felt you were really holding back with the brakes on for most of that! I@ve not treid that Goodness Shakes drink, I tend to use the SIS recovery drink adn make it up before i go and keep it in the fridge.

20 miles todya for me in 2.34.19 with a negative split of about 4/5 minutes. Tired to keep it easy paced first half, then got down to low 7.30's and then 3 miles at 7.10 pace. Please to have got the first 20 miler out of the way. I'm the same with recovery runs, I like doing them on a Monday at an easy pace.

Not a bad mileage total for the week Andy (good to get the 20 miler in), although I guess you'd be happier with 50 miles. Take it easier on Sunday at Silverstone with the hamstring, a marathon paced run would be just as good an effort as a full on run and damaging it more?

Crikey Steve, 24 miles is an impressive mileage for a long run esp after the uncertain first 3 miles. I think a lot of people would have cut the run shorter.

25/02/2013 at 08:26

Andy if the tight hamstring persists get someone to look at your lower back, this is usually the cause of tights hamstrings and sooner rather than later so you don't get soft tissue changes accumulating.

25/02/2013 at 10:03

Awesome 22 miler AW after a full on week of training.   You are in great shape on both speed and endurance.

E'burgh is 7 weeks after Paris so last week was only wk 3 for me but given I have 3 duathlons in the build up I wanted to get a really solid endurance week in and whilst speed work suffered as tired from biking I was really pleased overall to get in about 11 hours of cycling along with about 65 miles of running including a 22 miler.  Found on the long run my legs/buttocks got cold towards the end and I couldn't imagine cranking it up as you did.   Well done again!


25/02/2013 at 11:33
Denis Duret wrote (see)
I am using Torq recovery which has 22g of protein and 61g of carbohydrate per serving. So it would make sense to have my lunch a bit later (or have half recovery drink). Thanks for your help.


A.W wrote (see)

A very interesting day at the fitness assessment today. I also got a nice surprise when I got home, a delivery waiting for me which turned out to be my prize for finishing 2nd in the 10k at Dorney! A very nice set of Scott sunglasses, very exciting getting my first running prize!

I wont put everyone to sleep with all the results of the fitness assessment, but I'll summarise the outcome.

I have actually had a fitness test done before in September so it will be a good chance to see what progress there has been. Today's test was conducted on a bike and was sub maximal, so they only took me to 85% of my max and then from that they work out the V02 max etc. The previous test I had was on a treadmill and was a test to failure, so it was an interesting comparison for me.

They did some body composition first, my body fat was 6.4%, last time I had this done it was 10.5% so good progress there. My Vo2 max came out at 54.3 mL/kg/min, in the previous test it was 60.01. From what I was told I think this was slightly lower as the test was conducted on a bike where as when I had it done before it was on a treadmill. I was told this was a very good level to have reached and the doctor that was with us hadn't seen any one get a reading that high so can't be too bad!?

I will get a more detailed report through in a few days, but I did get a basic idea of a few other areas of the test. My lung function is well above average, normal is about 80% and mine came in at 112%. And my efficiency at delivering oxygen is also well above average, meaning I hold a lower heart rate while working hard.

The one disappointing thing was that in the matabolic efficiency test, I started to burn carbs quite quickly as the intensity increased. However I was told that this was more than likely because I don't ever use a bike and I'm using my muscles differently to when I run so if it were a treadmill test I would probably find I burn more fat for longer before I start to use carbs.

It will be interesting to get the full report so I can compare the two tests properly, and hopefully be able to see what progression there has been.


You can not compare a VO2 on bike versus treadmill so don't read too much into this - not only are you trained in one over the other one is also weight supported (bike) and one is not, so very different sports and muscle groups and one was to sub max and one was to failure. In biking you will nearly always hit the wall before running (or as cyclists call it "bonking" ). You are using less muscles group in cycling so often the thigh muscles are depleted (your thighs can not take carbs stored in your arms & use them so once carbs depleted in thighs you are going to start fatiguing). I also agree with your efficiently on the bike may be quite poor compared to running hence energy use. So all in all these are really good results.

There is some thought but not main stream that fatigue is caused via the brain not  by carb depletion but I think research will show that central fatigue will of course play a role but fuel depletion will always be there as the main contender (thought

25/02/2013 at 11:36

thought I would throw that into the mix!).

Denis Duret- that is a real endurance recovery drink so you could actually wait up to 2 hours until lunch but no longer.

25/02/2013 at 14:39

Nice 20 KR, good progression for the second half and a strong finish.

That's a fair few hours your putting in Nutterman, you must be doing around the 20 hour mark with the running and cycling combined?! You certainly should have a good solid base of endurance from those hours.

Thanks Ruth, it seems strange to me that they don't make the tests specific to what you do. Surely it cant be that much of a problem to have a treadmill and a bike and just use whichever is more suitable? I'm guessing that if I were to do a treadmill test my VO2 would probably be higher than the last time I did a treadmill test back in September.

25/02/2013 at 15:02

Nothing special to report from today's run, legs were feeling ok and not overly aching like my calves were after last weeks long run. I actually found it a bit easier to run a bit faster, it seemed like more effort to run slower for some reason!?

I ran a little bit over distance today, mostly because I had to go somewhere and it was easier to run there. 7 miles in total for today at around 7.30 a mile.

25/02/2013 at 22:09
Great running especially the LR, you must be very chuffed. KR nice work there too for your first 20 of the campaign

My week was huge last week with 117M but I am loving it. Managed a good tempo today 5 out in 7's with the wind then returned at 5:50's against so speed hasn't suffered unduly. I'm off to Poland for the week so seeking some training routes
26/02/2013 at 10:12

117 is impressive Choisty!

well done on the 7 yesterday AW - I managed just one mile and a hour's cycling

26/02/2013 at 14:26

Big week Choisty, nice one. Have you been running many 100+ weeks in your build up? Were you running those sort of miles last year?

Do you use Monday as a rest day or easy day too Steve?

26/02/2013 at 14:37

I was a little apprehensive before today's 400's, the last time I did them was when we had lots of snow and following the session I started having my tendinitis problems in my foot. So was hoping this kind of fast session wouldn't set it off again.

It was a good session, and there doesn't seem to be any sort of reaction from my foot. Hopefully that's all behind me now, and it will keep improving as it has been.

I felt really good today, and feel I'm having a good spell of training. My legs had plenty of go in them and I managed quicker reps than I did the last time I did 400's and recovered quicker also.

Total of 9 miles today in 1.06.15 with 16 x 400's starting every 2 minutes.

Splits from today - 1.14, 1.16, 1.12, 1.16, 1.13, 1.08, 1.15, 1.14, 1.17, 1.13, 1.13, 1.16, 1.14, 1.19, 1.13, 1.16.

Maybe not the most consistent reps, but I'm happy with them.

26/02/2013 at 14:49

very good  reps - apart from the pacing! presume not on track though which are probably better to monitor speed and ensure consistency.


Yes I Usually have an easy Monday though normally run more than a mile but more needed after 24 Sunday

26/02/2013 at 16:47

Yep your right Steve, not on a track so difficult to get consistency in distance. I think my effort was pretty consistent though, and still an improvement in pace on the last lot of 400's.

26/02/2013 at 21:51
AW good reps 400s are hard for marathon runners and a 68 is v impressive, I always dread that session.

I built up to the long week with a 96 & 92 and last year my max was 97 by mistake should been 82 but I just ran extra without thinking!

I like Mondays for tempo but I do my long run on Saturday with rest Sunday

Today was 10 easy in 1:08 feeling fresh
26/02/2013 at 23:02

Very good mileage Choisty. I don't intend going over 80 a week this campaign.

I also did the 16 x 400s but a lot, lot slower than AW though on the track though last one was 10 seconds quicker than the first 15.


26/02/2013 at 23:29

Great session AW and very consistantly fast!

Nice track session Steve.

That's a big weekly mileage Choisty - don;t know howyou cram it in. But I know where ther is a will there is always a way.

10 miles tonight with 5 x 1 mile reps round the local park in 6.12, 6.08, 6.05, 6.04 & 6.00. The park is very open and the cross wind seemed to be in my face for most of it.

27/02/2013 at 06:55

I think that 68 was probably short Choisty, I'm not sure I could have pulled one that quick out the bag in the middle of the session!? Big few weeks for you.

Nice session too Steve, the biggest factor in me not getting to the track more often is work (I work a lot of evenings) and I find I train better in the morning. I also know the later I leave it in the day to train, the more obstacles there are and the less likely I am to get my training done.

Good reps KR, the one element I really dont like is wind! Its funny how whichever way you run it seems to blow in your face!!!!

27/02/2013 at 21:08

Just a quick post of todays run. Been a monster of a day, soooo busy! Had to combine my run with nipping home to give my dogs a walk. So ran a loop home, walked/ran my dogs then ran the 3 miles back to work!

12 miles total at 7.11 a mile, so just over 1.26 for the run. A good run, legs took a couple of miles to wake up, but comfortable enough.

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