RW Forum Six - Sub 3:30

Minni v Dubai Dave

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22/11/2012 at 08:01

FRC - ironman training, so yes, a great deal of biking and a bit of swimming. It's more time-efficient to concentrate on the running, but obviously better for recovery to do other stuff. The running sessions were reasonably good quality - no recovery runs - so a bit like Furman.

22/11/2012 at 08:20
FRC - 3x20 for a first marathon? Slave driver! Seriously though, I would be the first to say my preparation for 5/7 of the marathons I've done was stupid. The big improvements I've had along the way are from doing less silly things wrong rather than positively improving marathon performance through training - which is where most (I say most, cos I can't really include Daren... ) people here are, and where I'd like to be which is why I'm here for help and motivation!

Having said that, I do think there's something to be said for lower weekly mileage training for people who get aerobic fitness from other sports. I've always found running training plans daunting cos they are filled with just running, and lots of it. You can't cut out the key sessions (especially long runs), but I think there's benefits in switching some mileage for quality cross training, especially before you have a solid few years of that kind of training behind you. Will be interesting to see what more objective evidence says.

Carrot - calf isn't exploding any more, seems to have settled to low level localised mid calf pain. Its definitely telling me to see a physio now.

DD - I'm back to imagining you being brought G&Ts by the pool by the domestic help...
22/11/2012 at 08:58

DD: what distance are you racing tomorrow?

Wow, this will be quite an exciting weekend for the thread

DD tomorrow, Bro and Barry with their respective marathons and of course Daren going for an 8X.XX time at Norwich

Will get my run in early on Sunday and then settle on the sofa for a bit of stalking

Chickened out of running this morning. Gale force winds and torrential rain. Bah. Hope it'll blow itself out during the day so I can do an hour or so tonight.

22/11/2012 at 09:09

Early doors on the treadmill today as I know I can't get out at lunchtime. 7 miles steady.

FRC - I wanna see the special picture for Bro ...or are you saving it up for tomorrow? I agree with you, this is a really special weekend for her...can't wait to catch up with the result on Sunday.  For Barry too

Daren - the forecast for Norwich is even worse now.  Going to be very windy with heavy rain. And although the temperature doesn't look too bad (11 degrees) you can bet the wind will make it feel cold. Pretty much a repeat of last year. I think I might rule out a PB attempt and have a new goal just to survive the day

Dubai Dave    pirate
22/11/2012 at 09:38

Chick: Olympic Tri swim 1.5K, cycle 40k, run 10K

22/11/2012 at 09:48

Thanks everyone for the advice on garmin display.  I'm going with time, average lap time, current lap pace and current lap time. Might set up average overall pace on screen two just in case I lose it completely and need to revert to garmin rather than manual lapping. 

Daren, Spoons and Free- I hope the weather cooperates in Norwich.

KFC- sounds like there's a lot of room for improvement which is nice to know.  Many pbs to come I think. Glad the calf has stopped exploding!

Carrot wrote (see)

Have you a race strategy, set off a bit slower to warm up for a few KMs? Go out at race pace and maintain it?

Carrot- I usually try to hit my target pace and stay there.  I know starting slower is a good idea but I think I would get nervous running below my target pace. If there's anything left in the tank in the last 6-8 miles I'll try to push it.

FRC- Yeah, where is my picture??? Not sure about a 4 week taper, I would go completely mental. Thanks for the link.  I had a look at something similar before but I think I'd rather keep it simple. I had a wrist band with splits printed in Copenhagen and almost wiped out over a road cone trying to see what it said. I think I'll stick to manual lapping.

I don't think there any any stalking options for San Sebastian and I'm not sure about internet access in the hotel. My phone has been playing up as well so don't know if I will be able to get online.  I'll keep Minni updated by text however and she can pass on the news.

5m done with strides this morning. 

 

22/11/2012 at 10:16

Hello Joddly  

DD - single parent with domestic help?   Don't think that's quite the same...

FRC - 4 week taper?  How did that work?  I know some camps (Yellings I think) we're talking last year about the 2-3-1 taper (less-more-less) type but don't remember anything about 4 weeks.

I quite enjoyed the turbo last night - its ages since I've been on.

 

 

22/11/2012 at 10:19
Picture is coming. I'm away though, only on my iPad.

Is it just IMG around the pic URL ?

Good luck Dubai Dave.

4 week taper not for everyone, lower mileage people maybe. Not Brol !
22/11/2012 at 10:29

FRC - you've lost me there with techno-speak. I can only do picture links from my PC!

The Yelling camp taper is also the Martin Yelling inverse taper from MT.  So you back off a bit, then have a harder week, then back right down.  To be honest I don't think it makes much difference whether you go for 2 or 3 weeks (or even 4 maybe!) - it's everything you do before that that will determine your fate (IMHO of course!)

22/11/2012 at 10:29

I would have thought lower mileage would warrant a shorter taper rather than a longer one.

22/11/2012 at 10:51

Hmmm so I've done the Yelling inverse taper without realising it! The fact that it has a name and someone thinks it's a good idea makes me feel better!

22/11/2012 at 11:29

Bro- not long to go now , your taper whatever it is called is over .Rest rest and rest please.

FRC-congrats on being the 'most improved' which is no suprise here as you have produced a sequence of storming runs. I cant say I like 4 week tapers but then again I suppose thats what I had to do for my first marathon at FLM as I had knee pain and had to miss the last LR and hardly ran in the last week but my training had been done by then and did 3.26. The key is whats done in the 10-12 weeks beforethe last 4. By the way I like the calculater but wonder whether I have the concentration to run with such precision.I am getting better at it thanks to Minni

Barry-go and nail that sub 3.15 please!

Jodelly-hi and welcome aboard. Thats a great time on only 22 miles running  a week.Im waiting eagerly to see DDs marathon time based on his impressive speed work and mega cycling and consistent swimming. Thanks for the gadget suggestion

DD-you are looking very sharp at the moment .I reckon there may be more bling coming your way at that Olympic tri-good luck

KFC- I hate the idea of LRs but really enjoy them when I get out and do them and get upset when I have to curtail them say for injury or I meet someone I know and stop for a chat.I suppose thats why Im happy to do them. I think the rule of thumb is that  ideally for a comfortable marathon you should aim to get the last 5 LRs to total 200 miles. My approach is to get there a month early and in the last month try to do a couple more but add some speed or a few miles extra. I also cross trained -a couple of swims a week and a couple of spin sessions of about 20-30k .These replaced recovery and easy runs and were probably at a greater intensity than if I had run instead. I stopped cross training about a4-6 weeks before each marathon.

Chick-dont blame you for chickening out. I was going to do a LR tonight but have cahnged plans to a swim  lunchtime and TM run tonight.

Minni-I dont do enough bike work as my rear end tells me so whenever I do it. Did you suffer? Are you going to race this weekend?

22/11/2012 at 12:44

Forecast for Sunday - heavy rain and wind

22/11/2012 at 12:56
Joddly - Welcome to the mad house.

2old - I think you mean last 5 lsr's should total 100m ie 20m each, not 200m, shit you've have us doing 40m lsr's. That sounds more like O4S mara training plan.
22/11/2012 at 12:59

Ew forecast does look bad doesn't it. XC will be a swamp on Sunday. Not too bad for Bro in Spain thankfully.

I have a beast of a hangover today after the first Xmas party. Booze. Bah

22/11/2012 at 13:02

Freemers: didn't know you were racing too. And spoons as well?

Hope the weather forecast improves. It looks quite the same over here.

Right now it's blue skies and brilliant sunshine but of course I have no time today  to do a lunchtime run .

DD: crossing my fingers for your Tri tomorrow!

A 4 week taper would kill me. No way. 2 weeks is plenty, fanks

22/11/2012 at 13:23

Chick - yes, me and spoons too. But we'll be eating Daren's dust I expect . Originally thought I could get a PB and aim for around 1.33, but to be honest if it is that windy I'm doubtful unless miraculously it is behind us all the way which would require several shifts of wind direction. I'm just going to find someone big and wide to run behind

22/11/2012 at 13:35

Remember that Freemers always lies and claims she is going for a time 10 minutes slower than she actually plans to so if it all goes wrong she doesn't have to admit it

22/11/2012 at 13:38

Ant- ouch, hope you enjoyed the party.

DD- all the best for tomorrow.

Free- go for it, you never know!

I've just purchased a bottle of beetroot juice, not taking any chances. Minni- remind me, when am I supposed to have it?  Is it meant to be tomorrow, Sat and race day?

I'm meeting up with SSheep for dinner tonight, what a shame it will have to be sober!

22/11/2012 at 14:00
Start it today Brolish. Before TM I drank the bottle on Thur/Fri and Sat morning then hat a shot on Sat night and one on Sunday morning. Seemed to work for me.

Typical forecast for you uk racers this weekend.
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