RW Forum Six - Sub 3:30

Minni v Dubai Dave

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12/02/2013 at 15:06

Freemers - 4 x 1 mile is a tough workout that's why. 800s are easier I reckon. I did a few intervals at lunchtime, but only 2 x 1 mi @ 6:45s with 4 min interval. Will be bumping it up to 3 repeats next week. 

For XC. I wear these guys which are a nice compromise between trail shoe and spike:

12/02/2013 at 15:20

Freemers: Nice speedwork   I hate mile reps ...   Sorry to hear your long run was a bit rough. Just one of them things, but it's all miles in the bank!

Welcome Luca

Speed sheep: I know how frustrating it is to come back after a lay-off. See, today's run did already show improvement! Keep it up.

O4S: watch that cough! Did you ever get any decent feedback on those blood tests a while back? Or was it the standard answer that the docs always give when they have no clue what's wrong "you have a virus"

2oldnever wrote (see)


Shildon- don't listen to Simon , only a few very crazy ones run at those times. Tough guys need their sleep!


Minni wrote (see)


  I agree Zuvai.

Brol - my legs are still shattered after the weekend's efforts.  My calf is also niggling so I've decided to take a second rest day today.  Don't want to push my luck.     Nice MP work there. 

sensible decision to rest, Minni.

I'm feeling so much better today, thank god. TBH, I felt quite good last night and thought I could do a run but then my sensible head took over and I left it till this morning . In previous years I would have done the long run on the Sunday and then got really ill for a week or so. But, you live and learn.

12/02/2013 at 15:40

Chick: do you have a spare 'sensible' head that you could pass my way?  And yes - they have no idea and a virus is what they said [plus the usual, there is a lot of it about]. Sadly a cough like this a week before TM was what started the whole thing off.  

SS: appear to be missing the oranges, lemons and honey - but will try the remedy with the rest of the ingredients........

12/02/2013 at 15:44

O4S: no amount of sensible heads would help you, you complete nutter

12/02/2013 at 16:08

Ant - you're right. I have a tendency to choose the easy option which is why I like 800m or 1km reps....but I think for marathons you need to do mile reps as welI for the speed endurance. My strategy is alternate weeks for that session - let's see if I can keep that up for the next couple of months.

Chick - glad you're feeling better and have your sensible head on

I think it's pancake day today....anyone giving anything up for lent? Alcohol maybe?

12/02/2013 at 16:43

Pancake day ! I forgot.. thats what the lemons are for O4S.

Congrats to AA and Barry, cracking times.

Was lovely meeting simon & 2old at the 10k. Doesn't everyone have coffee and cakes after a race?

Congrats to 2old, the OH was 9 seconds over her target. Not happy, she got clipped at one point also which probably slowed her for a few minutes.
I told her 9 seconds is nothing, it sounds a little like your 21 seconds. Considering the mileage you did before - 20 miles on the Thursday (and since!), I thought it was a great time. Always remember your super 3:08 marathon time too.

Oh as mentioned at race, I think basing your time on Garmin splits costs vital seconds. I only ever do manual splits at each marker now, sub 40 is easy maths then, sub 4 min km. Some backup evidence for that, when 5 of us ran at Moel Famau, we all registered different distances from 12.9 to 13.5 miles - proved to me how inaccurate GPS is.

Carrot, nice to see you recovered.

Ant/ Simon the heavy weights question? I mentioned to Simon that I cross train twice a week, but one of those is a speed strength session, big weighted squats, deadlifts, lunges. I weigh same as I did last year - but more muscle on legs and arms, lost it other places.

O4S great report, that sounded immense. I like BA following from a respectful distance.

Mr Z, still no PM? I'll resend.


M.r Zuvai    pirate
12/02/2013 at 16:50

Apologies, i have responded

12/02/2013 at 18:55

thanks for all the welcomes guys!

Gazelle I wish... Im sort of following this RW sub 3:30 plan (, at least as far as the long runs go, but im a bit behind and having to catch up with it due to being out of action in january!

ill make sure i do a competitive half marathon in march to lay down a marker upon which i can set myself the right target for Brighton

12/02/2013 at 20:55

No pancakes here.

Freemers 0.25 mile recoveries is pretty tough for mile intervals I reckon, so I'm not surprised you didn't enjoy it as much!

Excellent session SSheep. I think tempo is my favourite pace when it all comes together. Actually that's not as daft as it sounds as 10 mile is my favourite race distance I think.

Mr Z I find not over-cooking MP quite difficult in training but acquiring the discipline is totally worth it. Just visualise how easy you want MP to feel for the first 15 miles of race day.

Hope you shake off the cough quickly O4S.

Cross training for me, with the required treadmil session to get the Febulous score up.

12/02/2013 at 21:40

Gazelle I will indeed keep up the lunges, going off how tired my glutes were feeling on Saturday I definitely have weak spots from just running with a weekly swim thrown in. So I will continue to lunge!

Freemers mile reps are the worst session, great paces off short recoveries especially with a long run and a progressive 10K already in your legs.  Re: Lent - I'm giving up injuries

Man eating mud and too cold to pick up cake!  You're really not selling these ultras to me O4S... you both must be gluttons for punishment!

Hows the legs today AA? Enjoy the DOMS, you ran damn fast to get that!  Do take it easy this week.

Nice commuting Bro, it must feel great getting into work knowing you've ticked off a quality session.

Sounds like you've done the right thing about the cold before it got worse Chick, it always pays to be sensible and nip these things in the bud.

12/02/2013 at 22:05

Evening. Coaching tonight. I made them do 10x800 

got back and did an hour of yoga and Pilates. Will swim in the morning if I can get up....

12/02/2013 at 22:24
Snowing too hard to fly this morning so took the chance to nip to town and get this weeks long run done - this week its cut back to 10M but starting to up the pace. Did 3M at about 8.30 then the rest at around 7.45-8 pace. Felt much more challenging than it needs to feel by race day, but fab to be doing it.

Hoping to catch a weather window this afternoon for some heli-hitching (ps - before you guys start thinking my lifestyle is as glam as DD's, I'm just taking full advantage of my cousins uber-cool heli-ski guide job... )
12/02/2013 at 22:30

Sounds like fun kfc.

I'm heading off to the track tomorrow - first time ever!  Very excited, but... my calf is sore.  Took today off.   Hoping its all better in the morning. 

The next xc is the day before my HM and after enjoying it so much on Saturday I figured I could probably run both if I chose, however, my sore calf is there as a reminder not to take too much for granted.

12/02/2013 at 23:41
Kfc - You haven't got any relations who own an Aston Martin dealership as well have you?
Heli-skiing is something I never managed, very jealous, and before you say anything Minni, yes helicopters were invented back then!

Minni - Have you got Tracy the Trout out on your calf?

Spoons - 10x800's, you b'tard, I bet they love you?

Chick - Are you snowed in yet?
13/02/2013 at 08:42

Luca -  Welcome,  don't do too much in trying to catch up, ramp up the long runs gently. Most important thing is too make it to the start line.

Brol -  Nice MP run.

SS -  Very good session.

Freemers - Nice mile reps.

Minni - Hope your calf is better, mine is still sore, worryingly its on the inside next to the shin which has caused me problems in the past. 

Managed 8 slow miles in Blackpool along the prom yesterday, calf was sort of ok when I got going but was giving grief again later in the day.  Mum still the same but trying her best to be positive, she went for a  appt last week but it seemed like the specialist was going though the motions.   I have never run for charity before but have decided due to mum's condition to run VLM for Parkinson's UK. I've set up a page on the website site link as follows www.virginmoneygiving/BarryBrierley   please do not feel obliged to donate,   but any donations will be appreciated.

Edited: 13/02/2013 at 08:45
13/02/2013 at 08:45

Spoons - and I bet you only let them have very short recoveries in those intervals

Weeble - trouble is when I'm running at lunchtime I have limited run time so tend to keep the recoveries shorter than perhaps I should.  I might switch them round to Fridays again in future when I work at home so can take a longer break without anyone seeing me!

Minni - yes, slap that dead fish on the calf straight away!

Rest day for me today. First day of lent so I'm giving up'll only last a day

13/02/2013 at 09:32

2Old- I wear adidas adizeros xt for xc (Gazelle won them for our team at the last year's TR). I really think it all depends on the terrain. Some of the xc courses have sections of stoney paths and it's very uncomfortable to run on them in spikes. Yes, if it's muddy or grassy spikes help but when the mud is up to your ankles (that would be most of them this season) I don't think it makes much difference, you will slip and slide no matter what. I just don't think that the benefit I get from them is worth the risk of being out of mara training for a couple of days when xc is not your main focus. Enjoy your recovery day today!

Free- nice mile intervals, they are tough!

Chick- glad to hear you're feeling better.

KFC- hope you enjoyed your heli-hitching yesterday. Why don't my cousins have nice jobs like that?

Minni- enjoy the track tonight, hope the calf is better today.

Barry- donation is on its way. All the best to you and your family.

14m MLR planned for tonight.

13/02/2013 at 10:26
Freemers wrote (see)

Spoons - and I bet you only let them have very short recoveries in those intervals

1 minutes is more than enough I thought....

2.5km swim this morning. Will go to gym tonight.

13/02/2013 at 10:53

Barry - inside next to the calf - could be the soleus? Or there is one of the peroneal muscles there.

Minni - watch out for that calf on the track. The bouncy surface can be quite hard on them. My recent achilles injury was done there post hard races.

With all these calf injuries still going on, I thought I'd share an exercise a physio in our running club shared with us recently.


13/02/2013 at 11:57

2old, I'm laughing!!  Yep, you're right, no thieving that session for me just yet.  Mind you, something to put on the back burner for a later day, I just think I'll adjust the pacing slightly 

Freemers, however, I'm liking the sound of your 4x1 mile as an option for me on Thursday.  I'll see how I feel.

Chick, yes, I can see I'm making progress already!  I guess it's just striking the right balance between pushing yourself and not overdoing it.  Really good decision on your part to go for the rest and get healthy again 

O4S, as long as you've got the key ingredients, that's all that matters!!  Hope you feel better soon.

FRC, please pass on my congrats to Mrs FRC.  Something for her to build from and she should be very proud of herself 

Weeble, I hope your TM session went well.  If it's any consolation, we totally missed out on the pancake malarky too - rubbish!

Carrot, probably a silly question, but what is your lunge regime?  I know, it's made up of lots of lunges  But could you let me know how many sets/reps etc. you're doing?  I also have weak glutes so am keen to build in simple things to my routine to help them out.

Minni/Barry, I hope your calves are OK.  Barry, yours sounds very much like mine.  My major injury last year, where it went from a niggle to excruciating and shooting pains down into my ankle over the course of about 4 runs, was a torn plantaris muscle which is a tiny muscle kind of in the middle of the leg between the gastroc and the soleus.  It presents as pain like you describe, and also massive muscle knotting higher up the calf as other muscles try and overcompensate.  The niggles I am having now are in the same place, but nowhere near like the pain I had before.  So I'm trying not to panic and it seems to have responded well to some stretching, icing and compression socks.

Barry, so sorry to hear about what you must be going through with your mother   I will definitely send you a donation when I get a moment to go onto your page.

Spoons, you are harsh!!!

Ant, loving the ankle shuffling!  It can do absolutely no harm to add into my strength training so many thanks for sharing that.

I did a spin session at lunchtime with the lovely new instructor , and have an MLR planned for later this evening of 8 miles.  Think I'll head to the beach and watch the sun go down 

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