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Carterusm with Spoons

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05/02/2013 at 21:32
carterusm wrote (see)

Spoons - you set me a tempo pace of 7:45. Silly question, but is it ok that my tempo runs are faster than the target you set me ??

Great tempo run indeed. Is it OK - yes. After Sunday's half let's have another look at paces as I suspect them might all get quicker

05/02/2013 at 21:35
carterusm wrote (see)
One thing I've found interesting since starting this training is how good I felt my long runs were before I started yet I'm struggling(ish) with them sometimes now. I never thought I would be quick but I'm surprised by the pace I am getting on my speed sessions. Hopefully it all comes together on race day !

Don't underestimate how tiring marathon training is. Mixing up speed work, long runs, tempo runs and a general high mileage takes it out of you. It's good that you are training on tired legs but remember to factor in recovery time too.

05/02/2013 at 21:51
Quicker ? Are you mad man ???!!
Ok, tomorrow morning will be a 5 mile easy run into work (reducing from 8-10) that will NOT be any quicker than 10:00 !
Thursday will be 3 x 1000 intervals at the track. Friday and Saturday rest days - as stated before, 2 days rest seems to work well for me before a race. Sunday is race day and I'm looking forward to putting my training so far to good use.
Target - 8:00 miles will get me under 1:45, 7:38 will get me under 1:40 ! Subject, of course, to how I feel on the day and possibly the weather conditions. I wonder.......
05/02/2013 at 22:36

Carter - getting exciting talking about possible race times. You will be fine. Looks to me like the training is coming together and you are putting some fine sessions in. Keep it up and go for it on Sunday.

05/02/2013 at 22:45

My tempo run tonight was not as good as my last few. It was very cold, windy and raining but that has become nornal running conditions so it was not that.

I just did not feel up for running tonight and struggled to get the legs moving fast. Maybe I was still feeling the effects of my 5 miles of MP in the LSR from Saturday. Maybe I am coming down with something as I felt tired all day today and strugggled to keep focussed in my afternoon meetings.

First 1.75 miles warm up at 8:57 min/mile

4 miles at 7:30 min/mile pace (my slowest tempo run but also my furthest)

2.25 miles cool down at 9:21 min/mile

7:30 min/mile is not a bad pace for 4 miles but it feels dissapointing which is silly as I was not feeling on top of my game and I knew it. The mind does funny things to us runners.  

There was a time when I would not have bothered even a short run if I felt less than 100%.


06/02/2013 at 05:37
Carl - bear in mind that we are targeting a similar marathon time. I don't know if you remember that Spoons set my tempo pace at 7:45 so your 'poor' tempo run of last night is still 15 seconds per mile better than that. Maybe its because you have had such cracking times before last nights run that you feel slightly disappointed ? I don't think you should because you are well on track in my opinion. We can't have perfect sessions all the time can we
06/02/2013 at 07:45

Carter - the reality is that for whatever reason my body was not up to it last night. As Spoons says marathon training is tiring and maybe I was just having one of those nights. As you say 7:30 is a good pace but funny how our minds begin to tell us that it is not as good as it could have been and then a reasonable effort turns into a crap session.

06/02/2013 at 08:47

Dreadful run for me this morning. Right at the very start I had the James Blunt song '3 wise men' in my head and I couldn't shake it away 

However, the run itself was ok - 5.34 miles @ 10:05 with splits of 9.59, 10.09, 9.58, 10.10, 9.59 and 10.40 (uphill & waiting at traffic lights). Fairly consistant pace and I only looked at my watch for the first 2 miles to check my pace

06/02/2013 at 08:48
Don't beat urself up Carl - marathon training is tiring! Still a v good session from where I'm sitting!
Carter I think you will surprise yourself on Sunday. No pressure!
Edited: 06/02/2013 at 08:52
06/02/2013 at 12:23

Carter - I reckon about 7:50 pace. Do your intervals tonight at Half Marathon pace - no quicker, no slower.

Carl - that's fine - don't worry. It can't always be easy

06/02/2013 at 12:32

Sod times, paces, nutrition etc. How the hell do I get that James Blunt song out my head ???

06/02/2013 at 12:47

I have to admit I don't know the song. Sounds like I don't want to either!

06/02/2013 at 13:06

Youtube it - but make sure youre not feeling low or sad when you listen to it, it might send you over the edge

06/02/2013 at 13:32
Ok gang, next topic for discussion - sports massages. Good thing or bad thing ? Too expensive ? Frequency ?
I had one last year and to say it hurt was an understatement. I didn't really feel a benefit to my running afterwards but that was before I was running 5 times a week, maybe it would help now ?
Anyone else had one and found it helped ?
06/02/2013 at 20:44

I have quite a lot. Mostly because my mate does it so it's cheap! I find one a month is really good. Helps to fix niggles before they turn into injuries. Different people seem to have different styles. Some are better than others. The more you have them the less they hurt.

06/02/2013 at 22:05


carterusm wrote (see)
Ok gang, next topic for discussion - sports massages. Good thing or bad thing ? Too expensive ? Frequency ?
I had one last year and to say it hurt was an understatement. I didn't really feel a benefit to my running afterwards but that was before I was running 5 times a week, maybe it would help now ?
Anyone else had one and found it helped ?

Depends if there's a happy ending?

06/02/2013 at 22:15

Seriously though, can't help out with that one Carter - never had one.

So - finally back out on the tarmac tonight for my usual Wednesday hill session - added in a tempo mile on the way back in to liven things up :

1.2 miles warm up @ 9.30 pace
1.2 miles of hill reps
0.5 mile recovery @ 9.30 pace
1 mile tempo @ 7.07 pace
0.5mile cool down @ 9.30 pace

Much more satisfying than treadmill running I have to say.

06/02/2013 at 22:20
Nice one Ricky, you really can't beat getting out on the road can you.

Spoons - would you recommend an 'all over leg massage' or just focus on one area each time ?
06/02/2013 at 22:29

Spoons - your advice has been spot on so far & very useful!

Here's another for you (and back on the topic of bonking) - I normally do a MLR late on a Sat afternoon at MP and then do my LSR the following Morn (Sun)..... do you think this increases my chance of bonking? Should I move the MLR to Friday (normally a rest day) and use Sat as rest day instead?

07/02/2013 at 07:16

Carter - I usually get legs, gluteus and lower back. Sometimes upper back too...

Good run there Ricky - I'm a big fan of mixing stuff up like that. 

Ricky - how long is the MLR? The answer is - if you're used to it and it works then it's fine. The more you increase your chance of bonking without actually bonking the better the training benefit. When I'm training I usually do something similar but the other way round with a LSR on the Sunday and a MLR on the Monday. When Carter starts his Ultra training he'll be doing back to back long runs on Sat and Sun. Running a long run on tired legs is perfect marathon training..... As long as you can finish the run!

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