RW Forum SIx – 3.30 – 4.00

Carterusm with Spoons

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25/03/2013 at 14:44

Hope the massage goes well Carter. I'm sure there is a mid of "taper madness going on on this thread too!" I developed phantom pains in my leg before Liverpool, but then...I've always been a little strange....

25/03/2013 at 15:00

Good merry morrow one and all. It seems it was a mixed bag for everybody this weekend.

Big G - Superb run there, smashed your PB out of sight.

Carl - I hope you turn the corner soon, ther is still plenty of time left to recover and perform well, at least it is affecting your taper rather than the core period of training.

Carter - Fingers crossed with the knee, I too would seek sanctuary in my old running shoes if I was in shoes

Spoons - It has to be great for you to be back at it again?

Ricky - Shame about the race mate, we  hope for better next weekend

Well due to the weather yesterday's Parkrun was cancelled, the idea of sending 20 runners careering down icy hills whilst I freeze my arse off standing watching didn't appeal to anyone. Big southern softies.

So instead I did my LSR and what a treat that was, I was planned for 18, was considering 20 but ended up doing 16, quite frankly at the end, and excuse the language please, pooped. i'm not usually bothered about the weather but I can honestly say i loathed every minute of it, We have been fortunate that the snow here has been quite light, in fact it seems not to want to land but just blow about in your face, and obviously like everywhere else it is cold and windy.

I think a combination of the wind, energy burnt keeping warm, a strong desire to get it over with and tension in my legs- the paths are clear but smattered with occassional ice here, neither fish nor fowl, I could cope better with a few inches of snow rather than watching every step and never really relaxing into my running. Having said all that my actual splits  and performance were pretty good. 

16 miles @ 8:55 average with the last 6 @ MP, this was much quicker than I intended but I did have a 15 minute break in the middle for a Parkrun meeting. So a bit of a random run but I'm glad I did it rather than hide beneath my duvet which put in a strong bid as an option I can tell you.

On another note I have spent the morning drawing up a training plan for Mrs. Oirish (at her request) who has entered two Half Marathons over the coming months and wants to go sub 2:00 which i think she is more than capable of, I haven't told her but I'm inching her towards a marathon next year  shhhhhhhhh




25/03/2013 at 20:43
I am slowly dying ......... at least that is what it feels like. The last 4 day have been up and down like a yoyo and I really don't know what I am going to do. Hard to know how I can consider embarking on 26.2 miles feeling thi bad today with no prospect of an end in sight.

Back to see the stupid quack again tomorrow to demand proper drugs not the non drugs they have me last night. Feel like I have lost a very important week.

Very frustrating .... Definitely inching towards this is not going to happen unless I want to do some long term health damage .... Am I being too over dramatic ???????????????????
25/03/2013 at 20:51

Hi Carl, was wondering when you'd chcek in with an update! This is so rubbish! You have put the miles in though, so just need to get well! When are you due to fly out? I bet you'll suddeny turn the corner and do brilliantly! Till then, just keep resting up I guess. The more you worry about these things, the more you convince yourself the marathon is not going to happen, but I think you still stand a really good chance, so chin up!

25/03/2013 at 21:01

Carter - stick with the old shoes for now. Don't run until you've had a massage tomorrow and see what he says.

Oirish - yep - great to start getting some miles in again. Nice long run. It was toughh out there. Get her signed up for a marathon

Carl - yes you're being overdramatic!!!

25/03/2013 at 21:09
Oirish - good to hear from you again !! Excellent run considering the poor weather. It's freezing here again today with a force 9 gale making it seem colder.

Carl - hang in there !

Spoons - I've resisted running for the last 3 days. This has resulted in me shovelling loads of food down me with copious amounts if magners. Feeling quite rubbish now. Going to have a beer......
25/03/2013 at 21:27

Carl  - I think we'll club together for one of those t-shirts for you: " KEEP CALM. I'M A RUNNER"
Sorry m8, it must be hard to be in your position but as everyone says you still have time to get better and run a great marathon. The hard yards are done.

Oirish - good LSR in the conditions ... I was much the same on Saturday - intended 22 & called it a day @ 18 .... running down a hill in what is usually an easy/fast mile straight into a gale and was genuinely one of the toughest miles of the run - felt like I was stopped. Really felt it in the legs all day Saturday & still felt a bit tired yesterday.

Carter - I would suggest also back into your old comfortable slippers and consider some treadmill running. Reason I suggest the treadmill is that my right knee has been giving some jip over last 2 weeks but every time I do a treadmill session instead of a road session it feels great during & afterwards. After the road session I always feel it a bit.

Anyway my sessions are a day ahead this week as I did my LSR on Saturday (rather than Sunday) to replace postponed HM. So tonight was Tempo Monday:

Ran a 6 mile session on the treadmill in 47:25 - first mile 9.30 pace last five miles tempo @ 7.35 pace. First treadmill session I've done that I actually kind of enjoyed. Feel strangely refreshed & energised after it - usually they knock the stuffing out of me!

25/03/2013 at 21:46
I hear all of you. I am really grateful for all the support.

And you know maybe I can be there.

If I can I will. Clearly this thing got a grip of me at the end of some hard training so I was fatigued, had been on planes across the pond as well which never are a good thing, and it was bloody cold so I must have got it wrong during one of my evening runs and picked up a chill.

It is funny as I have never been so desperate to run a marathon as I am this occasion.

So yes a KEEP CALM - I AM A RUNNER WITH TAPER MADNESS would go down well.

I will see the quack tomorrow and see where I go from there.
26/03/2013 at 11:38

CarL - You have the best part of two weeks to shake off your bug which is plenty of time, even if you can't run between then and now your fitness isn't going to deterioate significantly nor are your missed runs going to adversley affect your training, your taper is all about ticking over, resting and recovering energy levels. 

Stop worrying, nothing can be gained from stressing. I know it is easier said then done but keep it all in perspective. Your ill, you'll get better, you'll run, you'll get your finishers t-shirt 

Carter-See that's what I like to see, a man who knows what is needed in a moment of injury crisis - Magners and food, I follow a similar regime except I use mine preemptively to stave off injuries, I'm not saying because of the Magners i am not injured but if I am I certainly can't feel it.

Spoons - i reckon i could convince her to do Rome, Barcelona or Paris next year. There is nothing like slogging 26 miles to fuel the romance. Our hotel room would sound like a porn film soundtrack but that would just be me trying to climb in and out of the bath afterwards!

Like Ricky I felt quite tired yesterday which was a rest day and greatly appreciated it was too, 

26/03/2013 at 12:35
carterusm wrote (see)
Spoons - I've resisted running for the last 3 days. This has resulted in me shovelling loads of food down me with copious amounts if magners. Feeling quite rubbish now. Going to have a beer......

NOOOO!!!! The correct attitude when not running due to injury is to hit the gym, the pool or the bike. Plus eating less of course.


26/03/2013 at 12:36
oirisheyes wrote (see)

Our hotel room would sound like a porn film soundtrack but that would just be me trying to climb in and out of the bath afterwards! 


26/03/2013 at 14:02

Just had my sports massage. She recommended drinking as much Magners as possible 

So, just by standing there she could see that I over pronated in my left foot. This confirmed what I discovered when having my gait analysis last week so she was off to a good start. She got me to squat and apparently my knees were pointing off to the left which led her at this early stage to think that I was indeed having issues with my ITB on my left leg but also the aductors on my right leg. Upon discovering that I played golf for many years before my running career started she explained she explained that the gold swing could contribute to why my muscles were tight where they were.

She got down to the business of the massage and started on the glute, lightly at first and building up the pressure she was applying. Working around that area she moved on to the Piriformis muscle and this turned out to be the real culprit. I know this for a fact because it was at this stage I started crying. She also worked on my ITB and sciatic muscle (at the top of the calf just below the knee) as these were also very tight. On the other leg she worked my adductors which I didnt even know where tight, until she started poking around with them when they felt really tight.

I've been given some exercises to do at home along with the advice that I really should stretch after my runs, which I dont currently do.

No speed work or hills for a while and keep all my runs nice and easy for a while. She told me to leave it for 24 hours but I have plans for tomorrow night (almost ironically I'm visiting my mum in hospital who is having a hip replacement, maybe I could have her old one.....) so I will go for my next run on Thursday and see how it goes. I'm booked in for another massage at the end of next week.


26/03/2013 at 14:55

This all sounds luke steps in the right direction Carter! Who knows, maybe you'll be able to run faster now?!!

26/03/2013 at 17:00

Sounds OK Carter - does she think you can do long runs? i.e. 26.2 mile long runs?

26/03/2013 at 17:20
She said I should focus on building my endurance but slightly reduce my weekly mileage. I guess it's a case of getting out there and see how I get on. I'm booked in again next week where she said she can work a bit deeper if necessary.
26/03/2013 at 18:50

Carter - crying ? I thought everyone from up north was made of stronger stuff. Great news that you have a better understanding of the problem. Funny how the trained person can really make you suffer and tell you that it is all for your own good. I guess you need to follow her advice and go for easy runs without overstressing whatever muscle you have been stressing. Lowering the intensity will help. When were you due to start your taper ? If you are going for long LSR's i.e. 20 miles over the next 2 weekends, you might want to consider a few more massages to help with recovery. But I am no expert as I cannot even get rid of flu.

26/03/2013 at 19:24

Anyway, I have been back to the doctor this evening. Saw my doctor whom I trust. After examining me twice, she says that she is satisfied that I do not have a chest infection. It is probably a virus. That said my symptoms over the last few days are causing her slight concern. With this in mind and considering that she is aware that I am supposed to be running Paris (she has done my medical certificate 2 weeks ago at a whopping cost of £20), she is prescribing another course of different antibiotics for another week.

She is not saying do not run but advising me to be sensible. If I have not improved much by this weekend I think she would be telling me that I should not be running. If I have not improved by this weekend I will go MAD.

So you guys all think I can still do it.

My doctor did not rule it out.

My OH is telling me not to do it.

I want to do it. If I had an infection I would stop now. But a virus there might be a chance.

Loads more stress on top of me stressing about when I can go for a run.

Lets assume that I kick this in the next few days.

What training should I do between now and Paris. When do I settle on a race MP. Do I need to reign it in from the timings we debated a few weeks ago and go much slower to make sure I do not bonk at mile 16.

then there is the added pressure that my maraton was to be the first ......

26/03/2013 at 20:49

Carl - well obviously don't listen to your OH but of course make it SEEM like you are ARE listening etc etc... The Doc is still hopeful & we are all still hopeful too
If the worst happens and you don't get to Paris why don't you make a nice positive contingency / PLAN B? What about pencilling in a later Spring Marathon - heck why don't you join me in Limerick? Bank holiday weekend, bring the family, nice hotel - perfect weekend!

Carter - happy ending??? Seriously though great to hear you have a diagnosis which will help you manage around it & also get the right treatment. You have me worried now - I am also the worlds worst for not stretching post run... at best a I might do a few calf stretches. Tend to do more stretching pre-run.

Edited: 26/03/2013 at 20:52
26/03/2013 at 21:03

Anyhoooo - got out on the road at 5.30pm today and got my 10 ml MLR done devoid of any hi-vis gear in daylight. Dry, breezy but damn cold.

Ran it what I would describe as a steady pace - somewhere between HMP & MP I suppose.

Quite an undulating country route with some fun at 9 miles - a couple of local youths challenged me to a race to which I maturely responded to by outsprinting them

Averaged 8.17 pace with Avg HR of 149bpm which is well below tempo HR which tends to be 160+ so quite pleased with this run... felt nice and comfortable too. Splits:

9.07 (w/up); 8.56 (all uphill); 8.19; 8.17; 7.56; 8.08; 8.18; 8.20; 8.04; 7.39

26/03/2013 at 21:09
Carl - crying ? Me ? Nah. I have another session booked in for next Thursday and will possibly have one the week before Manchester. If the knee is ok when I resume running I think I will need 2 more LSRs which means a 2 week taper. Not sure what to do if the knee takes too much time to get better.

Ricky - I'm sure the knee will get better but obviously it's the length if time it will take to get better which is now coming into play. During this training plan there are 2 lessons I've learnt where I thought that I know best. 1) I need to fuel properly and start using gels on long runs 2) I do need to stretch as I'm not as indestructible as I thought I was. I won't tell you you should stretch but I would advise you that it's probably best if you do. Don't learn the hard way
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