RW Forum Six – Sub 3.30

Sarah Osbourne with Minni

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30/01/2013 at 23:11
Evening Sarah yes I have had a cracking run. I did my usual Wednesday route of 8 miles to our school and back. I felt really good right from the start. Last week I was heavy legged within the first hundred yards but today was brilliant. Theres a mile downhill then a two mile gentle climb before it goes flat and ends with the mile back up to our house. Average pace was 8.33, better than last week, and I did the last 4 miles at mara pace, with my hr staying just below 160 which is perfect for me.

I listened to marathon talk again, the training talk was spot on and Tonys Trials was about HR training and physiological assessment. There's a girl in our club who teaches spors science at the local poly I will ask her to guinea pig me for the students I think.

I'm not planning on racing without breakfast on Sunday, I don't think there's any gain at this stage, perhaps a little later when my runs are longer.
31/01/2013 at 17:36

Damn that child coughing in your face Sarah.  

I got my tempo run in last night with 4 miles at MP.  Ran on effort because of the wind and thought I might be a bit slow but bang on target for every mile, so feeling happy.  I also seem to have got my energy back, which is a good thing.

I hope you enjoy your club run tonight.  Its still a bit breezy here - what's it like down there?

I've got 20 miles to do on Sunday and going to run from here to the coast and time it to see my son play rugby.  Nice to do a point to point but the only problem is its hilly.   I feel as if I've earned some easier long ones in the next few weeks!


31/01/2013 at 21:51
Im so glad to hear that you had such a positive and successful run yesterday Mr P...its those that keep us going. What do you use to measure your HR. I have a belt with my watch but ive never used it as I thought that it might be too complicated and be uncomfortable. Do you think I would benefit from digging it out of the cupboard? Do you feel that it helps you?

That sounds really useful if she will use you as a guinea pig, you would learn so much from it (that you could share with us???? or is that being cheeky?)

Im already planning my breakfast for tomorrow...I havent got my usual at my parents : (

I know Minni, its terrible...touch wood no tonsillitis yet, hoping it never arrives but if it does, it waits until after my long run tomorrow!

Glad to hear that youve got your energy back and had another good run...with resistance!

I managed to go with the RC and really enjoyed it. Weve also organised the three peaks challenge which is quite exciting. It was really windy down here....luckily we were going steady anyway so it helped to make the run alittle more challenging.

I hope the winds dies down by sunday for you, a hilly 20 miles and a windy coast sounds tough. How long will you have to run it? I dont know if I could run somewhere and then stand around and not get a shower, would go so cold!

You certainly have earned some easier runs...more than me. Do you have any easy routes around where you live?
31/01/2013 at 22:02
Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

Week 5, (Day 31) Aim; club run, steady 6 miles

Tonight I met up with Maltby running club. It was lovely to see everyone and catch up on all the latest local running gossip. I initially went to a friends house first to plan our summer challenge (the national three peaks challenge) and then I ran down with her to the meeting point for the cub.

Due to it being dark alot of the runs around Maltby are out as most of them are on the tracks, fields and back lanes. Our run therefore consisted of running down from my friends house roughly for a mile and half, followed but a mile on a half on the flat, we then turned round and ran back, followed by a loop around a housing estate, half of which being down hill and the other half up hill. The wind seemed to be against us on the up hill parts which did make the run slightly tougher in places.

We did a total of 8.01 miles @ an average pace of 8:55 min/mls all on road. I was comfortable throughout and spent as much time exercising my jaw as I did my legs.

Tomorrow my plan is 20 miles. I was going to do this on my own around where my parents live mid day however my dad doesnt feel that it is safe, even though I was staying to the roads (hes worse than my OH). Luckily one of the runners I ran with today is hoping for 13 miles in the morning. Im going to run with her and then add 7 on at the end...well thats the plan anyway. She is alot slower than me so least this will make me take the first 13 miles steady, it also means that I will get to run some of my long run in the countryside away from everyday car fumes and pollution.
31/01/2013 at 22:58
Hello Sarah sounds like a good evening.

There is something really weird this week...another great run, this time with our group. I can't understand it, but joking apart I am trying to be more careful about what I eat at work in the day. Pasta again today with a sandwich.

We ran out towards the river, then doubled back up a short hill, then jogged over the bridge and did a loop around 4-500 metres before running to the next hill, slightly longer. Back over the river via another bridge, part of the old Chester half route, across the car park and up another hill to the racecourse. Then another downhill jog to the longest hill on the route, coincidentally part of the new Chester half route, then a muster at the top to recover. Down one street, a right turn then up the next one, and then a long downhill jog to a longish winding hill to complete the session. I really went for this one, I could hear my mate breathing down my neck so I put my foot down and I saw 5:32 on my garmin as I pulled up. A nice jog back to the start then. Total one hour and one minute for the session.

I realised that even eyeballs out over a few hundred yards I was running slower than Paula in her NY marathon win.

This has been the best week of this campaign, I don't really care about a "bad" long run, I know it will pass, but to get a Tempo run, a medium long run and a hill session done on three consecutive nights and still feel like I could go again is really encouraging.
01/02/2013 at 14:17

Sorry Sarah...heart rate monitor...I use mine all the time, but not in races as I would hate it when I was trying hard.  I think you should givi it a try.

01/02/2013 at 15:36
Afternoon Mr P, it was, it was just really nice to run with others for a change. I didnt hardly realise I was running to be honest.

Im glad that you had another good run too. It sounds like you had some friendly compitition to spur you on! I didnt realise that it was that hilly in Chester, I always think of it as being similar to york, but thinking back to the hen party I went on last year in Chester, I do recall at least one steep hill which was on one of the main streets. How far was your run yesterday? 5:32 min/mls...thats pretty fast, I dont think ive ever seen that sort of pace on my watch! I prescribe lots of pasta and other carbs for us both for the next 11 weeks if this is there effect!

Youve just made me remember how brilliant Paula Radcliffe is....I think she has too much negative press sometimes as people tend to dwell on the races that she has missed or not done as well in, rather than the races that she has won and records that she has broke!

Whats the plan for today, is it a rest day?

When I get back to york I will dig the HR monitor out and let chris read the instructions for me before I give it a go,
01/02/2013 at 16:07
Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

Week 5, (Day 32) Aim; 20 mile LSR

I wasnt sure how I would be this morning running 2 miles further than my last two long runs and after running a steady 8 miles last night (when normally I would rest the day before a long run), so I was pleasantly surprised when I succeeded in running 20.1 miles

I met my friend at 9:30 in Wickersley (Rotherham) only 14 hours after finishing my 8 miles last night. We set off down one of the main streets for roughly a mile before we turned off onto country lanes for the next 11 miles. This is somewhere we both couldnt have gone if we were on our own so it was nice for both of us to be running with somebody else to get away from the busy polluted roads. At mile 12 we ended up back on the Main Street that we had gone out on and spent the next two miles running down this and around a housing estate to make the milage up to 14 for my friend. The first 12 miles flew by due to having a distraction from running (talking).

At mile 14 I left my friend and ran 3 miles out and then back to make my run up to 20 miles.

The route that we took was really hilly. What we class as hills in York the people of Maltby and Wickersley laugh at. The first mile today was relatively flat but after that there were several steep hills that we ran up and inbetween them the roads were quite undulating. By mile 11 I could feel my quads which I dont normally do when running in york and on the treadmill. The paces we kept to for the fiirst 14 miles was between 8:30 - 9:30 min/mls depending on the inclines. I cant remember all the miles splits to write them up on here and dont have my PC to find them.

When I left my friend at mile 14, I ran down from Wickersly and in to Maltby. This was almost 2 miles down hill with the wind behind me. The only thing that seemed to slow me down was a few roads that I had to cross. I ran mile 15 at 8:05 min/ml and mile 16 at 7:51 min/ml. The next mile was roughly half on flat and half uphill, this I ran at 8:30 min/mls, I did struggle with this mile slightly but im not sure why. I was still on the pavement and the incline wasnt as bad as any of the others but I just didnt enjoy it. I wondered if it was more psychological with it being the last mile before I could turn round and head back to the finish.

Mile 18 was half down hill and then half on the flat but this time in to head on wind. I ran this mile at 7:51 min/mls and found the breeze quite cooling and refreshing.

Mile 19 was uphill, still into the head on wind but I managed to keep a pace of 8:22 min/mls

My last mile, mile 20 was up one of the steepest hills of the day, into the wind, at a pace of 8:40 min/mls

My average pace for the full 20.1 miles was 8:47 min/mls.

I was ready to stop by the end but after doing a short walk around the block and some stretches, my legs have felt surprisingly ok so im pleasantly surprised and happy with my achievements today. My average pace has been slightly slower than usual but bearing in mind I ran last night, ran further and ran up some challenging hills im delighted. And it means I have actually ran my LSR slow, like im supposed to!
01/02/2013 at 19:13

Hi Sarah.

Excellent running!  I think if your training continues in such a positive way and everything goes right on the day you're going to come away with a nice pb come marathon day!  I'm impressed with your paces and how easy you're finding them.

Running my end has been consistent but still not hitting the mileage I would like.  I feel okay though and am looking to try and get some extra miles in over the next few weeks. 

I'm sure you've said, but I've forgotten  Have you got any races planned in the next few weeks?

01/02/2013 at 20:40

Yes today is a rest day, I will run tomorrow as I have to drop a car off at the garage, then do the race on Sunday if the weather's good.

Mrs P is aching all over after Netball but she's going back next week


01/02/2013 at 23:07
Sarah - nice run with the club last night and sensible to be talking and not worrying about pace so you were ready for today.

Today - what a great 20 miles! Perfect pacing throughout and I agree that the mile you found hard was probably more in your head than your legs. Our heads can play cruel tricks sometimes!

How do you feel tonight? I sometimes find that a long run or hard session can hit me more a few days later.

I think it's two weeks till your half?

I'm curious why there are lots of places you won't run on your own? You said about the lanes today being one of those places. Is it safety that worries you, or traffic? I used to hate running the roads myself but would go for hours off road. This was mainly why I did lots of fell running. But a couple of years ago I gave myself a good talking to and and now my favourite run is 20 miles on the road by myself. It's good thinking time and I like it that there's nothing else to do but run.
02/02/2013 at 08:49

Minni - like Sarah I too have many places where I won't run alone.  This could be because of the roads being a bit lonely with no built up areas to go for help if needed.  I run for miles on my own, but never go where I feel I could be stranded for whatever reason.  In all the years I have run only once have I had to walk back with injury from a long run, but that  was very unpleasant and before mobile phones!  I had no money on me for a phone box (how quaint). 

 I would never run where I am on long stretches of county roads on my own with no town or village for miles!  I just would not put myself in a position that could, and note I say could invite opportunist crime!  Personally on all my runs on my own I always think about the  route, if there areas of isolation, how I can avoid these where possible and if not making sure they are very short sections of the run.  I also make sure I'm not running in the dark in areas that are not built up and any off road runs I do with others.  Apart from a few fields around where I live where there are house within easy reach I would not run off road without someone else with me.  In my opinion I think safety should be at the front on every runners mind when they set out to run!

Edited: 02/02/2013 at 08:51
02/02/2013 at 09:10
Oh my. I can run 20 miles and only see the odd house and car - rural living! I used to think along the same lines as you but then I realised I was holding myself back and I guess I'm comforted by the fact that anyone I do see I know. Now I feel more nervous running in a place where there are more people. I once got spooked running in the early morning in the dark. I was on a country lane and I saw a car pulled in on the side if the road ahead. As I approached it I turn my headlight and saw 4 make faces looking back - I turned and bolted as fast as I could!
02/02/2013 at 19:37

Evening, is today a rest day Sarah?I did 10 today before tonorrow's race to keep up the mileage, it's a route I've done a few times so I thought it might be interesting to see the paces:

Date    Distance (mile)    Time    Avg. pace (min/mi)    Avg. HR
05/05/2008 19:03    9.99    1:22:44    8:17    171 (83%)
16/08/2008 08:40    9.97    1:39:28    9:59   
03/01/2010 11:26    9.99    1:24:37    8:28    164 (78%)
10/01/2010 10:34    10.00    1:25:18    8:32   
14/08/2010                10.00    1:21:00    8:06   
02/01/2011 09:41     9.99    1:23:08    8:19    161 (76%)
24/02/2011 18:58     9.99    1:19:46    7:59    154 (71%)
07/09/2011 18:58    10.00    1:21:07    8:07   
13/11/2011 10:00    10.00    1:24:18    8:26   
29/02/2012 18:54    10.02    1:24:45    8:28    150 (67%)
30/12/2012 13:39    10.00    1:28:27    8:51    161 (75%)
02/02/2013 13:15    10.00    1:23:43    8:23    154 (71%)

In Jan 2010 it was 8:38 and I went on to 3:36.

In Feb 2011 I was well into training after a good autumn and winter and that was run comfortably marathon pace and I did 3:33.

I live in a semi rural area, I can go off road for miles and miles if I want, or I can run down a B road to busy A road and be under street lights for miles too.

I remember coming off a trail onto the road and there was a car parked up with two lads chopping stuff out on  a mirror, I just carried on as if I hadnt seen them. And there was a gypsy family that liked to ride motorbikes along the canal for a while.

Date    Location    Distance (mile)    Time    Avg. pace (min/mi)    Avg. HR
05/05/2008 19:03    up and over    9.99    1:22:44    8:17    171 (83%)
16/08/2008 08:40    up and over    9.97    1:39:28    9:59    
03/01/2010 11:26    up and over    9.99    1:24:37    8:28    164 (78%)
10/01/2010 10:34    up and over    10.00    1:25:18    8:32    
14/08/2010    up and over    10.00    1:21:00    8:06    
02/01/2011 09:41    up and over    9.99    1:23:08    8:19    161 (76%)
24/02/2011 18:58    up and over    9.99    1:19:46    7:59    154 (71%)
07/09/2011 18:58    up and over    10.00    1:21:07    8:07    
13/11/2011 10:00    up and over    10.00    1:24:18    8:26    
29/02/2012 1

02/02/2013 at 20:01
Hi Hilly, thankyou for the positive comments. For my one and only marathon I got 3:47 so im hoping that I will be able to smash this....but you never know whats around the corner so I dont want to get too carried away. Im happy to hear that your training is coming on, before you know it you will be hitting the milage that you want, im sure. How was your park run last weekend?

I have decided to do a xc race in the morning. Its at retford and about 6.5 miles. I cant decide whether to race it or not just yet. My legs have felt great today, so im hoping that they will be feeling even fresher tomorrow to race. It was either that or a 10 mile build up run, which I did like the sound off but the post race buffet swayed me.

Two weeks tomorrow I have a half marathon in Barcelona. Im hoping for a good time, but I dont want to get too carried away as I will probably be sleep deprived and spend the whole day before exploring and walking around Barcelona. On a plus side, 13 is far less than the 20 I did yesterday so I should manage!

I completley agree with all you have said above about safety. You dont know whose out there and when you could come into harm, so I would rather not risk it. Like you, if im on my own I have to stick to more built up areas, or places where lots of other people will be. Not only are there some dangerous people out there, you could also have an accident or injury and need assistence. I always run with money just incase I need to phone home, or get the bus or a taxi home. I really need to start running with my phone but I always worry about damaging it.

On a run with the club about 5 months ago, one of the runners tripped over a tree stump and sustained quite an injury that required a wash out, 20 stitches and crutches for about a month. Non of us had a mobile s we ended up having to run quite away to call for help whilst others in the group carried him to the nearest road.

My dad and my husband sometimes take it one step too far with running on my own though. My dad didnt want me running around the roads in Darnell and Woodhouse in sheffield as he didnt think it was safe. My mum then went on to say she was spat on in one of the areas above a few years ago, and another time some youths threw stones at me and my mum when we went for a walk. Where my parents live isnt as bad as the two mentioned places above but I didnt fancy doing laps of the place to make up 20 miles!

Sam Murphy has an article in the March edition of RW about running safely.
02/02/2013 at 20:20
Hi Mr P....I hope your car didnt cost as much as mine today!

On my way home from Harrogate last week I hit a pot hole that sounded as though it had snapped my car in half. It turns out my suspicions was right....suspension spring snapped in two....although I didnt realise that my car was dangerous to drive and un road worthy, until after I had drove from York to sheffield and then sheffield to Maltby and back twice....about 120 miles! Now my purse is ??255 lighter : (

Did you enjoy your rest day yesterday? Ive had mine today and its been quite nice to have time to do other things.

I love that aching sensation that you get after having a good run or workout, its so satisfying. What position does your wife play in?

I always find it uncomfortable when you see groups of people doing things like that, like you I always try to look the other way and not make eye contact.

I feel much safer running in York than I do in Sheffield!

Its nice that you have your times and paces from the last few years to compare your current times with. I think its looking ok as you were quicker than in 2010. I know your a little slower than at the end of feb 2011...but that is the pace that you got at the end of feb and not at the beginning.

This year you have more running experience and more marathon training and race experience which im sure will help you even more this year.

Good luck with your race tomorrow. I cant wait to hear how you get on.
02/02/2013 at 20:32
Hi Minni, its nice that you do feel comfortable running where you are able to go running.

It is so difficult as i love all the off road running but I know that I wouldnt feel safe doing this on my own. Therefore if I am on my own I will stick to the roads and pavements but this isnt as pleasant due to car fumes and heavy traffic. In York I am more lucky as there are many cycle paths that you can follow which are off road and can be quite busy with walkers and cyclists.

My legs felt a little uncomfortable for the first 30 minutes post run yesterday but then they seemed to ease. My friend brought me my new compression skins round so I put them on with my compression socks, underneath my jeans to go to the match and then the local pub. I think they did the trick as my legs have felt fine today, as though I didnt even run yesterday. Im just hoping that the aches dont kick in late..i.e tomorrow!

I went shopping with my mum today which involved a fair amount of walking around sheffield and then we went for a "spa afternoon" so I did some swimming before relaxing in the steam room and whilst having a facial....a proper rest day!!!
02/02/2013 at 20:39
Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

Week 5, (Day 33) Aim; rest day

I had a very relaxing "rest day" today (except when I got the bill through for my car)

I woke up and my legs felt ok, which I was surprised at. I may have gone a little over the top with wearing my compression tights (skins) and compression socks yesterday...but they look like they have done the trick (and they kept me warm at the match).

I went into town with my mum today and did a fair amount of walking to a number of shops and then wagamama for lunch. Afterwards we had a power walk to hilton hotel for our spa afternoon and facial (my mums xmas present...which I just had to buy myself to keep my mum company).

We did about 30 minutes of swimming before relaxing in the steam room and then whilst having our facial.

I feel completely relaxed and refreshed and hopefully will still feel the same in the morning for when I do a xc race.
Edited: 02/02/2013 at 20:40
03/02/2013 at 09:15
Puffy - it looks like you're nicely on target going on those stats. Good luck with the race today.

Sarah - also good luck with the xc. It's really windy here do hope you guys don't have it.

I've been thinking a lot about the safety and I guess I'm lucky in that I live in a very safe area, where I know everyone. I always run with my phone (and sometimes use a long run as a chance to chat to friends - AA, from the sub 3:30 thread, and I have passed many a long run mile chatting!).

I ran 20 yesterday that passed through a village at 9 miles and 3 farms. I did it with others and if I'd been my own I would have missed out the village and just stuck to the farm roads. It was icy yesterday and we ran a hilly route. I struggled a bit on the first 9 miles as the cba fairy seemed to be sitting on my shoulder but then I got into it and was fine. The second half was 8 minutes faster than the first and with bigger hills, with the last 6 nearly all sub 8 m/m and the final one was 7:45. The three of us ran the first half together then spread out on the second.
03/02/2013 at 18:32

Hi you have one of those blue tooth headsets to talk on the phone whilst running or do you just run with the phone at your ear?

I think that your really lucky to be able to run where you do.

What a fabulous run yesterday, despite you struggling for the first half. It just shows that you can work through those tough times and come out the other side smiling.....with speedy miles.

Just wondering, with london being flat, do you feel training on hills helps as it will be easier at VLM, or hinders as you are not doing as many miles on the flat and so your using other muscles?


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