RW Forum Six – Sub 4 Running Rachel with Cheerful Dave

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14/02/2013 at 20:07
Very good.

Tempo at lunch today, 3 miles easy and 3 miles at 7'35. Pleasantly warm if I hadn't been wearing a heavy duty merino!
14/02/2013 at 22:37

A quick 3 miles there Will - good going!

I had an 8 miler (MLR I suppose) tonight - late getting out (8.30pmish) but nice dry & bright evening.
Ran a sort of v controlled tempo build up run - from a slow first warm up mile @ 9.15 building up the pace each mile culminating in a 7.45 8th & final mile.  67mins for the run averaging 8.25 pace.

Not really sure what pace I should be running this MLR at bearing in mind I run tempo on tues, hills on wed, MLRs on thurs & sat (sat MLR @ MP) & LSR on sun. Mon is rest or recovery run & Fri is rest. Help Dave!

15/02/2013 at 11:26

4 miles done at 8:42 min mile.

I've had my hospital appointment through and it's not till 11th March 

That would only give me a month to properly train for the marathon and is probably unrealistic 

However, I am not giving up just yet, I am trying to figure out a way to run less, but still maintain a long weekend run. So I may still be able to do the marathon if I get the all clear, but the probability of sub 4 is now quite low.

I can only say that I am really gutted and very sorry. I fully intend to keep posting to the thread, keep running and keep encouraging you guys. Sorry I've been a bit quiet this week, I've just been thinking things through.

I would be really disappointed if the thread died and Dave has so much experience and knowledge to share with us all, so please keep posting!!

And you just never know what the future holds....(don't start your victory dance JUST yet Carter!!)


Edited: 15/02/2013 at 11:32
15/02/2013 at 12:16

Hi Rachel - firstly, I would say that you have nothing you should be sorry about. Shit happens. Try and stay positive and hopefully you can make it to Manchester. 

I, for one, will continue to post here, even if it is just to give you some grief !!

Cheerful Dave    pirate
15/02/2013 at 14:18

Carter's right - stay positive, put your health first and we'll see what happens.  You've nothing to be sorry for.  If everyone's marathon training went smoothly there'd be no need for these threads at all!

As Rachel says, keep posting.  Speaking of which: Ricky, you've got hard efforts on tuesdays & wednesdays, and a run at MP on saturday which is no mean effort either.  For your thursday run then, I'd be tempted tomake it a progressive run, starting out easy for the first few miles and building to MP for the final couple of miles.  Which is pretty much what you did anyway.  That way it won't be another hard effort like the previous two days, but there'll still be some variety and focus.

You could try using it as a session where you don't look at your watch but try & judge your pace as you speed up through the miles.  It takes a bit of practice but ideally you shoud know what MP feels like without having to check.

15/02/2013 at 15:25
Keep your chin up Rachel

First twenty miler for me planned tomorrow early night and early start planned
15/02/2013 at 16:34
Oh dear, sorry to hear that Rachel. Hopefully you can still do the marathon but, if not, there will be others.
15/02/2013 at 17:41

Ooo Dd, I'm excited for you! I used to love that early night to run a long way feeling!!

I'm hoping to get a 10 miler in in the morning, if I can get up in time, as I am off out for the day at 10...

Thanks again for all your good wishes. Your support is really appreciated!

15/02/2013 at 21:24

As Caz says Rachel - there will be plenty more mara's... priorty is your health. That said you appear to be keeping your training ticking over nicely so you might just surprise yourself!

Thanks Dave - I will prob switch my wed & thurs run around so as not to have 2 consecutive speed sessions. I might even do my tempo run "mid MLR" instead and change my normal tuesday tempo 6 miler to a MP or "pace judging" run. I enjoy the variety of different sessions and even more so a couple of varying sessions within a session. Spice of life as they say!

Dd - good luck with the 1st 20miler in the morn! I am also planning my first 20miler of the build up on Sunday morning early doors

16/02/2013 at 11:54
20 done and it feels so good to say that , 3hrs 3mins pace 9 10 felt good almost all the way.
I do need to nail the water and gels on these runs as again I took nothing and sustained the run on as banana and a cup of tea 30 mins before heading out.
A week travelling with my work now so not sure what I can get done next week ahead of the Blackpool half on Sunday the 24th
Happy running everyone light mornings and nights have arrived
16/02/2013 at 12:17

Super run Dd - well done! even more impressive with no fuel mid run!

Sounds like you are ready to run the 26.2 anytime!

16/02/2013 at 14:21

Rachel - good to see you staying positive and keeping the training ticking over. You have put in a decent base so you never know if you keep the weekend long runs going you might still surprise yourself. If you do start i Manchester you will be fresher than Carter and may just surprise him !!  If you don't do not stress. There are loads more marathons out there.

I have been quiet this week as I came down with serious flu. If I had not been so busy with workj I probably would have got over it quicker but there you go. Have not run since Tuesday and find the not running thing so frustrating particularly when I felt that I was training so well and enjoying it.

Supposed to have a 20 mile LSR this weekend with some MP. I would normally do this today but might do it tomorrow. Having gone to bed before the kids last night I feel brighter but am being cautious as I do not want to risk further absence and ruin my shot at a marathon pb.

I have the Baldock Beast HM next weekend and as it is a tough course I was not expecting a pb in tis but was hoping for a good performance to set me up for a push at a good MP before I taper. May have to reassess all of this now.

Happy running this weekend for all those who are out enjoying the warmer weather.

Cheerful Dave    pirate
16/02/2013 at 14:51
A bit of time off won't do you too much harm Carl, you need a cutback week every now and then anyway. You'll still nail your HM next week if you let yourself recover properly. It is frustrating though, been there!

Nice 20 dd. Doing it on less fuel than you'd normally have is no bad thing, it teaches your body to burn fat properly and you'll be less reliant on the gels.

I slotted my 20 in yesterday, recovery run was a parkrun this morning. Bike tomorrow.
16/02/2013 at 16:55
Nice 20 Dave.... I'm attempting my first 20 of the plan in the morning.

8.5 miles At MP done this afternoon. 8.28 avg pace. Nice spring sunshine for a change!

Oh and broke in a new pair of Mizunos when I was at it.
Edited: 16/02/2013 at 16:58
16/02/2013 at 20:38
Good work Ricky, dave and dd. sorry you're not 100% Carl... Might be a 'beneficial enforced rest...

I'm just back from a 20 miler, 3 hrs 1 min 53 secs (9'06 pace). Same as you dd except I was fuelled to the max so respect to you! Munched on my clif shot bloks and I won't lie I still found it tough especially the last few miles..

I have a little conundrum with my LSR over he coming weeks, any thoughts appreciated...

Basically I was supposed to do 18 at the above pace today, and 20 next weekend, and 15 a bit quicker the following weekend to that.

But due to bing away climbing next weekend I'd rather as short a run as possible on Sunday am... What does everyone think if I did the 15 next weekend and the 18 the following weekend. To put it in perspective;

18m at 9'20 - DONE
20m at 9'20 - DONE
13m at 8'50 (last weekend) - DONE
18m at 9'05 (today) - actually did 20 as above
20m at 9'05 (next weekend)
15m at 8'55 ish
20m at 9'10
Reading half (I actually inserted this in my sch so it went from 16 wks to 17)

20m at 9'06 (today)
15m at 8'55 (next week)
18m at 9'05
20m at 9'10
Reading half

Not sure if that's the best plan of action?!


16/02/2013 at 21:33
For what it's worth my only opinion is not to be as slave to a schedule go with what you personally feel is right for where you think you are and what home life etc throws at you ,
I work way from home almost every week and have learnt after two crappy marathon times last year is to just go with the flow and don't stress around supposedly what you should do according to a schedule - enjoy the climb, I live in Scotland so be safe its been a bad few weeks for climbers in this part of the world
16/02/2013 at 22:27

Will - another 20 in the bag - well done.

Have to agree with Dd it's all about juggling things around to suit your lifestyle/get round any roadblocks that life tends to throw up. Switching those 3 LSRs around will have next to no impact on your marathon I would have thought. You just have a slightly harder approach to Reading HM now but again I dont even think it will have any real impact on your HM race. Also I assume Reading HM is not your primary goal making the rescheduling of LSRs even less of an issue for you.

Your long runs all look quite speedy which seems to contradict most popular training plans - what plan did you say you were following?
My recommended LSR pace based on a 3.45 marathon goal time is anywhere between 9.21 & 10.17 pace... That said I checked my running diaries from my last mara in 2006 which revealed I ran my last 4 longest runs at around 8.30 pace, i.e. MP, and went on to achieve goal time of 3.44 in the race. So I suppose my point is the speedier LSRs worked for me back then which was contrary to (and still is) popular training advice!

16/02/2013 at 23:01
Thanks guys.

Dd, yes terrible stuff in Scotland. I'll be in Dorset but will take care.

Ricky, I'm following the FIRST plan for 3'45...

Do you know it? Just 3 runs a week; intervals, tempo and LSR. Think the logic is that overall you have more intense runs and more recovery than usual plans. Suits me as can only manage 3 runs due to family and injury proneness..
17/02/2013 at 06:41
I don't know it Will - but now I see the logic.. 3 key quality sessions per week. Interesting - must google that later.

Just havin my power breakfast atm before I go LSRing! Bagels & porridge yum yum...
17/02/2013 at 13:48
20 miler done @ 9.13 pace - 3:04

1st 14 miles @ 9.26 LSR pace and last 6 miles @ 8.42 ( was attempting MP of 8.35 so was a little down on that as I was finding it quite tough at that stage)

Pleased with the run though and have clocked 50 miles for the week.
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