Sub 3

For anyone trying to crack the 3 in any marathon anywhere in the world

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01/09/2009 at 21:57

cw. marigold, gobi, mtr, mmmm and possibly others who i might have missed on the long readback since last night, thanks very much for the info. it helped a lot in the sense that i understand a bit better but still no idea which to go for! seems like both are a pretty safe bet though.

i'll try and post on here when i get the chance or inclination but the thread moves pretty fast i've noticed having followed it for a few weeks. i'm fairly new to running and even more new to running websites/forums but this one is great for the knowledge you have between you, the fact you are willing to share but above all the fact that you encourage each other and are positive.

my next marathon is looking like being barcelona, anyone done it before?

some nice monthly totals by the way. mine are still in minutes but will soon be changing!

01/09/2009 at 21:57
TR - the HR was exactly what i was looking for so the effort levels were all good, would prefer to get the leg speed going on these runs so joking aside i wouldn't like doing these sessions with a headwind.

I don't think i'll have much trouble on the PB side of things, its currently over 60min for 10 miles!
01/09/2009 at 22:15

MT - Sacre bleu! Nice training. That sounds fantastic. (If slightly hard work!)

Wardi - great to hear you're getting the miles in pain-free.

A big session on a blustery track this evening so I was pleased to get through it without slowing down.  20 x 400m straight through with 1 min walk/jog recovery. First was 75, then all the rest 72 - 74 with a big head wind in the back straight. Got a good B group going at the moment.

01/09/2009 at 22:54

MM- Am really shocked at how quickly I'm back in shape so hopefully yes. Take care now you're in the final few weeks!

Coro - I'm dropping you an email - not sure that it will help but there are some Brit guys heading out but they're a bit quicker I think than you're aiming for I think (and the one aiming for closer your pace you already know!) email is of the guy organising the group out there.

Have to say that I'm an absolute die-hard interval fan. Running at dead on 5k pace for 8k worth of work with recovery varying from 25% to 50% of rep time is absolutely golden in my eyes and it brings me on leaps and bounds and long-term is even more effective. I used to be an absolute mess in terms of running form but now at 76-80 seconds per lap I use so much less energy it is ridiculous which has paid off in much faster times. The VO2 max benefits greatly diminishes but the gain in running efficiency is long-term and should ultimately help run a half-marathon at 65/66 minutes and marathon at around 2:15 (in dream world). That said that pace will gradually transition into LT pace as I get closer so fair dibs.

80 minutes for me yesterday split into 2 runs with the first having 8 x strides. Today did 15 minute warm up, couple of strides, then on a very windy track did 11 minutes @ LT (covered just over 2 miles running pretty much @ LT I reckon) then about a minutes recovery  before 9 x 600 - ran the middle one at 1:46 for a bit of a stretch out and felt comfortable doing that but mostly just ran 1:51/52 which at 74/lap is perhaps slightly optimistic for 5k pace right now but still good. LT run particularly pleased me as 2 weeks pretty much today I ran 12 x 400 off a minute in about 78/79 so to run consistent 82s without even really working was great!

Right 30 minute cycle, then a massage, and I'm done!

02/09/2009 at 07:45
Autumn Marathon List

Nottingham - 13.09.09
Drifter 2.59

Berlin - 20.9.09
kinaseboy 2:55 (or bust!)
marmite 2:29 (or ker-BOOM!!!!!!!)
Coro 2:29

Leicester 11.10.09
Ode- 2.44.59 (1.22 hw no matter how I feel!)

Abingdon - 18.10.09
CharlieW 2:52:00
Dull 2.59.59

Dartmoor Vale - 18.10.09
grecianred: 2:59 (not so much or bust but 'or v disappointed'...)

Beachy Head - 24.10.09
PhilPub: 3:10

Dorset Coastal Trail 7.11.09
MtR: 3:59

Gower Coastal Trail 5.12.09
MtR: 3:29

Luton - 6.12.09
02/09/2009 at 07:54

Autumn Marathon List

Wolverhampton - 6.09.09

BR - 2:52
Hilly - 3:14

Nottingham - 13.09.09
Drifter 2.59

Berlin - 20.9.09
kinaseboy 2:55 (or bust!)
marmite 2:29 (or ker-BOOM!!!!!!!)
Coro 2:29

Leicester 11.10.09
Ode- 2.44.59 (1.22 hw no matter how I feel!)
BR - 2:42

Abingdon - 18.10.09
CharlieW 2:52:00
Dull 2.59.59
Hilly - 2:59.59

Dartmoor Vale - 18.10.09
grecianred: 2:59 (not so much or bust but 'or v disappointed'...)

Beachy Head - 24.10.09
PhilPub: 3:10

Dorset Coastal Trail 7.11.09
MtR: 3:59

Gower Coastal Trail 5.12.09
MtR: 3:29

Luton - 6.12.09

Edited: 02/09/2009 at 07:55
Cheerful Dave    pirate
02/09/2009 at 08:26

Autumn Marathon List

Wolverhampton - 6.09.09

BR - 2:52
Hilly - 3:14

Nottingham - 13.09.09
Drifter 2.59

Berlin - 20.9.09
kinaseboy 2:55 (or bust!)
marmite 2:29 (or ker-BOOM!!!!!!!)
Coro 2:29
CD 2:35

Leicester 11.10.09
Ode- 2.44.59 (1.22 hw no matter how I feel!)
BR - 2:42

Abingdon - 18.10.09
CharlieW 2:52:00
Dull 2.59.59
Hilly - 2:59.59

Dartmoor Vale - 18.10.09
grecianred: 2:59 (not so much or bust but 'or v disappointed'...)

Beachy Head - 24.10.09
PhilPub: 3:10

Dorset Coastal Trail 7.11.09
MtR: 3:59

Gower Coastal Trail 5.12.09
MtR: 3:29

Luton - 6.12.09

02/09/2009 at 08:36
Nice sessions HH, Marigold, PP.  And yes Wardi it sounds like we are in a very similar space right now, with similar plans afoot, good to hear you are getting back into it.  Was wondering what had happend to MP - isn't he running Toronto or something in Canada coming up soonish with a country vest on?? BR - two marathons in 5 weeks - v nice tergats. 
02/09/2009 at 08:53

Popping in to say good luck to the Autumn marathoners.

Wardi, Great stuff! Now easy does it.... may see you at Abbey Dash.

Good tracking HH and Phil.
Marigold, Decent tempo sesh. I'm in the TR camp ie. resistance training is better, but take on board the leg speed thingy. It's like running hill reps downhill, can't bring myself to do it.

Aug:
Miles......................... 160
Pace......................... Snail
Rest / injury days... lots
Races...................... 1
Pb's.......................... None

Next target............... Thirsk 10M

02/09/2009 at 09:03

TR - none taken! I've only been averaging around 18mph on the bike and 6:50 min/mile running so I doubt I'm going much faster than you. My swimming is presumably quicker but that was only a few hours anyway. I don't feel I am pushing the boat out at all - I don't feel tired (much less tired than when I was doiong 90-100 mpw marathon training) and still have plenty of free time. I did miss a couple of days through being stuck at work, but in a normal week I don't see why I shouldn't be doing 20 hours really.

MT - OK, think you win there. And the climbs you did were a bit more significant than mine! Barcelona should be good - think you'll be well ahead of me though. A clubmate of mine is racing as well and should do a similar time to me (although it's a debut for both of us so a bit unknown), so should be some good friendly competition.

Slightly annoyed today - for no reason whatsoever I seem to have injured my shoulder! It was fine yesterday morning, and the first time I remember it hurting was yesterday afternoon (but don't remember a particular point where it "went"). Good news is that I went for a run this morning (did 3M in the middle "tempo lite" a la Gobi, which worked out as 5:50 pace), felt it twinge occasionally, but was generally fine. Cycling should also be OK (especially as it looks like turbo weather for a few days...), but probably no swimming for a while.

Looking forward to Berlin, should be some cracking times posted. 

02/09/2009 at 09:04
selbs - This is the race MP is doing

http://www.torontowaterfrontmarathon.com/en/teamchallenge.htm#prizing

Hopefully he might pop in before he goes out there. (Hint Hint)

Brian - I'm all for resistance training, first half of my LSR every Sunday is into the wind up the "mountains" of the Purbecks, it's just not what I'm trying to get out of my Tuesday faster stuff.

02/09/2009 at 09:10
marigold I think it is quite a sensible thing to do - improves running form/economy without too much strain on the body. Essentially it is like running on an Alter-G treadmill and you can see what that has done for Dathan Ritzenhein!
02/09/2009 at 09:17

Got an early morning 7.5 miles in at a steady pace. I'm in that nice place at the moment where every run is quicker than the last time I ran the same route. Have managed to improve about 40 secs per mile in the past month so it's highly motivating at the moment. I'll see I react when I plateau which could be any time soon now.

Weather conditions here in Kent were nigh on perfect this morning. Much cooler and a light drizzle over the last few miles. Hilly route over the North Downs so enforced resistance training. I think hills are the best way to improve fitness quickly. Not ready for anything speedy yet! Probably won't think about the track until after xmas.

02/09/2009 at 09:20

Autumn Marathon List

Wolverhampton - 6.09.09

BR - 2:52
Hilly - 3:14

Nottingham - 13.09.09
Drifter 2.59

Berlin - 20.9.09
kinaseboy 2:55 (or bust!)
marmite 2:29 (or ker-BOOM!!!!!!!)
Coro 2:29
CD 2:35

New Forest - 27.9.09
TippTop - training run, looking for position rather than time.

Leicester 11.10.09
Ode- 2.44.59 (1.22 hw no matter how I feel!)
BR - 2:42

Abingdon - 18.10.09
CharlieW 2:52:00
Dull 2.59.59
Hilly - 2:59.59
TippTop - hopefully quicker than last year's winning time.

Dartmoor Vale - 18.10.09
grecianred: 2:59 (not so much or bust but 'or v disappointed'...)

Beachy Head - 24.10.09
PhilPub: 3:10

Dorset Coastal Trail 7.11.09
MtR: 3:59

Gower Coastal Trail 5.12.09
MtR: 3:29

Luton - 6.12.09
TippTop - for position hopefully......

02/09/2009 at 09:28

Marigold - wind or no wind that is quick!

Interesting prep GN. Sounds like some good workouts there!

RB - bugger. When is the mara?

MT - impressively nuts!

Nice to hear there's positive progress Wardi.

No idea on cadence, I remember checking it a couple of years back and it came in around 180. I must check at some stage just out of curiosity to see if it has changed. I would agree on running with the wind/slope, certainly on shorter distances, e..g strideouts, for leg speed, but for longer distances I tend to vary a little bit depending on what I'm in the mood for.

02/09/2009 at 09:45

Hmm, day 6 of sounding like darth vader this end.  I'm taking vitamin C, echinacea and zinc to no avail.  That autumn marathon list is making me wistful.

It's sounding like when I return to running I will have to run downhill with a following wind (possibly just sitting on a skateboard, tbh) to keep up with even the slowest posters...

02/09/2009 at 09:52

I haven't had chance to read back since last week, I do recall seeing RM back, and asking about brass monkey - yes hopefully having tried for about 3 years!

If Wardi / Brian et al can give me the heads up on entry form's early release, I'll do likewise for them!

Had some good news earlier, turns out despite not training very much I'm actually faster than marigold...

Marigold. wrote (see)
 I don't think i'll have much trouble on the PB side of things, its currently over 60min for 10 miles!
02/09/2009 at 10:44

Na then!

Just spent the last 12 days catching up on the forum. I've read every single post since I sulked off into the wilderness three or four months ago.... my eyes are very sore now, and my brain is half-dead. Actually, I haven't - so if anyone can sum up the entire summer for forumites in a few lines, that would be monumental.

Anyway, just to report that you can henceforth call me "Son of Pug", as I have managed to put on 22lbs in weight since the relative glory days of early spring. Running again is hard and very sweaty as the layer of insulating lard cannot be taken off like a trackie can.

I've been cycling a lot (16 miles most days), spent the summer hols surfing (badly).... but obviously not sufficient to match what's been scoffed.

I managed a 5 mile run this morning at 8 min/mile. Who said one swallow does not a summer make, as I am now starting to think that London Marathon glory will be mine, and that I can squeeze back into my jeans in another few weeks!

02/09/2009 at 10:56

Crikey, it's LD!  Welcome back.  There was a lot of forumite activity summarised nicely a couple of weeks (?) back by Paul the Builder.  I nominate MtR to go and find it.  He loves searching.   In summary, half the thread have turned into triathletes or just very good cyclists.  Most who are lucky enough not to have been benched have got a bit quicker.  I think red is still the quickest colour although some people are spending as little as possible on shoes.

The extra pounds should keep you nice and warm going into Autumn/Winter training.  If it's any consolation my last injury spell (ITB 3/4 months) saw me put on 17lbs, since which time I've lost 26lbs in 8 months.  So by my reckoning/dodgy logic, you'll be lighter and quicker than ever by VLM.  Godspeed Dids!

[edit: put on 17lbs, not 15 as first stated. Scatty maths head on again today...]

Edited: 02/09/2009 at 11:10
02/09/2009 at 10:58
22lbs is a good effort, welcome back.
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