Sub 3

For anyone trying to crack the 3 in any marathon anywhere in the world

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Cheerful Dave    pirate
12/11/2012 at 12:06

That's the worry TR - I was still 3rd in 45-49 so maybe there's an element of the inevitable slowing with age.  OTOH the guy in 2nd is someone I meet there every year and have beaten every time.

12/11/2012 at 12:07

CD - I saw your time and wondered what had happened. Sounds like something going on there - 3 mins on the first run is a huge difference. Maybe a virus, tired etc?

Was looking at our XC results this morning and noticed that of the first 16 finishers, I was the oldest by 6 years! 7 of the first 8 were U23s (3 of them were U20s). What's going on there? I've never felt so old at a race. It's weird because at road races I tend to find I'm about average age amongst the faster runners, or maybe even a bit younger than average.

Cheerful Dave    pirate
12/11/2012 at 12:14

Could be one of those padams, I guess I'll find out in due course.  I have nothing major lined up for a while, with the possible exception of the Epsom 10, so a good chance for a break and a decent build-up to the spring and VLM.

We've moved up a division in the county XC league this year and it's noticable how much younger div 2 is compared with div 3, far fewer vets.  I would imagine that moving up to div 1 has a similar step back to the cradle.  Now you know how the rest of us feel when we're running with the likes of you youngsters

12/11/2012 at 12:16

Epic race there PP, glad it went well for you. Sorry it was a less satisfactory outcome for you this time, CD.

Well XC-d CL, JH1, LS21, Padams and CC2 (again!)

Good long run there Jools and yours was very quick for off-road, Al_P.

Noakes doesn't believe in the sports drink industry, it's true, as 99% of the stuff is drunk unnecessarily (like by the overweight audience at a panto I went to once, seemed to be the only drink they sold...) -- but at the same time he does believe in avoiding hypoglycaemia late in long races by ingesting some carbohydrate, and similarly he recommends getting some in at the very start of a long race to pre-empt that. I only ever use gels in the odd training run where I want to rehearse race conditions; otherwise I don't eat or drink in long runs these days. But for sure on race day I will have a few gels, especially as the race wears on. And I have had the odd weak and wobbly training run where I've realised I'd not eaten many carbs for a day or two before. Keeping cool is probably more important than keeping hydrated, and I do a lot of wetting my head in warm races.

Had a go at the beep/bleep test yesterday to entertain the kids as they had been doing it at school; my calves were a bit stiff already from training, but I was still a bit disappointed to conk out at about 7 shuttles of level 12 (VO2max ~55 ml/kg/min, should be up in the 60s for me really, or so I'd like to believe). Interesting to try it though.

12/11/2012 at 13:04

There's been a lot going on since I was last on here!! Well done and good performances in XC and on the road, was a nice day for it yeasterday.

So, think maybe I've confused people with my training a little. I did get a very nice 25 done yesterday, but it was very very easy paced with lots of stopping. It was a recce for a race my better half is doing and requires a bit of Navigation, so I tagged along to keep company, help etc. So not really part of my training. Pretty much all off road, and like I said, not run at any real pace.

By saying I was stepping off the gas, I guess I meant by not doing any really hard effort running, intervals/racing. The runs I did do although were long, were done at a pace that was comfortable and still left me feeling freshish the day after.

TR - Last goal race was Oxford HM last month, next A race would be a half in Feb, then Hamburg mara in April. Nothing really planned other than a 5 and 10k between now and then which wont be too serious.

CW - I love the bleep test! Havent done one in a while, its good fun in a group! 

Edited: 12/11/2012 at 13:07
12/11/2012 at 13:18

CD - only joshing, just a carp day at the office more like.

12/11/2012 at 13:27

An absolute glut of XC action at the weekend then - well done to all, Jools, CC2 (x2), JH1, LS and Padams.  I did enough club XC races as a teenager to still be in credit in my mid 30s, but no doubt I will show up to one at some point.  Can't say the enthusiasm is exactly gripping me though.

Great result for PP. Sorry to hear that things didn't go well for you CD, but it sounds like something must be up to be that far off the pace.

Great to hear of RS's PB.  And a stonking sub 3 from LD.

I've managed to put together some consistent running over the last week and a bit.  Included a track session (600s/200s, with the 600s averaging 1:58-ish, so I'm not as far off the pace as I'd feared.  Culminated in a 14 yesterday, longest run since the marathon.

Not yet sure how to play Gosport this weekend, but hopefully training paces this week will give me a clue.  A shot at 1:15 is off the agenda, but getting close to the PB is maybe not as remote a possibility as I thought.  Al_P, on the basis of what I'm hearing from you in terms of recent paces, sounds like 1:15 is a distinct possibility.

12/11/2012 at 16:10

Well done to LD, RS, PP and CD and all the XC'ers for some great efforts over the weekend.

And seeing as I haven't posted for a while, well done to Padams, CW and Al_P for some cracking results last weekend too.

I've been spending the last 2 weeks recovering, but will start to build back up this week. I've got Preston 10(mile) at the weekend, then the races come thick and fast with 2 XC's and 2 10k's left in 2012 then 3 XC's and a HM in Jan. None of them are A races, but I'd like a couple of PB's having banked plenty of mileage this year.

12/11/2012 at 18:35

RS78 -- forgot to comment on your chaotic but hopefully satisfying PB! And hey, if it wasn't quite as fast as you wanted, at least you've left some headroom to PB all over again...

Hmm slight niggle at top of left thigh again, which I had about 3 weeks ago or something. Tapering this week anyway, but that should involve some speed...

12/11/2012 at 18:51

AL_P - if you can get yourself to some of those Hants XC races then you'll get a good workout out of it, the standard is pretty high. More so than the road race league, where even idiots like me are nearer the front than the back.

backed up y'days 12 with a 5, 1.5k, 5 triple. But I have a bit of a niggle thats literally becoming a pain in the arse on the 2nd run of a double, might be some sort of sciatic thing. Might have to do the decent thing and try some stretches.

12/11/2012 at 19:37

RS78 - good PB that mate.  V impressed.  I enjoyed the football too 

LD - Nice sub-3.  Would like to run there one day.  Agree about the gel & sports drinks industry (I was in the latter for many years and still remain unconvinced). Same I think is true for compression gear; massively popular on the continent, but I just don't think it makes any noticable difference.  Triumph of marketing though.

PP/CD/Padams - stonking performances imo.

I've got a number for Gosport on Sunday, so might head down.  Anyone fancy a guess as to the result?  I've no idea.  Did the Nice-Cannes marathon last week in 3.23, but ended up having to be a sociable rather than a target run due to not enough training post-injury.  Gosport is my joint-PB course from 2008 (78:48), but won't be troubling that this year.  Sub 1.25 would be a fair reflection.

12/11/2012 at 21:07

TR -- of my many niggles, the PITA/sciatic thing was by far and away the most extreme pain-wise, and led even me to see a physio: piriformis syndrome was the thing. I was taught to roll the muscle tension into submission bit by bit by using my weight on a tennis ball -- that hurt -- and stretching by pulling one leg across and up while lying down on my back (the figure-of-4 type thing wasn't so useful). My sciatic nerve was very strongly affected, with my leg going all rubbery and unresponsive for a bit, and terrible pain at times all down the leg (especially when using the clutch for a while in a traffic jam when driving -- I nearly cried when I had to reverse parallel park, and the pain was so intense I couldn't think or speak). Hope you don't suffer all that! Definitely best to nip it in the bud.

12/11/2012 at 21:33

CW - I'll do some stretches, not sure a tennis ball is going to help though, unless  i it stick it somewhere !

12/11/2012 at 22:43

Great read back over the past couple of days.

Hats off to Lord Dids on 'doing what it says on the tin' to borrow from TR, and at the age of 50 on a semi hilly route: great performance! 

Great to see one of my heroes (apologies) PP doing a cracking performance too.

And great performances and training from a lot of others this weekend, too many to list in a way but RS78, CL, Padams, Joolska, LS, TR, AL_P, AW, JH1 all great stuff. Sorry CD it wasn't quite so good.

Was thinking today as I was out and about on a run that it's nearly a year since I was told I'd never run again. There's lots of good advice out there, and lots that isn't, which brings me to the subject of food and drink. After two marafuns I've come to think the carb load may be a lot of bull. I just felt grossly bloated last time. And eating and drinking pretty much whatever you want in some moderation is good. Yes you can go faster if you're stick-thin but you're also more likely to break down with injury. Ask me about that daft approach. 

Edited: 12/11/2012 at 22:45
12/11/2012 at 22:56

Dehydration near the end of a marathon is not fun folks, I can attest to that!


13/11/2012 at 12:21

A very nice way to celebrate your birthday Dids. Well done!

Well run/biked/run PP.

And sorry to hear it didn't go to plan CD.

Congrats on the pb RS78. Nicely done!

Fingers crossed that niggle clears sharpish TR.

Looks like plenty of good xc-racing and repping going on. Just ticking over here.

13/11/2012 at 12:31

Don't feckin believe it!

I was so pleased about moving up an age category, and dead chuffed when I came 3rd. Just looked at the results, and if I'd bloody stayed in the v45-49 I'd have won it!!!!

13/11/2012 at 18:22

TT - recognising that an issue is there and doing some stretches etc should help me. Dont think its Piriformis as its not buttock related, but all those sort of stretches should help. I had back trouble before the 1/2 IM and get a tight hammy a lot, so its all probably related.

Dids - bad luck with the age groups there.  

13/11/2012 at 21:56

Dids.. beating all the next age group down is supposed to make you feel better!   Belated happy birthday & congrats on the sub 3.

PP.. nice podium place among the V40's.  Sorry to see CD didn't have the best of days.

CC2.. a fine weekend of XC from you.  Hope you enjoyed Whitby - did you bring any smoked kippers back?  One of my favourite fish!

RS78.. nice PB after a false start!

Good training/XC from Padams at the weekend & a lot of decent laps of the New Forest from Al P.

TR.. it is possible to get nerve problems by persistently putting a fat wallet into your back pocket apparently....

Nice to see CL reporting in.

Just got back from my hols in South Turkey on Sunday night.  I did fit a couple of runs in but every day bar one we were involved in some pretty hardcore trekking/climbing.  Climbed the local big mountain - Mt Olympus (7700 ft), hard work at times in 24 degrees.  At the the top of the mountain there was a hideous 3 storey building incorporating tat shop & cafe primarily aimed at those who come up by cable car.  There was a viewing point on top of the building (quite why you need one on top of a big hill is beyond me!).  The cable car brigade were actually taking the lift up to the viewing point rather than the steps! 

Did 5m yesterday & 4+7 today to get my legs used to running again.

13/11/2012 at 22:11


Dachs - good luck in Gosport

Andy D - hope the recovery has done the job

LD - well in on the sub 3, sounds like a hard race from what you say

Dan - football really was shocking, but fairplay on the away win, you can't ever question your team when you win away. You're looking ok but I still can't stand Hippo head, arrogant deluded idiot

Padams - well done in Met league. I'm back in London for the Ally Pally meet on 15th next month, its right next to the folks place and Heathside's local xc. If yr running will look out for you to say hello

Wardi - nice climb

Confirmation of issue in the race on sunday. A random member of the public cycled onto the route wearing a hi viz vest at precisely the wrong time causing mayhem as a big group followed him the wrong way. Just one of those things really and lots of hard work went into organising what was eventually a great race from Heaton volunteers who gave up their sunday morning to help out.

Consensus from Harriers team mates is that the race is not a pb course, I enjoyed the route though. There's defo a 35.xx out there on the right day. Club run - long hill reps tonight, 7 I think (lost count). Legs felt pretty good, easy running rest of the week then north east harrier league xc on sat. Looking forward to that.

Edited: 13/11/2012 at 22:13
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