Sub 3

For anyone trying to crack the 3 in any marathon anywhere in the world

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04/01/2013 at 11:26

Not really their fault.

Really? I'm surprised you didn't suggest to them that they should have done 75mpw in readiness..... 

04/01/2013 at 13:35

Coro - at that point in my stellar career I was only doing about 50 mpw. We did have words though. They suggested that maybe I waited around for them at the finish and had a threesome in their hotel afterwards.

Last year I overtook Nell McAndrews (I think it was her) around the 5 mile point and got a similar proposition.

I'm getting a bit pissed of with it to be honest. Even the knotted hanky doesn't seem to put them off.

04/01/2013 at 14:20

So your 'hot day' claim is valid but it didn't make much difference and I was saying it wasn't 'dramatic' as I'm already a better runner than that.  All makes sense now ;o)

I'm not disagreeing that higher mileage doesn't work (and for the record if you ever witness me claim 'I'm already a better runner than that' feel free to punch me in the face repeatedly) .  Fck me I used to hit 3 figures most weeks for a period - and it wasn't for the love of it I can tell you.  It's just your everyone agreeing and it being dramatic. Even the great low mileage lazy @rse Padams only puts his improvement (much more at the pointy end) as significant.  I know let's tell everyone that they have to run high mileage to improve (and oh it will be dramtaic yes sirreee!) so they can either get injured, lose their house or decide against trying to improve in order to avoid injury or losing their house.  People come here for advice they can weigh up against their background, commitment level, personal bias and 'other pressures' not a prescription don't they?

Although probably a supporter (for me) of higher mileage I actually went from 3:07 to 2:55 (on the windiest day that entire day) on around 35mpw (predominanlty nads akimbo I'll grant you). Okay it's not even close to dramatic but it's probably enough to get most people from where they are (if they contribute here) to where they'd like to be but I'm not putting it forward as a cast iron gaurantee (although no doubt everyone agrees) but it's another way that worked for a sample set of one.  Or maybe it was the MG2 Memorial beard that did it.  Well the winner that day had a a full set too. Yes that's it everyone agrees if you grow a (I like to think decent) beard then sub3 is yours.  

Long time since I said horses for courses.

Good day to you sir.

As you were.

04/01/2013 at 15:04

“dramatic - sensational in appearance or thrilling in effect”

Believe me, as I hurtled down the Mall without an Elvis or furry animal in front of me for a change, with my Mother wiping a tear from the corner of her eye, my youngest daughter saying “has Daddy cheated?”, there was no other word more suitable.

I didn’t consider the house or the beard. In my defence, just suppose this were a medical forum, and ES wanted to know how to get better from cancer. Whilst I would advise chemo and surgery, and claim “everyone” would agree and that the effect would be dramatic (well, life rather than death if that counts?), I suppose I completely overlooked the handful of people who would actually advise drinking nettle/cranberry/ juice etc instead.

 I’ll address this, and in future I will also be more sensitive to those advising him to do a bit of chemo rather than get it properly sorted, because he only wants to be a bit better at this point.

Anyway, here's the weather..... 

BBC NEWS | UK | England | Runners brave marathon heatwave A record number of runners complete the London Marathon after sweltering in unseasonal heat
04/01/2013 at 15:09

I did hesitate when I wrote "significant", but thought it would be a safe enough word to use (I decided against "dramatic")....

It's like a new Pugometer - 5%-10% = "significant", 10%-20% = "dramatic" etc. etc.

04/01/2013 at 15:13

If heat causes a slow marathon, does the inverse apply?

I'm currently looking out of my hotel window in Tromso - it's pitch dark by lunchtime and it's chucking down with snow and about minus 6.  Should ensure that tomorrow's half marathon is run at about 5 min/mile pace quite comfortably.

Only downside of finishing quickly though is that you get to the bar more quickly.  And and over £10 a pint you don't want to be quaffing too enthusiastically.  

Cheerful Dave    pirate
04/01/2013 at 15:24

We'll be expecting record times Dan.  Have fun, looks a good event.  Do xempo do long sleeved thermal tops?

I suppose 21ºC feels hot if you've spent the whole winter training in much colder weather in shorts and a vest, only to be confronted by the first properly warm day of the year for your race, even more so if you're doing it in the Yogi Bear costume that seemed a good idea in December.  I guess a lot of folks weren't as acclimatised as Dids & padams on the day.  The same temperature at an autumn marathon wouldn't get a mention.

04/01/2013 at 15:46

Felt chuffin' hot to me.

04/01/2013 at 15:47

But then I was a 12-stone TR-machine!

04/01/2013 at 15:49

Good luck, DanA.

2007 proved to me that (despite my perceptions to the contrary) I can run marathons relatively well in the heat (3.07 off 1.27.30); certainly when I can chuck a little bit of water over my head every mile!.  Best national marathon ranking I've ever had.

Cheerful Dave    pirate
04/01/2013 at 15:49

You should be less hirstute then PP.

04/01/2013 at 16:11

PP - agreed, I always get sunburned and cramp up on the cool VLM days. Its always way warmer than it is round here at 6am all winter. IoW 1/2 mara was a tad warmer still last August.

04/01/2013 at 17:51

I think in conclusion I will increase my mileage to the maximum that my lifestyle will support and be cautiously optimistic that it might lead to some improvement!


04/01/2013 at 18:05

ES - good man.

5M, 1M (lido), 8M for me today. Thats week 1 (of more focussed running) completed for a total of 46M, which is the biggest week since VLM 2012 campaign. 

04/01/2013 at 19:33

Wardi, I badly messed up on the day and do not blame the higher temperature. Took me too many years to learn to run to heart rate and not to pace. 2007 was a big missed opportunity, because I had put in some reasonable training. Should be able to manage some more consistency for this year's campaign. 



04/01/2013 at 19:42
Wow another good week of lively running orientated debate on here

My experiences (for what it's worth) are 2:55 off 35-55mpw (2011) and 2:43 off 45-70mpw (2012). So that lends some weight to the higher mileage side of the debate although it's hard to say either way, as I'm still in the earier stages of a running career (2-3yrs) and so probably down to natural progression to some degree too.

I personally favour the "fast stuff fast & slow stuff slow" approach to training
04/01/2013 at 21:51

Jools.. ah, the happy day of FLM 2007.  I do remember you swanning around the finish area with a big grin on your face, well deserved of course.  Not my fastest time but certainly my highest ever position - though nowhere near Padams' 48th!  As I remember the last 5m or so were like a war zone - there were melted runners lying all over the place!

Nichs.. always a shame when a marathon goes t*ts up, it not as if you can do another one the following week to make up for it.  Are you doing London this year?  I'm dibbing out of a spring Mara and have plumped for Frankfurt in October instead.

DanA.. best of luck in the cold, are you still coming up for the York BM?

Good triple there TR.

6m fartlek tonight, no painkillers required so I might as well give it full beans at the flat club 5 miler on Sunday.

04/01/2013 at 22:32
Dan - have a good race in the snow tomorrow, is it run in the dark?

Wardi - sounds like good progress Fingers crossed I'll be rising off the bench too this weekend

TR - great run/swim/run combo

As already indicated hopefully I'll be back up to speed again tomorrow. Went out on Wednesday for a really easy 4.5M but still had some pain In my left ITB at the knee. Managed to get a last min appointment with the Osteopath on Thursday, who gave it some (painful) massage and also realigned my back. Seems to be a bit of a correlation between my pelvis getting twisted out (always to the right) & injury niggles cropping up for me.... Anyway feels much better today and I've been giving my leg the foam roller treatment too. Proof will be in the Hampshire XC Champs race tomorrow, which is also my birthday, so the order of play is 7M of muddy XC, dinner out with mrs Al P (master al p with grandparents) and then The Hobbit in 3D
04/01/2013 at 23:06

Its been a brilliant debate and I've really enjoyed seeing everyone's varying view. I'm certainly learning a lot!

I've nothing to add as I know nothing, but just wanted say there's been some great posting!

04/01/2013 at 23:13

Certainly has!

I'll start posting training miles from tomorrow - the road to my debut marathon begins!

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