Sub 3

For anyone trying to crack the 3 in any marathon anywhere in the world

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07/02/2013 at 12:44

Wardi thanks that sounds like great advice. Will start timing my shorter attempts and see if I can make some progress.

Jools I hate having to decide paces to run when going for a PB etc. My best runs and fatest runs have always come from starting on the slightly conservative side and negative splitting. I know some people prefer to blaze out fast and hang on.

07/02/2013 at 12:45

LS21 - thats a great story, I went to Amssterdam for my stag do, I'll regale a few of those stories to you over a pint one day.

Edited: 07/02/2013 at 12:46
07/02/2013 at 13:26

Hi all,

I'm new to this thread but have been lurking for a while. Seriously envious of the pace that you guys (and gals) are setting, and also the crazy mileage. Must say, the pace of this thread is also pretty rapid!

I'm doing Brighton Marathon this year for the third time. Managed to go sub-3:15 last year so decided I need to push it this year. I feel sub 3:10 is doable now however I need to set my sights high hence me hanging around here!

My current training is as below:

Lombster wrote (see)
  • Mon -  2x3 mile run to work and back
  • Tue - Run with club (speed intervals) 7.5 miles covered (1 warmup, 5 intervals (inclusive of rest), 1 cooldown)
  • Wed - 1x3 mile run to work, 1x6 mile run back from work
  • Thu - Run with club (hills) Same distance as Tue
  • Fri - 2x3 mile run to work and back
  • Sat - Long run 12-22 miles
  • Total distance 48-58 miles depending on long run

I'm thinking of substituting the club run on a Thursday with a medium run of 12-15 miles as my plan is lacking on this side.

I have Tunbridge Wells Half in a couple of weeks so that will be my first real test to see what my pace is like this year. I'm certainly running quicker so seriously hoping that translates into a quick (for me) time.

Happy for anyone to offer suggestions or critique my current plan, but will be hanging around in any case to pick up some tips.

Happy running!

07/02/2013 at 13:31

LS21 - we were there in 2011. did the mara in the morning, and then went back to the hotel to change before the ladies ran/finished the half. Upon finding some friends supping in the lovely Leidesplein sunshine, the inevitable happened. Lots of beer and late for the ladies finish. Oops.

This year, we discovered Jupiler (which is probably just a shit standard lager, but we got a bit obsessed) and drank the town dry of it after the race - incurring further better half wrath after I wrongly and aggressively accused a taxi driver of ripping us off. (So I'm told).

Germany is always good for a bit of ale though.

07/02/2013 at 14:41
Dan A wrote (see)

Two celeb spots on this morning's jog.  Ed Warner (UKA chairman), followed closely by that playboy bird I mentioned a few pages earlier. 

I don't think I'd recognise either of them.  Or Ed Warner!  *chortle*

Jools - smash it!

Lombster - Hi!  A quick glance at the schedule and I immediately thought about the lack of a long run mid-week, so I think your Thursday plan is a good one.  The only issue might be with doing your proper long run on the Saturday if you've only got one day in between.  I'd make sure Friday's runs are very easy, possibly drop one, or is there an option to do the long run on Sunday?  Other than that, looks pretty sound.  *edit*  Or keep the club run on Thursday and run long Tuesday?

Edited: 07/02/2013 at 14:42
07/02/2013 at 15:01
I can definitely shift around the midweek runs but prefer to stick to Saturday long runs in order to have the remainder of the weekend for rest.

Would this work or is Tue-Thu schedule a bit too much?

Mon - 2x3 miles easy
Tue - Club 7.5miles. This week was 2,4,6,6,4,2 intervals with 2 mins rest inbetween
Wed - 12-15 miles
Thu - Club 7.5 miles. Tonight is 10 mins out, 10 mins back, 10 mins hard (the 7.5 miles includes warmup/cool down)
Fri - 2x3 miles easy
Sat - Long run
Sun - Rest
07/02/2013 at 15:08

I think a Wednesday long run could work, but it would be too much to keep the Thursday session.  So you'd effectively be doing two quality sessions back-to-back, which can be useful. This is pretty much what I got in the habit of doing for my first marathon following a Hal Higdon plan: either a tempo or race-pace run on a Saturday, effectively going out for the long run the next day on tired legs.  If you did the same sort of thing Tuesday/Wednesday, I'd make Thursday's running easy.

07/02/2013 at 15:09

Lombster - I'd agree with you and Phil's recommendation(s). The mid week long run, not only adds mileage but is a good opportunity to try and build some tempo (either @ threshold or MP) in too as that's lacking from your plan too in my opinion. You can always add MP (and I'd recommend it) into the last hour of long runs too to get used to the pace on tired legs.

What's your plan for Tunbridge Wells Half? MP run or PB effort?

07/02/2013 at 15:13

Lombster - welcome! I'd have a play around with what works best re your midweek long run. For info I tend to do mine on Wednesday, even though this is our club's weekly hill or speed session (it alternates week to week), The club session is at 7:00, so what I usually do is meet a friend at 6:00, do an hour first and then do the club session but don't go daft doing either the speed or hills. You can still work hard and put some effort in, but don't go full beans type thing. This works well for me - we did 15 miles last night with 10 hardish hill repeats. Is there anyone else at the club training for a Spring Mara who's a similar standard? If so maybe you could agree to meet up with them pre-club and do likewise? Even if it's half an hour before and then a slightly longer cool down you'll still get to 12-14 miles or so which is perfect for a midweeker in my view.

07/02/2013 at 15:38

Lombster - welcome! I'd agree with LS, convert your Thursday club run into a medium-long run by adding a couple of miles before and after. I find this mentally very easy as I just take a slightly longer route to the club, run with them for an hour, then a slightly longer route home, and without thinking you've done 12M.

I agree with Saturday long runs - get it done early so you can enjoy the rest of the weekend!

07/02/2013 at 16:00

Amsterdam was ace! The weather was grand in 2010 too. I seem to think we sat in the stand watching the finish of the HM in the sunshine, not having to get lots of layers on to keep the hyperthermia away. It was a special day, I had a good, and more importantly enjoyable run, my mate did a 2:41 debut. Then we did the rehydration bit too, not as flamboyantly as Dids or LS21, but enough. I seem to remember nearly getting wiped out by both the tram and bikes!!

Cracking place and run. But...... mmmmm German beer!?!

07/02/2013 at 17:16

Thanks for the welcomes and great advice. I think I'll convert the club run on Thursday into a long run. I'll have to add on at the end of the session as I barely make the start as it is due to getting back from work!

I'm starting to add some MP into my long runs which I've never done before. To be honest, I've never done that many long runs in my training (only 1 or 2 for my previous marathons!) which has always impacted me post-15 miles! Plus I've never paced myself well so always do a positive split (I do get carried away at the start!) with at least 15 minutes between first half/second half times!

Johnas - For the TW Half I'll be going for a PB

07/02/2013 at 17:25

Sounds like a good plan as does adding some MP. I'm still struggling to comfortably sit at my MP in sessions (either too fast or too slow!) but will get a good MP run at Wokingham this Sunday so a good chance to practise

Lombster wrote (see)
Johnas - For the TW Half I'll be going for a PB

Good luck (I'm Chief Marshal so making sure it's a safe and enjoyable race for you all again this year!). If you havent done it before, we've got a great 1.30 pace team that will get you round on target even with Spring Hill @ 10K.

Edited: 07/02/2013 at 17:44
07/02/2013 at 19:01

Lombster Is there anyway that you could extend your Monday and Friday commutes?

8 (7:26 mpm average) commute this morning to be repeated again tomorrow with some faster bits legs allowing.

TR
07/02/2013 at 19:24

I agree 2x3M twice a week is a bit of a waste of time in marathon training, maybe 8+5 or even 10 and 5 on the Monday.

Abo has closed already !

07/02/2013 at 20:33

LJ - that's a good number for a wednesday

Lombster - you'll get plenty of good advice on here

LS21 - great story, haha. There was a bloke in one of the boozers after I'd run Amsterdam who said he'd struggled with the race because he'd gone out and got hanging the night before. My mate said "why didn't you just wait an extra day ffs" lol

Jools - Dan is right, you should put in a pb effort at Wokingham and see what you come out with.

Amsterdam is a great race, well organised with a quality start and finish. Like others have said the post race party isn't too bad either Frankfurt looks ace and sounds great from those I know who've run it. That finish looks ballistic!!!

Club session last night, first "effort" for a bit on a short tempo. Enjoyed it but sadly the hamstring didn't the next morning. Maybe not the most sensible thing but been back running a decent amount so got to test the water at some point. Got xc on sat where I'm just going to trott round as the team needs the points but I'm giving myself another 10 days - 2 weeks and if I still have any hamstring issues I'm calling it a day on London this year. I can take it or leave it to be honest and with having loads of study on I'm not sure I'm that fussed about banging loads of miles out everyday, priorities and all that. Want to get myself sorted again and then gear up for some fell running in May in the lakes. May just be injury pessimism getting the better of me but fairly realistic about things really. Will see how things pan out next 10 days or so and make a decision then.

A race target for me is one of the lakes A race classics in either Wasdale or Borrowdale in August.

Edited: 07/02/2013 at 20:49
07/02/2013 at 21:54
Ello, ello, ello - what's going on ere then?

Home Run - by a great co-incidence it seems your murder case has hit the main headlines again. A witness has finally named him. Got to be good for your hopes of the TV series.
07/02/2013 at 21:58

RS.. sorry to hear you're still struggling, hope you can get it sorted.

Jools.. agree with the others, shame to miss an opportunity when you're in your best form.

LS21.. cracking tale from Old Amsterdam, though I prefer Shaky's 'This Old House' meself.  'Ain't got time to fix the shingles, ain't got time to fix the floor' has surely got to be to be one of pop music's finest lyrics.

Welcome Lombster & Johnas.

LJ.. nice long run yesterday, even if pitiful!

DanA.. I may outdo you in terms of totty company on my runs but I can't match your Playboy girlie!

When I did a PB in Berlin many years ago I managed to keep drinking until I realised my eyes could no longer stay open at 3.30am.

7m on the treadie tonight inc. 6 x 800 @ 6:18 pace.

 

07/02/2013 at 22:06

13M @ 7.44m/m (flat route).  I love heading out for a run at 7pm after I've been working for 11 hours.  Still, I definitely earned the Chinese takeaway

Welcome Johnas and Lombster.  T'others have given sage advice.

07/02/2013 at 22:26

 

Wardi - the train ticket is booked and have a place to say so the option is still there

Jools - I moaned the other night going for a run late at night with a club mate up here but actually really enjoyed it especially as its so quiet.

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