Sub 3

For anyone trying to crack the 3 in any marathon anywhere in the world

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26/08/2013 at 00:31

No real training since GUCR at end of May, but have entered New Forest Mara as something to train for in the short term and pace a colleague at sub4, and i always enjoy pacing, some awesome running being done by you guys+girls. Land of plod here at the mo. 

26/08/2013 at 13:42

Nice HM session CW (I'm impressed how quickly you're getting back into things after the BGR), great tempo bufo (do you have any races targeted?) and very good 21 milers TR and postie.  HR, sounds fantastic and hope you're having a nice time - I have to say, if I could replace the Regents Canal cyclists with turtles...TT, how's the training going?

Well, Berlin it is then...

Another heavy week coming up at work so in light of the easier week last week I decided to exploit the bank holiday sunshine and front end the effort.  First time I've ever done one of the marigold/BAC sessions.  Al_P, I understand why you said they take a bit of recovering from and you really have to limit yourself to 2 sessions a week!  I tried the 25 min / 4 x 5 min (2 min recoveries) / 25 min "sandwich" session.  Hard work!  I was feeling quite good so (given I won't be doing any more serious effort till Saturday) pushed it a bit, with the paces coming in slightly under MP/HMP.  Very bizarrely, both the paces for the 2 "MP" sections and those for the 4 "HMP" intervals were (respectively) exactly the same - 5:53m/m for the 25 min "MP" tempos and 5:35m/m for the 5 min "HMP" intervals.  Half an hour steady at 7:35m/m to get home - though I couldn't resist adding an extra mile loop on the end to make it 20 total (overall 6:32 average).  

I still think 5:55s are a bit of a punchy target to sustain for over 2 1/2 hours but we'll see how things are in a couple of weeks.  Looking forward to taking it easy for the next few days!  (I think the biggest reason things seem to be going quite well this time round is I've put much more emphasis on recovery).      

Hope you're all enjoying the fleeting sunshine...

26/08/2013 at 17:32

Lev - that made me laugh ! more emphasis on recovery, not from the sessions you've been posting up. Well done on doing the BAC session, either LJ or AL_P said they were tough solo.

first OW swim of the year for me today, seeing as we went to the beach. Did about 45mins.

26/08/2013 at 17:43

Ha!  Well called, TR.  I suppose what I meant was aside from those sessions, it's been either 4 mile recoveries at over 8m/m pace or days off.  None of the P&D "general aerobic" 8 or 9 milers and so my weekly mileage is capped at around 60 miles.  Fair point though...   

26/08/2013 at 17:53

I guessed that you meant that.

26/08/2013 at 20:12

Lev - Doing the Moray half marathon this weekend but main focus is getting ready for uni cross country, with the varsity match at the end of November. After that main target will be the London marathon next year, though will be plenty of other races between now and then.

5+7.5 commute today, pushed the pace a bit on the way back and some strides afterwards. Legs felt a lot better than I was expecting after last week and the hills yesterday, will do a moderate session tomorrow evening (probably a load of short and fairly quick intervals) and then just do steadies until Sunday's race.

27/08/2013 at 07:14

Day 6 of holiday disrupted running. Getting the miles in when I can, but not of great quality. (Touring round Bergamo, Verona, bologna, Florence..... So far).

i find myself in Portovenere today. There's a one way narrow flat road of about 1200m along the sea front that I am hoping to do some intervals on, but will have to share it with cars/buses/dozy Italians.... Already sounds busy outside.

Failing that, a 2mile hill loop..... Which I'd really rather not have to do.

Also, hotel breakfasts tend to finish at 10am, and my Yorkshire upbringing means I'm loathe to miss them as they are included in the room rate. that curtailment is playing havoc with the mileage.

Alcohol and ice cream battering the weight loss.

i despair.

27/08/2013 at 08:06

HR - tough life....

Lev - well done on getting that session done, sounds hard, especially on your own.

LD - do the hilly loop. What's wrong with getting the run finished in time for last orders at breakfast?

Nearly 4 hours on the bike yesterday. Didn't eat or drink enough, so the last 45 mins on my own after my mates had gone home were tough.

Sunday was 2 hours on the turbo after I looked out the window at 7:30am (chucking it down, again), including 3x20min efforts in time trial position. Made a nice puddle in the garage - TR would be impressed as I had no form of entertainment, although I can now recite everything printed on the cardboard box which was on the floor in front of the turbo.

27/08/2013 at 09:42

Nice sandwich session Lev_. Training is decent, considering, I guess, cheers. Decent volume last week, but light on sessions.

I'd have rather gotten wet Padams, though I guess cycling in the rain is a lot trickier than running in it.

Hectic couple of days here. Reading Festival Friday, a food festival Saturday, and then 2 days of working on the front garden (involved a lot of lifting, digging and swinging a sledge hammer around). Didn't seem to do my back any harm, though I generally ache all over.

Achilles is improving, which is positive. My osteo recommended a cream called Traumeel. It's an anti-inflammatory made from natural extracts, etc - similar to Arnica (which is in fact one of the ingredients). It definitely works better for me than any of the synthetic anti-inflammatory creams I've tried.

27/08/2013 at 10:02

I wondered where Dids was

Padams - nice work. 4hrs outside and then 2hrs on the turbo inclding the box revision, maybe I should have got my eldest to do his GCSE revision on there ! Only been on my turbo once in recent months, maybe I need to get on there a few times in the next couple of weeks.

TT - maybe the front garden strength training did you good.

couldnt decide wether to do a midweeker or some reps today (as I havnt done any in ages), ended up with a 2M w/u, 16x0.5M/30 sec jog, 2M w/d compromise. So 12M in total. Legs were a bit fatigued on the last few, average was slightly quicker than 6mm, so probably ~HMP.

27/08/2013 at 12:21

Cracking stuff Lev_. And a lot of bike hours there, Padams.

Good luck with the varsity match prep, bufo. I didn't try training seriously until I was in my 7th year(!) and then got horribly overtrained, so I missed it. Should have done more running and less beer/curry consuming in my earlier years, but there you go.

LD didn't one of our greats do speed training down the middle of a suitable A road at 4am when it was quiet? Sorted.

TR -- wow, that was a lot of reps, and at a good speed too. Impressive.

My calves are DOMSd by trying to run fast on Sunday; I did a 5M pootle at 9 m/M yesterday (so I must qualify as a Kenyan elite) but had a rest today. Back to it tomorrow though. I did have a grumbly knee too (TR), but that seems better today.

27/08/2013 at 12:42

TT -  I found Comfrey "bone-knit" cream was really useful with my achilles. Maybe one to try - glad to hear it's improving though.

Lev- Tough session.

TR - Likewise

87 for me last week finishing up with a 20 miler. Also did a cheeky 36:45 for a track 10k on Saturday pacing some club-mates and the GF around to a sub 37 time. 5:55 pace for the first time 2 months didn't feel too bad so think there's still a glimmer of hope for Frankfurt.

27/08/2013 at 13:00

Very nice reps TR. Yeah, stuff like that is always good for an all over workout. At the very least it has made everything ache enough that the 'problem' areas are less noticeable

Cheers for the suggestion HH. I had been using Comfrey ointment before the osteo's suggestion actually as I had some laying around. I found it was taking the edge off but not really improving it. It sounds like you're coming along nicely! Nice time from your GF too.

Edited: 27/08/2013 at 13:01
27/08/2013 at 18:25

CW - grumbly knee, from the long run ? I was a bit pushed for time today, but if I could do 20 x 05M reps then that'd be 10M at ~HMP which should do me good if I could do that a few times before any Autumn 1/2 mara's.

HH - your girfriend is speedy.

TT - You might ache more by tomorrow.

27/08/2013 at 18:38

or is 10M at ~HMP impossible in training, even with a 30sec jog every 0.5M ?

27/08/2013 at 18:57

TR -- looking back at my log, my knee has been slightly iffy on and off for a few weeks now. Not really affecting things though. When I had more bother with it a couple of years ago, I realised the answer was slow running (because you hardly flex your knee when going very slowly). That's not a good answer now as I want to get quick again.

-- is 10M at ~HMP impossible in training, even with a 30sec jog every 0.5M ?
What answer do you want:
a) it's almost impossible so only the finest afleets can do it
b) it's impossible so your HMP will be even faster than you think :- )

Edited: 27/08/2013 at 18:57
27/08/2013 at 19:31

CW - probably all that hill/stairs running. Option a I guess then !

27/08/2013 at 20:48

CW - tight quads pulling on it maybe?

TR - I hope not. Most of the grunt work was Sunday, so fingers crossed! Personally I'd have found the idea of 10m @ ~HMP as 20 x 0.5m (30s) too hard.
If I had to do 10m @ ~HMP I'd either go for a Canova style (10 x 1m @ HM (3mins recs)) or something like the Mark Plaatjes ('93 world champ) Marathon Indicator - 10 x 1m @ MP (1min recs).

Some quicker running on the way home. 1.35m @ 5:19m/m / 1m @ 5:12m/m / 1.15m @ 5:20m/m / 1.25m @ 5:26m/m. Total of 4.75m @ just inside 5:20m/m.

The odd 1st and 3rd reps were because I planned 1.25m, wasn't paying attention, and ran too far, so balanced it out on the 3rd. I wanted to try a pace around current 10k pb (5:22/3), but this was a bit harder than I would have liked, though partially due to the stiffness. I was slowing a bit on the 4th rep for the effort, despite the long recoveries, so called it a day. Tbh, it's quicker than I thought I would manage at the start of the run, so not to be sniffed at.

27/08/2013 at 20:56

TT - so 4M at ~ 10k pace, no wonder it was tough.
The 10x1M session is something I've done before and it was probably between HMP and MP. Maybe today wasnt ~HMP then, I'll have to find a better pace predictor before Gosport, main thing was it was some time in the hurt box, which I rarely do.

27/08/2013 at 21:39

CW - Similarly delayed running seriously a bit, though only until the end of my 2nd not 7th year. Been more consistent in training since then but not completely focussed on it, will see what happens this time with the most consistent high mileage I've done and will also hopefully be a good base for marathon training next year.

4+10 inc. 16x 1min fast/1min v. easy - didn't push it too hard but nice to do some quicker running.

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