Sub 3

For anyone trying to crack the 3 in any marathon anywhere in the world

99,881 to 99,900 of 116,978 messages
27/09/2013 at 16:38

Gah! bad news Lev_. Best of luck with the heel and flexor. 

27/09/2013 at 16:55

happy birthday to JH1

Lev - hope it comes good in time.

Padams - good idea, TT bike on turbo to get used to the position.

I noticed that Dids was still missing, we have feelings, he cant just drop us and pick us up again when it suits him !

swam a bit better today, hope to get back to it a bit this weekend.

27/09/2013 at 17:17

Oops, I noticed the champs entry query but not the birthday part of your post, JH1.  Many happy returns!

27/09/2013 at 18:57

From your post JH1 I reckon your birthday is tomorrow - either way have a good one!

Charlie.. just found a good offer on the X-Talon 190's on 3rd row down on this page, are these one of the shoes you like?

Wretched luck Lev, hope you are ok soonest.

27/09/2013 at 19:30

Lev, I have my fingers crossed for you. Maybe a nice hot radox bath will help. If not, at least it will be relaxing. 

Great PB Jools, I think it's about a full minute faster than mine. Your 10k PB certainly needs some revision!

Happy Birthday JH1!

27/09/2013 at 20:57

Lev_ -- cripes, hope those bodily insults are forgotten as soon as you've crossed the line. Have a good one!

JH1 -- many happy returns.

Wardi -- yes, go for them. They have incredible grip -- I've just not bothered getting any spikes for cross-country as these seem just as good, and they are marvellous for anything remotely multi-terrain (e.g. in a park XC where there is a bit of solid path available, those wearing spikes might still have to run on the grass whereas in these you can hoof it along the tarmac just as well). I used XTalon212s (same sole but thicker padding) for my BGR as they offer better protection against sharp rocks, but I keep my XTalon190s pristine for any kind of off-road race. Either work excellently on snow and ice, too. However, the grippy studs will wear down if you bang out too many road miles in them.

27/09/2013 at 21:03

Happy Birthday JH1

16 mile commute to and from work today. Nice easy 5 tomorrow and 17 on Sunday.

27/09/2013 at 23:13

Joolska: well done. Pb is a pb. And I'll let Dids know about that!

JH1 - happy birthday

Tim nice commute

Lev_ shit re the cyclist. That is an absolute bummer. Fingers massively crossed for you. Re. carb loading I'm beginning to question the validity of it tbh but I'm probably in a minority. I reckon if you just eat normally and cut the training down the body loads the glycogen, but then like Padams I probably eat quite a lot of carbs anyway. So basically once more I'm in agreement with Padams / TR on this.

Al_P - alas not 2 x 14m It was 8.5 /5.5. Training here is absolutely ridiculous. Yesterday afternoon I decided to add a double by going on the treadmill, thinking outside was too hot which it is. On the treadmill there was no aircon and only the treddy fan which is next to useless. So sweat was flying everywhere. I thought a way of indicating this was that when I got back to the flat my shoes were as if I'd walked through a lake: sodden. That was sweat. You can imagine how the shorts and shirt were. Great good luck for Frankfurt. Like the sound of the road trip.

TT - hope the blister is ok. And ouch re the wasp sting

DanA - maybe taper for it? Just a thought, you understand

SJ - all sounds good. Which new shoes?

CW - likewise to the other nigglers, hope all ok esp with the hamstring

Andy D - welcome back and seems like a pretty good excuse for absence to me

Wardi - reminds me of Devon days with the narrow lane

TR - the legs will come back

Re grinding, a few years ago IIRC there was a report that sex before an event improved performance: presumably at the event they meant?

Oooh by the way on carb loading: a lot of the elites now go straight out the door for a couple of minutes jogging first thing race day then have their brekky. It gets the metabolism firing ... allegedly   Right, 06:15. Time for a run or it will be too damned hot.

Edited: 27/09/2013 at 23:14
27/09/2013 at 23:42

HR - good stuff, all that running in the heat will pay dividends on a cool day at Abo, you'll barely need a drink. Marigold already does that race day pre breakfast run.

28/09/2013 at 07:18

FWIW I think Marigold's 2 mile jog on race day is insane . I begrudge burning my carefully-stored glycogen just walking from Blackheath station...

(Edit: admittedly he seems to be able to perform rather well.)

Edited: 28/09/2013 at 07:18
28/09/2013 at 07:56

I had in mind something more akin to 5-10 mins ultra-slow jogging although come to think of it that would probably be 2 miles for Marigold 

Thanks TR, we'll see buddy. I've no idea what is going to happen to be honest. I've crucified my body out here: the most exhausting experience I can recall. Whether I get to the line mashed or fresh is going to depend on a super-aggressive taper I think. I'm going for two weeks' taper (not three) with at least one additional rest day to my norm (two rest days in race week) so my plan will drop suddenly to around 45mpw in the penultimate week and then just 18 miles in the final week up to the race. Mind you, I think P&D are stark raving bonkers with their race week mileage. I mean, if you look at their equivalent plan to the mileage I've done they would have you doing nearly 70 miles in race week including the marathon. I think that's utterly nuts.

Edited: 28/09/2013 at 10:14
28/09/2013 at 11:18

CW - not as insane as all those match burning 26M training runs, ha ha. You're not going to be burning glycogen stores in a 2M jog or a walk from the train station.

HR - good idea,on the taper. Keep the frequqncy up but drop the mileage off.

3hrs bagged on the bike, after about an hour I started to feel pretty good.

28/09/2013 at 11:29

13.5M for me.  Legs were a bit heavy at the start, but gradually loosened up.  Back over 20M for the first time post-injury tomorrow...

28/09/2013 at 11:42

HR: I'll be happy to be able to follow P&D to the last step after only being able to run 6 miles in the last week the last time due to my dodgy achilles. A whole week off takes tapering to the extreme.

28/09/2013 at 12:50

Heyup! did a shit half marathon in Warrington a few weeks back. Was clearly knackered. So been not thinking too much about running, and just concentrated on some stonkingly good speed sessions.

Anyway, got a turd in the toaster last tuesday. Bizarrely whilst just warming up, I strained an abductor muscle. Gave it a good few days off and then strained it again this Tuesday. It's really a mild pull, but at a shit time. So, rather than getting mad i decided to go back to plan A and enter the Istanbul marathon in November.

Er indoors was unhappy about the cost, so I dug out a Moog Synth I bought in 1981 which has spent time in various cupboards and garages for the last 30 years, stuck it on eBay and, hey presto, £670 richer ONE HOUR later.

Turkish delight will be celebrating a sub 2:35 outside the Blue Mosque then.

28/09/2013 at 13:43

tough break Dids.  sounds a good back up plan and a nice little earner  what else u got tucked away in those cupboards?

Joolska, nice PB the other day, can't have done you too muhc harm the minor injury setback then, good stuff.

great training as per from many others, and hope Lev you manage to cane the marathon tomorrow and the accident is just some bumps and bruises.

i've had a bit of a setback the last couple of weeks too.  have had something wrong ith my back for 4 weeks now, but had been continuing on trying to ignore it.  saw physio a couple of times 2 weeks ago, but she got worried due to some of m symptoms/referred pain and sent me away to get a referral from my GP to see a specialist.  saw an orthopaedic physician on Friday who has diagnosed some sort of costovertebral injury, and so now i am off to see another specialist on monday, with a view to some sort of pain relieving and steroid injection i think guided by x-ray into the joint.  if that stops the pain (it's got so bad that i havent really been able to sleep for 2 weeks, just a few hours then wake in pain and cant get back to sleep - the painkillers i've been given dont really do much).  if the injection relieves the pain - its partly diagnostic/ocnfirms whats wrong, and hopefully it will mean that i can move on witht he right rehab and strengthening and just get back to normal again.  have been recommended to bin the running though for now and i'll try anything so haven't run since Monday.  typical i had entered a 10km race next weekend to see where i am at!

c'est la vie, just as i was starting to feel a little stronger!  cant wait for the injection now though to be honest.  really feel for people who suffer chronic pain all the time, i'm going nuts after just a few weeks.

anyway, good luck any weekend racers, and long runners hope its all good.

happy bday JH1 and wonder how CD is getting on.

Edited: 28/09/2013 at 13:45
28/09/2013 at 14:01

That's a bit sh!t, Selbs.  Hope the injection does work and then you can start to get fixed.

28/09/2013 at 14:51

Ok - I need some advice. I am doing my first marathon next weekend and am not sure how to pace it. I have done one 20 miler and three 18 milers in the build up, all at 7.30 miling. I did a half marathon last year in 83.09, but haven't raced recently. I have been averaging around 40 miles a week. 

Should I go out at 7.30 miling in the race and try to enjoy my first marathon experience or should I go with the 3 hour pacemaker?

28/09/2013 at 16:56

Welcome middle distance. They say that a marathon is a race of two equal halves: the first 20... and the last 6. Nearly everyone slows down in the second "half". Some blow up truly spectacularly, and end up painfully shuffling the last couple of miles with cramping legs. It's usually worse in the first one, before you have an idea of how to pace it. By going a little faster early on to save a couple of minutes, you risk blowing up and losing tens of minutes later. On the other hand... an 83 min half is about the right ball-park for a 3 hr marathon.

So it's a bit of a conundrum, easier next time when you can revise your target in the light of experience. So... if you found the 20M @ 7:30/M easy, then you can probably afford to go out somewhat quicker. If it felt tough, that's probably fast enough. You might want to bear in mind the London good for age (automatic entry) targets are all over 3 hours, considerably more depending on your age and sex -- so that could make (say) 3hr15 a satisfying yet more manageable target than 3hr00.

TR -- I disagree! The 2 mile jog will put a dent in your glycogen reserves on the day, maybe equivalent to (say) a mile at race pace -- so if the wheels are going to come off, they'll start coming off sooner. The 26M training runs several weeks previously might or might not have had benefit (I think they did), but they won't diminish glycogen on the day. In fact they'll spare it by making the legs better at burning fat.

selbs -- good luck with the back. I'm wondering if my touch of sciatica is related to back-ache from unaccustomed driving and sitting in dodgy chairs on a recent business trip. (Different to yours.)

LD -- insert "organ" double-entendres here.

Jools -- it's going to be a big mileage weekend for you.

HR -- I'm with you on really cutting back in taper week, though I do believe in still doing some sharp stuff (so race pace feels easy on the day, initially).

6M pootle for me this morning, back of my thigh still iffy. I fancy doing another 20M quality endurance session on grass tomorrow including 10x(1km fast, 1km easy), leg allowing. Will see.

28/09/2013 at 17:33

Thanks CharlieW - I think I am veering towards erring on the side of caution for my first one and hope to get a sub-3.15. I am 41 so that would get me a good for age for London. A bit of me really wants to bag that sub-3 now though!!! I have never been very good at being patient!


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