Sub 3

For anyone trying to crack the 3 in any marathon anywhere in the world

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26/04/2014 at 18:56

HR I use the Garmin 910XT, find it very accurate and quick to pick up signal-alot better than my old forerunner 110.

It works well at lane and open water swimming and good enough on the bike for what I need. Its quite bulky (maybe thats what slowed me down in London), I took it to Botswana end of last year and it picked up signal where my forerunner didn't- found it invaluable when altitude made judging pace even more difficult- so may be a good bet for you travels. 

Got a good price by shopping around on the net, nearly half the advertised price

26/04/2014 at 19:37

That looks a very good bit of kit running eye. I don't know though if I can justify £170+ on a GPS watch though at my age and type of running hence the £123 for 310XT though

26/04/2014 at 20:13

Nice Park Run win Padams!

Cracking long run HR, I'm still in single figures post VLM.  Mind you the 'rest' period with beer, pizza & doughnuts ends this weekend!

Charlie.. I would echo what TR said.  My old injury mantra is 'when you think it's ok, give it another week to make sure'.  Good luck with the recovery anyway.

Speaking of Garmins, a technical enquiry.. my 310XT unpairs from the Antagent every time it has finished uploading something.  I recently got a new PC and downloaded the Antagent software afresh so I'm guessing it's the 310XT at fault.  I do re-set it to pair after every unpairing but the same thing happens the next time.  Thanks for any suggestions.

Edited: 26/04/2014 at 20:14
26/04/2014 at 21:04

If I wasn't on a brief mission I'd be on singles, pizza etc too Wardi. I can't say that inspires my confidence about the 310XT. Apart from that do you like it? I've read quite a lot of reviews about dodgy Garmin products. Maybe the Padams approach is the best.

Edited: 26/04/2014 at 21:05
26/04/2014 at 21:59

Good bit of nonchalant impressive speed there Padams. And great miles HR, what's next?

Wardi/TR -- quite right on the caution. The problem with my hamstring is that it doesn't hurt -- maybe no nerves in there -- so I can't tell if there's still a problem. I'm away looking after my elderly Dad, so wasn't going to run this w/e anyway, but he had a bit of a slump and when I grabbed him I did get a twinge, so I need to watch out.

On the 310XT (Wardi too), I'm fairly happy but have some gripes. Firstly, every few months it stops sync'ing properly with the PC -- which looks like a PC software problem, but is solved by doing a 'factory reset' on the watch (Google it, I can't remember the buttons), to clear some data the PC software objects to. Then a few other things that most people wouldn't notice:
a) lap button works on button up instead of button down -- too easy to fluff (as I did in VLM)
b) wiggly track line disappears quite often if following a course and zoomed into 500' scale or larger
c) can't set a waypoint unless have satellite position (hey I want to refer to somewhere I want to go tomorrow, and I'm indoors right now...)
d) if you're half way through editing a waypoint and it loses satellite lock, it throws away your painstakingly-entered coordinates/name etc at the next opportunity instead of letting you save
e) doesn't work with Mapsource/Basecamp software (301 did) for transferring waypoints
e) can't edit waypoint position in OSGB format because the letters aren't all available
f) calorie algorithm ridiculously different depending on whether HRM in use (not that I care what it says of course)
g) data transfer of big tracks v. slow via ANT+

-- none of these things were a problem with the 301, though that was less comfy on the wrist, had less battery life, was susceptible to water ingress and didn't do OSGB coordinates.

26/04/2014 at 22:25

Of course, more importantly than the technical specs, the 310XT is a very nice shade of orange - so goes well with the red shoes 

Edited: 26/04/2014 at 22:27
26/04/2014 at 22:37

Had a 310xt for quite a while now (only gps watch I've used) and generally works well, particularly useful for more interesting things as well with its long battery life (got 18hrs non stop out of it before) and unlike some can give grid reference/navigate to waypoints etc.

Have found the accuracy being a bit more wayward recently, if you don't give it enough time initially (even after finding satellites) can offset the route for quite a while before eventually getting back to more like it should be. Just got another update so hopefully that might improve, from seeing other peoples tracks the newer garmins do seem a bit better, and show a more consistent pace.

CW - Also found it a bit slow to transfer (particularly a while back) and sometimes had problems turning off when connecting to the computer, but now with garmin express (the new version of ant agent) and a recent update seems much better and pretty quick to download.

Would definitely say it's worth it if only £123 now though.

Another fairly easy week of running, does seem very noticeable when running less how steady pace gets  quite a bit quicker. Used an orienteering event I was planning today to get a hard 18 min run in round the course, slightly different when you know exactly where to go and don't really need the map.

Top end speed endurance seems to be lacking a bit (went off a bit quick and struggled towards the end) but hopefully 10k pace should be ok next Sunday, will get a couple of decent runs and a session in start of next week.

Edited: 26/04/2014 at 23:05
27/04/2014 at 11:48

HR - Impressive mileage and I really want to know what you're planning

I'm always a bit wary of Garmins but do long runs and races with a 610, mostly to look at data afterwards. At London, I switched off the autolap and was just pressing it myself each mile. When I uploaded the data afterwards, it turns out that it lost the GPS signal at 19 and never regained it! Wasn't the battery as it kept recording the laps so no idea what happened - just happy that I wasn't relying on the GPS.

Progressive 15 for me today which felt pretty good. Kent Roadrunner in 5 weeks and will definitely be racing it.

27/04/2014 at 12:11

Blimey, they should be paying folks to wear those gdagets if they have all those grpies ! I'll stick with my £20 casio sundial.

good one on the 15 Ryan, I'm not back up to double digits yet but I think my legs are ok again now.

BAC style 20min/7x3min/20min today but it was on the turbo not in the trainers, seemed to be just as tough though. 

27/04/2014 at 12:39

Hail Hail

First long-ish run since London yesterday.  If you fancy a giggle......

27/04/2014 at 12:56

RB - Jesus Christ.  EPIC!  Is that elevation total accurate?  Oofyah!

I've never used a Garmin 310XT but it looks a bit like my Timex RunTrainer in a very orange-trim kind of way, and I'm now pretty happy with it, so the Garmin 610 might become my back-up unit.  (I'd sell it on but the gaffer-tape style strap might have devalued it rather heavily.)

16 very easy miles this morning including a bit of off-road/hills.  The cold seems to have cleared, and the week ahead has enough quality in it to see whether my fitness has been affected at all: track Tuesday, a 3.5 mile club league race on Thursday (Assembly League, Victoria Park), which I'll do as a hard tempo effort, then the GEAR / BMAF 10k race on Sunday.

27/04/2014 at 13:58

Impressive RB. Didn't you do that race before?

75M on the bike this morning, longest ride of the year. Didn't feel too bad considering, which is lucky given it's only 4 weeks to the Tour or Wessex.

27/04/2014 at 15:34

RB I am both awestruck and immensely  jealous. I bet their 6000 calories is an under-estimate too given your ascent and hours on your feet. Love the euphemistic 'longish' That is really tremendous stuff. Don't suppose you took any pics on the way? Or did anyone else? Fantastic.

Thanks for the watch advice above. I'm pretty much settled on sticking with my current one because with km markers, stopwatch setting and, this time, a pace band I ought to be able to work it out.

So I think it's probably time to lift the veil. I was only being secretive in case it all backfired and I looked silly. That was particularly the case last week when I wanted to push up the volume but I seem fine after the 102 mpw.

I've entered the Riga marathon 3 weeks today. In the week after VLM I had little intention of racing another one in a hurry, but the 7 seconds began to bug me and although I had a fabulous day there were a few things which left me thinking I could possibly have shaved under 2:45. I wrote to some marathon organisers principally to see if I could get 1. a start and 2. a start with the elites / quickies. Only Riga replied so they got my vote. It's a proper IAAF bronze rated road race, like Edinburgh, and seems to be a quick course and a big event out there. I've been practising on cobbles up and down Guildford High St, the main advice from which I draw is to run over them, preferably as quickly as possible.

I may come unstuck. I may get injured. It may go pear shaped on the day. But, in a way does it matter? I've never been to Latvia and there's little to lose. I'm really happy with the 77' half marathon performance, as well as the VLM one, but I might as well have a go at the sub 2h45 now particularly because I don't want to train for a flat marathon this autumn/winter. Mont Blanc is the one I'd like to train for, then Frankfurt 2015 and London in 2016 so this is a serious shot.

I'm tweaking a few taper things:

  • 3 weeks out from VLM I ran a very hard half-marathon. Not so this time.
  • I was slightly worried the cheese and chocolate might have sent me up the scales but I'm already lighter than London. I pigged out a bit after the half.
  • The following week I ran 91mpw which in retrospect was too much. This coming week I'm cutting to around 78-80mpw
  • 2 weeks out from VLM I ran a 21 miler FFLR which I now think was a bit silly. Next weekend I'm cutting to a P&D easy 17 miler.
  • In the final week for VLM I ran 38mpw up to the race which was too much. This time I'll be doing Steve's Way® so around 28 miles up to race day.

We'll see if it works. Either way, the restaurant is booked for afterwards

Edited: 27/04/2014 at 16:33
27/04/2014 at 18:15

HRall good fun..... Good luck mate oh and by the way - the taper plan has to be combined with the 50 miler two weeks out otherwise it won't work 

27/04/2014 at 18:15

Oh and RB - quality mate!

27/04/2014 at 18:17

RB -- bejesus. The descent at 18M looks "interesting", and I note the overall elevation gain.

HR -- top tip: less crowd-pleasing, more HR-pleasing!

bufo -- ooh, hadn't heard about Garmin Express. Thanks for the tip.

Hamstring is symptomless since the twinge yesterday. I'll try a brisk walk tomorrow and then a tiny amount of jogging if that goes OK. I wouldn't be half so cautious if it was something that helpfully hurt a bit to let me know if it was in trouble...

27/04/2014 at 18:18

 Haha Marigold good one, and good point too. I guess 102mpw 3 weeks out for an old codger like me will have to do?  p.s. thanks for the good wishes, and likewise very much for you next week. Just read your comments in that Dave Norman article. Top advice.

CW yes I was going to mention that but thought it might sound like excuses. You're spot on - this one will be total focus on the day.

Edited: 27/04/2014 at 18:26
27/04/2014 at 18:42

HR, I suspected you were going to go for another marathon at short notice.  Can't wait to see how you get on.  My enduring memory of Riga is eating a lot of rye bread when stranded there for 3 days by Ryanair.  

Marigold, all the best for this week.  

Good to see PP back to it (annoyingly, I'm off to Berlin Thu afternoon or I'd see you at VP for the Assembly League) and great parkrun Padams.  

Bufo, what's the 10k?

Following a very easy first week post London, mainly involving lots of steak, cake and ice cream, have had a good week back at things.  Started my big summer mission, which is to work more on pushing myself/finding my limits a bit more before doing another shortish marathon cycle for Berlin (6 weeks + 2 week taper, starting at the v end of July).  I've still never raced a 10k or a 5k, so they're on the agenda - though I'm starting by doing more threshold work (whenever I've tried to run quicker intervals in the past I've got injured, so this seems a more prudent route in).  Hopefully will make a big difference come marathon training too, as it was only really in the last 3 weeks pre-VMLM that I introduced much sub-MP sharpening work.  

So, building on what I think worked for London, the plan is to do threshold/quicker stuff to effort around measured loops rather than running to Garmin pace (there's a useful c1.04m loop in Victoria Park).  So Wednesday was 4 loops at threshold effort, 3 min jog, then 1 further loop quicker (threshold loops came out at c5:32 pace).  Then Sat was 6 loops (i.e. just over 10k) threshold - though effort was a bit harder so prob more like 10 mile than HM effort, I'd imagine.  Came out at average of 5:30 pace.  Really didn't enjoy this - which is a sure sign it's good for me, so I intend to repeat this c10k threshold session quite a bit over the next few months.  Easyish 15m this morning straight out of bed on tired legs to bring up 60m for the week (perhaps a bit much really).  

Will take it easier this week.  Heading to Berlin on Thu to visit friends and watch avant garde theatre.  Depending on how late I'm out Saturday night, will prob do a half marathon race on Sunday (have done it the last couple of years).  Imagine I can beat my (probably rather soft) PB of 1:15:48 from the same course last year, but def won't be able to sustain 5:30 pace...

Any suggestions for good HM race week plans?  And some "starter for 10" 10k training sessions (my first ever 10k will be the Bupa one in a month or so, so I'm looking for ideas...)?

Hope all's well. 

27/04/2014 at 19:57

Lev - BUCS (University athletics champs) 10,000m, first track 10k I've done so will see how it goes (not particularly looking forward to 25 laps…).

HR - sounds like a good weeks training, and I'm sure you can go well under 2:45 when really going for the time.

Marigold - Good luck for the 100k, 48 laps makes a track 10k seem an interesting course.

RB - only long-ish? Looks like an awesome route with some rather fun looking hills.

27/04/2014 at 20:28
Evening. Good luck in the Mara in 3 weeks HR. You will have good fitness in you legs. You could do some serious business over there.

Well I had a brilliant run today at Plymouth half, no pb (45 seconds short) but given the course difficulty and weather conditions, 1.25.29 was very good going. It was a real up and downer, with a steep uphill mile at the end. The winner ran in 68. I'm hopeful to flip that into a pb in June at the new Hackney Half. It improved my handicap on runbritain by 0.5 to 5.0 even. Not quite sure what it all means but it feels like progress.
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