Sub 3h15

Malcs Welcome. During particularly high mile weeks, I feel an ache in my calves, which goes as soon as I stop. I put this down to tired legs more than anything else. Ironically I also sometimes get the ache (it is an ache rather than a pain) on very slow recovery runs.

I am still running in shorts but am already stressing about returning to sunny Liverpool in two weeks. Would anyone recommend grips for running shoes?
http://www.snowandicegrips.co.uk/yaktrax-run-ice-grips-running-in-snow--ice-107-p.asp

Yes, cramp in the last 6 miles. Almost every time.

Seems to be all adding up to not enoughh endurance work. On one of the other threads it was suggested I should do more long runs. Only did 4 x 20 milers last year but the suggestion was that might be too few.

Thanks for your help!

Scooby Dudek - yes an ache is a better description. I only get it on the long runs at 15+ miles. I had assumed up to now that this was part of running distance and people just grit their teeth through it.

SlokeyJoe - haven't really thought about that but now you mention it I probably do have a low cadence. I certainly don't feel like I'm "powering" forward but my strides are definietly more on the longer side.

This is really useful info - many thanks indeed! 

Malcs - how many weeks buildup ? how many mpw ? how many runs/week ? how many midweek MLR ? if only 4x20 what were the other LSRs ? any MP running ? could be a lack of a few of them  ....also, I over-trained my quads before VLM 2011 with too much hard hill running and hard bike work before the taper and they were still sore on race day. So are you saying that you get this every campaign, or just the last one.

9.3 miles tonight (15km). I am really struggling to get myself out at the moment (can/should rest with campaign starting properly  in 2 weeks). However, once out I am really struggling to only run the distance planned. Plan was 7 miles tonight. Original plan was 35 for the week,will now be at least 40, maybe 45. I believe I am feeling the benfits of a month of steady running. Just need to keep my sensible head on.

I have also not drunk for 36 days (well it will be at midnight), but Christmas night out tomorrow, so my new found feeling of fitness (F3) may well be gone by Saturday morning.

Moof - made my blood boil as well. Not doing any of us cyclists any good that type of thing. That thing where the guy got hit and the driver was put on youtube and eventually fined £600 happened in the village where I work. Right outside my favourite spot for a nice lunch - Ferrari's restaurant in Bexley. It was all the talk when it happened.

I have run in tights the past couple of days - southern softie!

TR - last year I started late Nov. In past years I've started in Jan. So really a 16-20wk  buildup. MPW varied from 20-40. I was still playing rugby on a Saturday on and off too. My other LSRs were 3 x 15m and 3 x 18m. I alternated between 15m one weekend and 20 the next. 

I tried to do half my LSR at slower than MP and half at MP. I did not bad at keeping to this.

The soreness I've had in all of them. It's the same kind of pain I feel in the last few miles of each marathon but not as intense. 

It's becoming clear that I probably need to do alot more endurance and probably some strength work too. Plus my weekly mileage is not very high - no MLR, just 2-4 milers, 6 if I got the time.

It pains me to say it but I'm going to have to stop the rugby . I have to focus if I wante to achieve my goals and most I'll most certainly be giving up if I get to Paris.

moof - I'm going to have to try that, my midweek mileage is appalling.

Thanks for your help!

Malcs - Thought so. 20 to 40 mpw isnt enough, take out the long run and theres not much left, 2 - 4 milers are good for general health but not marathons. I've had quad soreness when I've run marathons off 3 runs/week but not when I've run 5 or 6 days. You need to run more frequently. Start off by upping the frequency and then the distances. If you can build to something like a 20, 14, 10 and a few 6 to 8s then you'll be much better prepared. Try for 6 to 8 20s too. Slow running is fine in training, the frequency and consistency matter more.

Thanks TR - I feel slightly embarrassed that it could be something so simple 

Don't be embarrassed Malc. Even us old (OLD) hands go into the same territory. The way I see it is that a 20 banged out that results in a stiff leg finish or stiff leg Sunday is a bonus run. Proper training. You've pushed it. Next week or 14 days later it will be better. Maybe best not to focus too hard on the end to end time, but the splits and how they fade with distance, even better if you can link them to heart rate. My best results were from a 6x 22 miler campaign, but with intervening weeks being a moderate 13/15 mile medium run.
TR summarises the basics nicely. I found that it was easier to run 6/7 days a week than it was to run 4. Because I knew that every day was a running day, except for the one carefully planned skive. A rest day was the period between an early 20m Saturday run and a late night Sunday run..

Blisters wrote (see)

except for the one carefully planned skive.

  nice!

Many thanks. I think I need to go back to the drawing board. It'll be very interesting to see what the coaches do with me if I make it through to the final 5. If not I've already learned loads from here and the other threads I've been posting on. Brace yourself for some more questions once I start trying out your advice

Thanks again!  

Malcs - you've got some great advice here. Definitely don't feel embarrassed - I think most people will be able to remember the point where the penny finally dropped.  I have been running for about 14 years but have learned more in the past two years than ever before.  Once you start to get it right everything just slots into place and running becomes so much more enjoyable.  The guys on here really know their stuff and are very supportive.  They've put up with me for years.    Think of this as just the beginning.  

Malcs I usually get cramp in the marathon but never in training or shorter distances. It's because my marathon training is usually under par. Even if I get the distance I don't work hard enough. But knowing the cause is one thing, correcting it implies a lot of hard work.

2.5 miles last night with my daughter who is keen for another go at the parkrun this w/end.

Thanks Minni - I was about to say it feels like the past 4 years have been a bit of a waste but then I have learned alot about how not to do it  

OO lets go - have you tried salt tabs or do you think electrolytes are not the cause? Must be great running with your daughter. My son asked me the other day if he could come running with me when he's a bit older which had me beaming. We did the Sports Relief mile but I can't wait until I can take him on a longer one - bit more of an adventure!

I'd also like to be able to play rugby alongside him but that means I have to survive another 8 years and the bruising is taking longer and longer to go down each season!