Sub 3h15

For anyone trying to crack the 3h15 barrier anywhere in the world

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13/08/2013 at 13:22

Gerard - I will bring both, but also I did ask her (above)!

13/08/2013 at 15:08

Lit - Good luck for tomorrow and I hope you run as well as you possibly can and same goes to SG. I look forward to both of your race reports!

I am desperate to get out but will wait another day.

Minni - That is far out! Hah, I live on a Island that is 45m2! Your plan to seek out hills has got me thinking I must start doing some hills too when I can.

 

13/08/2013 at 15:52

Minni - in preparing for Comrades I run hills as often as possible and also incorporated bigger hills into my training runs. My regular 20 mile route is undulating but I suspect flatter than when you say undulating.  I chose to run 4-6 decent incline in my longer runs of 70-100m ascent over a mile or so.  Also I did hill reps of 6-10 x2 minutes up a hill that is raises about 30m in 0.3mile horizontal.

Additionally 2 big skills I learnt for Comrades were pace control to effort and ascending/descening.

In flat road marathon we generally aim for consistant pacing.  That is not possible for Comrades obviously.  If you are aiming for a Bill Rowan which you are capable of then you will be typically running 8:40 to 10:00 pace on the regular parts of the course and as fast as 7:00 on some downhills and even 12:00 on some of the harder uphills.  Also I would recomend walk break as well.  By chosing to run on mixed terrain course, you get good experience of pacing to effort.

I do actually think there is skill to ascending and decending.  Ascending involves more power from the hamstring and glute than normal (this is the same as strength) and higher arms.  Descending a shallow gradient takes confidence to let yourself go and low arms.  Descending a steep gradient takes resistive braking from the quads - here excercises like lunges and box jump help.

I'm sure you already recognise that gradual progression on hill work is important to avoid injury.  Probably when you first start it you would slow down a bit but I think long term the strength benifits outweigh the short term slow down - I was able to set a mara PB by almost 10 minute after my first Comrades.

Edited: 13/08/2013 at 15:58
13/08/2013 at 15:57

I'm a big fan of hills and try and make sure some of my medium long and long runs incorporate proper hills (i.e. ones that slow you down a fair bit!).  I'm sure that the trail races I've been doing recently have made me stronger and helped me be in PB shape.  But I'm still cr*p at descents...

Blisters    pirate
13/08/2013 at 18:07

lurk. Just to prove I'm alive.

13/08/2013 at 20:01
Joolska wrote (see)

AR: Burnham Beeches is such a lovely course - well worth a day out!

 

That surely needs some emoticon () as the year I did it it was horrendously humid and the woods that seem to offer shade do not help, all they do is shepherd the humidity. lap 1 was easy, lap 2 a horror show. Others tell similar tales for other years. From their website:

The 2012 Half Marathon took place on one of the hottest days days the year, making the course much tougher than usual. Sunday looks to be a clear day after a wet Saturday = humidity.

13/08/2013 at 20:19

How's it going Blisters?

good luck to Lit and Speedy for tomorrow! Podium photos are expected...

Minni, how does the hill grading system work? 

I'm now determined (again) to build some strength in my flaky legs before stepping up the mileage again. I did the "Insanity Fit Test" DVD on Sunday night and was quite pleased with surviving a hard workout but I'm suffering now - shoulders, pecs and quads are all DOMSified. I'll be lugging weights round the garden like BikeIt before you know it.

13/08/2013 at 21:35

Trail shoes???? It's a Road Race League! I hear they may have changed the course (again - it's only been the same 2 of the 5 times I've run it I think), but unless they've re-routed it through a bog I won't be wearing trail shoes. 

I'm not sure I'll be much competition. I tried to run on the treadmill tonight and managed 2 and a half minutes before having to give up. I will run as Redhill need the points, but I'm not sure I'll be competetive. I'm packing the ibuprofen. 

13/08/2013 at 21:38

and the sandbagging begins 

13/08/2013 at 21:38

I've done BB on a humid day and it did get the better of me, but it's still pretty!

10M easy tonight was a vast improvement on 11M queasy on Sunday

13/08/2013 at 21:42

Blisters, I am up in your neck of the woods next week. Talking of hills, I've entered the Winchcombe 10k Hill climb, which I know from cycling days is a bit of a steep climb. Fancy it?

Following Badbarks impressive marathon pb, I've also ensured I run more hills and hill reps than normal to strengthen myself and prevent injury. I am mid way through the Hudson / Fitzgerald 5k - marathon book he recommended and am finding it really interesting useful. Definately up there with Daniels and P&D as a training guide.

Looking forward to the Lit V Speedy smack down. Is there a weblink to see it live?

13/08/2013 at 21:52
CC2 - Speedy Goth wrote (see)

Trail shoes???? It's a Road Race League!  

Well, that's what I thought when he said to wear trail shoes, which was why I wanted a sensible second opinion. I hope they have re-routed it through a bog though, as my lightest road shoes are a horrific neon yellow colour.

Hope you're feeling better tomorrow - if it's any consolation I'm also on the ibuprofen as I still have a pain in the arse from chronically tight glutes.

Keir, you would not catch me entering a race with the words 'hill climb' actually in the name.

TR
13/08/2013 at 22:00

Keir - hows that ankle ?

I spend most of my long run time running loops up and down the biggish hill near me, and run up and over it on my run commutes. The downhills are good for leg strengthening too. I dont think that I run enough flat long runs anymore though esp before VLM, the constant pounding of a flat 20 is very different to a hilly 20.

I did the IoW 1/2 on this coming weekend last year, I agree with PMJ that it was a bit warm and a bit hilly too, I'm going back again Sunday. I'm wondering if racing on hills is good for my legs as well as training on them, I did a 10M race on the South Downs Way a week ago and it was a bit tough.

13/08/2013 at 22:09

No longer a treadmill virgin!

AR - having convinced myself that anyone who takes to a treadmill just doesn't have the mental strength/commitment to get out there in all weathers it took your exploits to get me thinking. You must have really got inside my brain, so much so that I recently found myself looking at different treadmills in my local shopping mall.

Not wanting to lose too much form on our recent two week break to the west coast of America for once I took my running gear on holiday. I had noticed that some of the hotels had gyms and as a lot of the time we would be in the desert with temperatures predicted to be 40+ degs C outside running would be challenging.

So I lost my virginity in a hotel in the middle of the Mojave or was it the Nevada desert.

Had no idea how to work it so just ended up in manual and set the timer for an hour to see how I got on - incline set to 1 deg as per forum advice.

The hour passed by remarkably quickly, but when I tried to extend the time the machine just sulked - frustrating but have to say it was quite addictive. Next chance was in the gym overlooking the pool of The Tropicana Hotel on the Vegas strip.

This time I got up to speed a bit quicker and 8 miles knocked off in another hour session - so much easier to do speed work on the treadmill, progressively increased speed to finish at 6 min/m. (10 mph)

Maybe there is something in this treadmill running after all. 

13/08/2013 at 22:11

At this rate it will be a limp-off rather than a smack down! 

I really thought it was better today. I didn't feel it all during the day at work and the swelling has gone down, but as soon as I started running it hurt again. But I ran on it on Saturday when it was hurting, and didn't really notice it during the race. Probably because my lungs were on fire. Sadly that race was only 5 minutes long though. 35 mins plus will be rather a different matter,and my lungs probably won't hurt more than my leg to distract me.

13/08/2013 at 22:27

Blimey TR. 2 running races within 2 weeks! With VLM and Abingdon isn't that your quota for the year already used up? How'd you get on at the 10m?

Thanks for asking. The ankle was swollen on Sunday but got better with the rest as the day went on. I left it until Monday afternoon to do an easy 8 (well, 7.20m/m) and although it felt a bit tender at the start, was fine after a couple of miles. This morning was a progressive 10m (starting at 6.50m/m dropping 5sec per mile every mile) which I wasn't sure whether I would even attempt, but after the warm up was fine and I made it through to the end of 8miles before I mentally lost it (I do find the progressive runs hard). The ankle is bruised and tender when I touch it, but ok to run on, so in short, 98% better. 

13/08/2013 at 22:30
Joolska wrote (see)

I've done BB on a humid day and it did get the better of me, but it's still pretty!

10M easy tonight was a vast improvement on 11M queasy on Sunday

 

Philip_M_Jones wrote (see)
Joolska wrote (see)

AR: Burnham Beeches is such a lovely course - well worth a day out!

 

That surely needs some emoticon () as the year I did it it was horrendously humid and the woods that seem to offer shade do not help, all they do is shepherd the humidity. lap 1 was easy, lap 2 a horror show. Others tell similar tales for other years. From their website:

The 2012 Half Marathon took place on one of the hottest days days the year, making the course much tougher than usual. Sunday looks to be a clear day after a wet Saturday = humidity.

 

I did last years and it was really humid and hot. I will probably decide on the day. If a late night kills my interest I may end up  walking  the dogs round there. As Jools says, it is a nice place.

 Good to hear you are recovering Jools. Hopefully that is it now for this campaign.

 

One Gear  - I never intended you to step into the dark side  ........ but welcome. Finding how to switch off any time limits the gym/hotel put on the treadmill is the first bit of sorcery you have  to work on 

Edited: 13/08/2013 at 22:32
TR
13/08/2013 at 22:40

Keir - sounds pretty good then, back to bombing along already. Abo is 50/50 at the mo, not doing enough mileage, but we'll see what Sundays 1/2 turns up. The 10M was a track and trail race through woods etc up on the South Downs, 63min, no idea of how accurate it was but I came 5th and was 1st coffin dodger, it was hard work so thats good enough for me. Think I'm pretty running fit, I did a 5M race in 28:49 back in June, all races untapered of course.

14/08/2013 at 08:58

GM - Overall pace for the reps was roughly what I was aiming for, just a bit disappointed that they weren't more consistent. I'm a bit surprised how many races there seem to be on Jersey! I would be a bit cautious with the knee - maybe you  could do a slow MLR with the option to add a few miles on the end if all is well?
Minni - I'm very fortunate to live only just over a mile away from a parkrun.
AR - good dreadmill session as ever. Burnham Beeches sounds like it ought to be a horse race!
Jools - get well soon.
SJ - thanks for reminding me why I don't do workouts!
OG - another one gone over to the dark side!
Speedy - hope you're OK in time for the smackdown.
9 slow miles d&d.

14/08/2013 at 09:14

Thats a nice 5m time and I guess a pb TR? You're having a storming year. 

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