Sub 3h15

For anyone trying to crack the 3h15 barrier anywhere in the world

501 to 520 of 38,225 messages
15/12/2010 at 14:04
MsE wrote (see)
(Looking around for the thread Guinea Pig, Steve, but unable to see him anywhere to ascertain how his training is coming along...)

Think we might have scared him off.

 Did anyone remember to let him out of his cage?

15/12/2010 at 14:23

Nice finish to the 21 miles there Poacher.

MsE - Tall, heavy, biomechaniclly suspect, injury-prone heel-striker but seem to be able to cope with a reasonable number of slow miles.

Clearly, I need to be careful where I choose to run when next in Bristol

Impressive 10K there Lunaman - what were the conditions like and how were the splits?

Tempo session today.  Thought I'd try the treadmill with the middle 6K of 14K as the tempo effort.  So after a 4K warm up, ramped up the speed to 4:00 m/km pace and braced myself for a sweaty 24 minutes.  The initial HR of 175 seemed about right but the fact that it kept climbing steadily, reaching 185, was not a good sign.  Despite desperate attempts to survive the full 24 minutes I had to admit defeat after 16 mins and decrease the speed down to 4:10 m/km for the last 2K.  So perhaps 4:00 is still a tad ambitious for the current fitness levels  Still, a good workout ...

Edited: 15/12/2010 at 14:25
15/12/2010 at 14:46

SBD - thanks! It was the Andy Reading 10k in Bicester, flat as a pancake, a good PB course if it's not windy. as it goes round an airfield. Not the most exciting route, but it's the second time of running for me, and I like it. Slightly dodgy splits as I forgot to start the garmin for 400m so the first km is an estimate, but something like this:

3:47, 3:45, 3:50, 3:54, 3:38, 3:38 , 3:55, 3:53, 3:51, 3:42

Too fast at 5 and 6k when chasing stuck in no man's land, and paid for that immediately afterwards, but glad I could pick up the pace again in the last 1km at least. I was looking for 3:47 avg, so couldn't ask for much more.

How does the indoor temperature affect you SBD? I can never maintain the same intensity on a treadmill as outside at the same HR.

15/12/2010 at 14:51

Excellent run there poach  and go easy on that niggle Gul, don't want you back on the bench after working so hard to get back.

MsE - stick to the plan and let each part build over time - it is a very well thought out schedule.

SBD - spookily similar to the treadmill session I just did. 1k warm-up before a planned 4x 4.00m/km pace with 250 rests and 1k warm down. However, due to good mojo ended up doing 5 reps and 8km in total in 35mins.

15/12/2010 at 15:03
Got swim out the way this morning. First time i've done it the morning after an evening run and actually found it really good to warm up and flush out the legs. Sure i'll be dozing into me keyboard later this morning!
15/12/2010 at 15:04

''Spot on, the injury-prone might find that doing as many as poss of your miles off road helps a lot. Even gravel paths and farm tracks are more forgiving than the evil tarmac '' (I cant work out this quotation thing!)

Poacher -  As you know I live in a hilly area and a tend normally to do a lot of runs off road. I find this hard when marathon training because a lot of my routes are not necessarily on tracks but more picking through heather, or stony sheep trails.  Therefore, its difficult to get speed up and also difficult to assess the effort/benefit of each run.  I did 8 miles off road on Sunday in bad conditions and was really tired but it took more than twice as long as the same distance on the road. 

Edited: 15/12/2010 at 15:13
15/12/2010 at 15:27

Does sound like a good workout SBD. You've started your schedule, right? I'm sure the heat of treadmill running must play havoc with the HR. At least when running outside one has a little air cooling, at your pace anyway

My stats: 5'11"ish / 150lbs / muscle mass? / body fat % ? / natural heal striker but working towards midfoot. Into football, food, girls (for the record) and running and running and running. I think the world would be a better place if there was peace and love. This is Mr Universe, right?

knight rider wrote (see)

looking forward to this marathon compaign regardless of wether I'm a Supper SIx'er

You still thinking about AC's pie video KR?!

Lovely run Poacher. And nice reps from you, AC.

What pace did you get for your first tempo run, MsE?

Come on Steve. Where art thou?

15/12/2010 at 15:31

Minni - I feel quite fortunate in that I've got a cycle trail close by where I can do most of my longer runs - it's flat and sections of it are non-tarmac.  I wouldn't abandon your off road runs though, just may be mix them up with some runs on the evil tarmac.

AC - Great minds think alike

luna man wrote (see)

SBD - thanks! It was the Andy Reading 10k in Bicester, flat as a pancake, a good PB course if it's not windy. as it goes round an airfield. Not the most exciting route, but it's the second time of running for me, and I like it. Slightly dodgy splits as I forgot to start the garmin for 400m so the first km is an estimate, but something like this:

3:47, 3:45, 3:50, 3:54, 3:38, 3:38 , 3:55, 3:53, 3:51, 3:42

Too fast at 5 and 6k when chasing stuck in no man's land, and paid for that immediately afterwards, but glad I could pick up the pace again in the last 1km at least. I was looking for 3:47 avg, so couldn't ask for much more.

How does the indoor temperature affect you SBD? I can never maintain the same intensity on a treadmill as outside at the same HR.

Interesting - I had thought about doing this race but am not quite in the right mental framework at the moment.  I definately get hot and sweaty on the treadmill but having only been using it over the last few weeks haven't really calibrated it against outside running.  I need to get a more consistent set of tempo runs in for this marathon campaign and thought the treadmill might help me do this.  I might have to try a similar session on the track to see how that compares.

15/12/2010 at 15:36
Minni wrote (see)

''Spot on, the injury-prone might find that doing as many as poss of your miles off road helps a lot. Even gravel paths and farm tracks are more forgiving than the evil tarmac '' (I cant work out this quotation thing!)

Poacher -  As you know I live in a hilly area and a tend normally to do a lot of runs off road. I find this hard when marathon training because a lot of my routes are not necessarily on tracks but more picking through heather, or stony sheep trails.  Therefore, its difficult to get speed up and also difficult to assess the effort/benefit of each run.  I did 8 miles off road on Sunday in bad conditions and was really tired but it took more than twice as long as the same distance on the road. 


Minni - I think the benefit is huge. I did a number of my LSRs over tracks and coastal paths last year. They are tiring and the mile splits make you wince but the strengthening and stamina it gives you is huge. The only thing a purist might say is that the training should be specific to the event you are targetting. But hey, you can't move house just so you can train on roads...and time on feet is time on feet!
15/12/2010 at 15:48
Blisters and beer wrote (see)

You've started your schedule, right?

Yes - now officially day 3 of my 18-week P&D schedule.  Essentially the 55-70 schedule I've used before but I'm still toying with a) doing a 6 day version of the 70-85 schedule; b) adding in more tempo runs so that I'm doing at leat one tempo session per week.  Will probably experiment over the new few weeks and see what seems feasible.

15/12/2010 at 15:48

Minni - On the occasion I got to chat to Steve Smythe on last year's SSX and from the postings I saw from him he was a proponent of as much off-road running as possible. That meant a lot of trail / off-road running and even hitting the grass verge if there was one available. Now this is partly down to the fact that he's in his early 50's and he's fully aware that pounding pavements is not that good for him personally but his long runs were coming in at over 8min miling and this was from someone who did 2h46 in April. His high mileage days are behind him now and he was aiming at 70mpw max

LunaMan - stunning 10k time there  Are you sure you're on the right thread?

15/12/2010 at 16:17

MsE - nearly 48, 5' 8", currently 11 stone 7 after a less than careful autumn, but that should be down towards 11 dead in a couple of months time. No idea about fat index or muscle mass - just too high and not enough will do. Severe pronating heel striker with flat feet and terrible feet-outurned gait, so can't actually run in any kind of support shoe as they just rip up my arches - try to get by with neutral shoe and orthotics.

15/12/2010 at 16:47

SBD - I know it would take alot of mucking around but have you thought of doing what Moraghan mentioned he does, in making it say, a 10 day cycle? I suppose if you can handle the mileage you do, it's possibly not worth the effort.

MsE - For your stats, I forgot to mention I'm 38.

MsE
15/12/2010 at 16:54
Having a giggle at how so many of you have earnestly posted your vital statistics for me following my slight tongue in cheek suggestion. Just goes to show what a lovely decent lot post on here. What is amusing is how you ended up adding age when I was asking about the physical aspects (height, weight, gait etc). B&B - you made me laugh! But now the geek in me is wondering whether, in the interests of doing this as a project, I could tabulate the information together with our respective schedules, HM/marathon etc goals and achieved times... Does that make me weird (and definitely make me more suspiciously like a gay man)? I have no idea whether it is possible to add tables to this place although vaguely recall seeing someone's graphs of training cleverly posted a while ago.
MsE
15/12/2010 at 16:58
B&B - re my tempo run, if you mean my first run of 8M with 4M at HM pace, my 4 miles went from 8 m/m to 7 m/m which made me conclude that I need longer warming up to get into the zone. I had allowed 2 miles but I run mostly in the morning and, coming from Asia, find these cold temperatures affect me quite a lot. Next time I think I will spend at least 4 miles warming up and do some extra cool down miles if necessary.

Re me coming from Asia, I keep getting random people knocking on the door asking me if the lady of the house is in. I never had to deal with this when I was out working.
15/12/2010 at 17:07
Blisters and beer wrote (see)

SBD - I know it would take alot of mucking around but have you thought of doing what Moraghan mentioned he does, in making it say, a 10 day cycle? I suppose if you can handle the mileage you do, it's possibly not worth the effort.

The purist in me likes the idea of a training-based cycle but the reality of working life and family means it's a non-starter

15/12/2010 at 17:23

MsE - you ask a bunch for runners for some stats and are surprised at getting feedback?! Here's a chart I prepared earlier showing running/biking hours over two marathon campaigns. Fascinating I'm sure you'll agree, ahem!

http://www.alunward.co.uk/marathon/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/hours.gif

Re. training surfaces: mmm, good thoughts - maybe I should go back to trails if I want to up the mileage again.

MM - oh yes, I'm definitely on the right thread! I know a few sub 37 minute 10kers who can't crack 3 hours yet despite putting many more miles than me in! The predictors say you should be able to pull it off with a 38 minute 10k and I'm quite happy to admit that higher running mileage would help convert it. I've a feeling some of it is psychological though, I'm more than happy to go full pelt for what seems a measly 10k, but am overly cautious in longer races in case of collapse. I've yet to translate the 10k into a similarly pitched Half or Full (current PBs are 1:25:50 from Feb, 3:11 in Oct) but am hopeful for 2011.

15/12/2010 at 17:28
MsE wrote (see)
 Re me coming from Asia, I keep getting random people knocking on the door asking me if the lady of the house is in. I never had to deal with this when I was out working.

Being petite and youthful,  it's obviously because you don't look old enough.   
or otherwise it's because you're a gay male .
15/12/2010 at 17:48
MsE - I'm 5 ft 6 and weigh around 9 and half stone (60kgs). Don't know what my BMI is as I've never done it.
15/12/2010 at 18:11
Clearly, we need to introduce a weight handicap system similar to that used for jockeys.  So anyone running a marathon and weighing in at less than 80kg would have to carry weights to bring them up to the fair weight of 80kg
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