sub 4 hour group,if anyone wants to get together

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29/10/2012 at 21:21

 sorry to hear that Ickle - your flipping knees...

good to hear you are up and at em Jovi and ready to run already ... (c r a z e e e )

preparing for tomorrows hideous day ...   wish me luck - will be on the cider by the end marathon or no marathon ...

our lovely Dave the coach has gone to New York.. was on the last flight in - for the marathon next weekend - he has taken his wife and two young girls - not sure I would have been brave enough to go - hope everyone there is okay ..

Fleet? hmmmm .....

29/10/2012 at 21:47

Susan - hope the sales event goes well and isn't too stress inducing. 

Ikle - boo to dodgy knees. 

mcs - sounds a tough race - not sure I could manage that on no brekkie.

AH - good to hear you got in a run and not too many side effects - hope you make it out again tomorrow.

UmB/Dave LeFleur - how soon does Fleet half tend to fill up? With Jovi tix & Thunder Run entries opening this week I'm a little strapped for cash at the mo!

I have been sensible today and not run.  Will probably take another rest day tomorrow and then go our for a run with my mate Adam on Wednesday. He's trianing for Marathon des Sables so needs to get used to doing some runs at a slower pace & I need a nice slow recovery run.

Jovi fanclub tix on sale tomorrow - the tour madness starts!

Fleet half could be boys V girls???

Edited: 29/10/2012 at 21:48
29/10/2012 at 23:36
Ikle do you do any trail running? Most of my long runs this year have been trail, always think it strengthens ankles, joints but takes some impact off, especially knees. I always wear compression socks which help with the knee area.

Also look at your shoes, gait checked? Sure there is some solution out there.

Susan, hope your pal is okay, 2 pals of mine are waiting to fly out Wed & Thu. Not good. Fingers crossed.

As Jovi says, Thunder Run open this week coming. Likely we will have 2 teams this year since everyone enjoyed it so much, various OHs & others now interested. Worked out ??40 quid each, including all food, if anyone interested? You only do no of laps you want, so 1-2 minimum or upwards, tons of fun, especially running at night.

Might be fun watching DtF and Umbongo do some 10ks

Not sure about march half. Still thinking of doing warm weather training then, I know you guys, sorry, lovely ladies did Liz Yelling one in Lanza. Also Mike Gratton one on then. Both are on in March this year.
30/10/2012 at 07:24

Fleet entered 

30/10/2012 at 09:27

UmB's entered Fleet, too.

Smeagol's in hospital today for his knee op.  Good luck matey.

Good luck, too, to Susan for her presso today. Of course she'll be marvellous, won't she .

Jovi and Susan - Fleet won't fill up tooo soon I don't think.

FRC I think the Liz Yelling Lanza camp is full.  If I somehow get rich between now and March - unlikely - I'll see if I could get a cancellation.  Would be wonderful to go without the pressure of having to cycle every day.  And I could do some lovely sea swims without freezing my wotsits off.

30/10/2012 at 10:49

hi all

ikle sorry to hear about your knee, not nice

hoping smeags gets on well

oh good luck indeed susan!

jovi been watching you jovi madness you love it!

susan hope it all settles in NY, its not been good eh?

30/10/2012 at 11:05

It's like totally ok/fine as in not severely hurty or anything. Just a gentle initial pain, but I know from bitter experience, that that gentle not severe hurty pain gradually hikes up at about 12 miles to make further running impossible. The feeling seems to be, on here and also from my brother, that there must be something to be DONE. My brother thinks orthotics. My last physio was convinced it was just hydration and protein, but that didn't work either. My right knee used to be problematic too, but that one seems to be fine now.

There are SO many people on here, that have had knee problem, ITB of one kind or other, at one time or other, and they've seen the pain go with physio/kit/strength training, etc.

So I think something must be able to be done. But what? I really want to be able to run this last marathon, preferably sub 4, and then I'm happy to stick to 10 and 5Ks. I'm just not sure what direction to try next. Don't want to spend loads of money on more advice/orthotics and then find the problem is the same.

FRC, I had my gait analysed at Niketown. They said pronation was mild to medium and gave me a +2 shoe after analysing thoroughly, so I don't think it's that. Thanks by the way, for offering me some suggestions. I don't really do any trail running at the moment, so maybe that could help? When are the Thunder runs? I like the sound of those. Fun. I reckon I could to a couple of 10ks. =)

30/10/2012 at 11:13

Sports massage is the only thing I've found on these forums, that I haven't really tried in any regularity. Maybe that's a good plan...

30/10/2012 at 12:33

Ikle, Nike town equals only Nike trainers? No idea about the +2 thing. what shoes do you wear then? There are always more brands to try. I had to run with gel heel insert cup things for awhile, but just one foot, to take the impact out with tendonitis.

Trail running? I've run along the sea defence concrete path near to me a few times, thats hard on my knees, 5 minutes later I can be off road and zero problems, less repetitive on joints hitting the same areas constantly? off road, you are constantly altering feet, at least for me has helped legs/ ankles, you might go slower, have a few hills in there, but then when you are on the flat, you can go faster. Try a mile or two along beach or near woods?

Thunder Run is the last weekend in July I think, 27th or 28th. the 10k is all trail. and you run through the night with head torches. Fun! way better than a marathon, but for 24 hours. and CAKE. did I mention the cake? BBQ too. veggie stuff also.

AH, Liz Yelling website says" Places going fast". Mike Gratton one is cheaper in Portugal. Was also more the question, would it make a huge difference doing a warm weather camp? How much did it help you for the ironman?

30/10/2012 at 12:47

I have Nike lady Lunareclipse +2 apparently.

I've tried on so many trainers in my lifetime! Bum, Bum. Bum.

I'm supposed to be doing some school work during my holiday. That's why I keep writing on here and not doing any work.

30/10/2012 at 13:14

Poor Ikle.  So bloody annoying for you.

I know I'm not a physio, but Ikle I can't believe one said that protein and water would sort your knee out!  Just can't believe it!

If it really is ITB pain get a sports massage therapist to release your TFL and glute max.  The ITB acts as a tendon to both those muscles so if they're tight they hike up the ITB so that it pulls and chafes on the side of the top of your tibia and causes the pain. I've found this really helps people (and me).  Bizarrely, massaging the ITB itself doesn't necessarily help - (more likely to get your lateral quad and hurt your femur).

However, working on TFL etc doesn't deal with the causes of the tightening ... which gets you back to lots of glute exercises, one legged squats and lunges etc. And general core strength. I know you did loads of those before - are you still doing them?  The annoying thing is that you have to keep doing them. For ever. Especially if you've had probs - it suggests you're prone to dodgy ITB-irritating biomechanics.

Am not at all sure that orthotics are the answer to anything really.  FWIW I think you'd be better off going to Stride UK or The Running School to have your whole running style analysed to see what biomechanical issues you have.  Most of these can be sorted out with a dedicated strengthening programme.  Dull and annoying - but safe, sensible and effective.

30/10/2012 at 13:23

Bless you AH. X

My brother is doing Running School right now. I am still doing the exercises but probably not often enough. Thanks so much. It's really getting me down. But I'm more than happy to put in the work.

mcs
30/10/2012 at 14:12

Thunder run sounds good,,,, pencil me down.......guy I know came fourth as a solo runner doing 100 miles awesome............ Best wishes with the knees IM dont give up.....hows the back any issues with that. Off to the lakes till Monday have  a good week, time to get wet me thinks.

30/10/2012 at 14:58

Ikle, Dont lose hope. You will do sub 4.

Still doing the pump classes? Thats what got my legs in good shape, a years worth, plus a body conditioning class & circuit too. 3 gym visits a week and 15-20 miles a week for months, then upped for the marathon.

You have tons of time for Brighton, to work on solid foundation November & December?

30/10/2012 at 19:07
In other news, I got laid off from work today! Not a happy bunny! Oh well, will give me a chance to get a few more miles in!
30/10/2012 at 20:38
Oh poor Scott. Was it unexpected? I'm sorry. Hopefully you will get another job soon now we are out of the recession.
30/10/2012 at 21:00

Scott - sorry to hear that... what line of work are/were you in?

Ikle - good luck with the niggles... I have been blessed with a mostly injury free running life (fingers crossed) so can only sympathise. I get frustrated by having a cold for a few days and not being able to run.

Which brings me on to another great club run tonight. Boy, is our club buzzing at the moment, so many people there tonight inc. about 50 juniors some of whom were all halloweened up in fancy dress (Toby opted out but then he is nearly 16!)

A brisk 4.75 loop around glorious New Milton at 7:28 pace ,nice and steady apart from a bit of stitch at the end. Haven't really run for a week and failed to warm up tonight so the first mile of so felt extra hard. I could really do with a race soon... shame I'm away for most of the local ones coming up.

I'm still on course for a 1000 miles this year (never managed it yet) with only 135 to go - should manage that over the next 2 months somehow.

Anyone entered Fleet yet to witness the Umbongo v DtF smackdown?

 

30/10/2012 at 21:29
Hey D the F, you never answered my F question!
30/10/2012 at 21:34
Artful Hen wrote (see)

I know I'm not a physio, but Ikle I can't believe one said that protein and water would sort your knee out!  Just can't believe it!

Am not at all sure that orthotics are the answer to anything really.  FWIW I think you'd be better off going to Stride UK or The Running School to have your whole running style analysed to see what biomechanical issues you have.  Most of these can be sorted out with a dedicated strengthening programme.  Dull and annoying - but safe, sensible and effective.

Ikle, what AH says there about the physio is what I almost said in the text I just sent you

I hadn't noticed that Running School had come up in this thread until after I sent it. Certainly part of their aim is to help runners stay injury free - as well as running faster of course. I know my coach [ @runschool_esph ] currently offers a free half hour bio-mechanical analysis and I'd guess that the new facility in Bank may well be offering the same thing. From my own experience of it I was happy that it wasn't just marketing fluff. It's useful to see just how you run and to have it explained how that affects both your performance and your running health.

Whether orthotics have any benefit may be open to question, but since we all (where necessary) use shoes understanding that they correct over-pronation (and that this is a "good thing") then it would seem that the use of orthotics - which, to my understanding simply amplify the affect, the support, beyond the range that shoes can - can be a "good thing" too.

For me it may be a moot point since hopefully after my Running School course, and all the work I'm putting in on it, my running style may be so transformed that even if I never have an injury again it'll be hard to define which thing had the important effect. Certainly all the problems I had with ITB - late 2009 and into 2010 - all arose when I upped my distance from regular 10k runner to do half marathons (with YOU ikle ). As yet I've not returned to running those kinds of distances so as and when I do ... we'll see

30/10/2012 at 21:55
Ikle - what was the question?
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