Follow the progress of just back from a run, our sub-3:00 hopeful, as she receives expert advice from mentor Paul Evans
I've been silently watching this and the 3.15 thread the past few months as thought I'd fit in-between the two.
Hard luck on not getting your time, but well done for completing the run one and all and hope everyone had a drink (or six) to celebrate either way yesterday - it's a long old way.
I think I saw you circa 16 miles - I was working too hard to say hello and didn't want to put anyone off their focus! You certainly have the pace for sub three - alot more nippy than me with your time in the ten miler, so definetly keep the faith and go for it again in a smaller race / one where the start is better organised, off a good training schedule it's there for the taking.
I managed 3.08.25 (1.32 half) which was about the best I could hope for of my training / diet. Had ok endurance just not the pace but my own fault for liking Peroni and chicken vindaloo so much!
As for the race, spent the first five miles weaving. Couldn't really soak up the atmosphere due to working so hard to keep going! Organisation was great minus the pens though and will 100% be back.
Have entered Berlin and aim to try and work on my pace the next few month, I'm keeping my sub three dreams alive - glad to be able to get in GFA with sub 3.10 next year - thanks for changing that Virgin! Best get back to club after a well deserved week off!
Just popped on to see how things went (have been lurking but not had time to participate).
Looks like a mixed bag, and like BR, I'm sure JBFAR will get a sub-3. Several athletes have mentioned they suffered a bit from the humidity in the second half - from the BBC studio I was in it seemed like a perfect day with the early rain but you can't tell the effect of high humidy until you are actually running in it.
There were quite a few elites who struggled in the second half after a fairly controlled first half. It was good to see a bit more depth near the front from the British men and it looks like there's the possibility of a break through run on the horizon for some of them if they can spur each other on.
echo the sentiments posted recently JBFAR... just one of those things. You've been as determined as ever - no-one can take that away from you. For what it's worth... I had a shocker yesterday albeit going for a slower time (cramp from mile 19 onwards, could hardly run, ran-walked 7 miles to the finish, would have stopped but for people waiting for me and having raised substantial funds for charity).
Don't let the marathon/your aspirations beat you - I will certainly be attacking it again in future. Take time to rest, chillout and reflect, thinking what's best for you.
I look at things analytically.
The problem with internet forums is that anyone that has the brains to switch a computer on actually believes they have a worthwhile comment to make. Most simply show their ignorance.
You were on a hiding to nothing JBFAR. You have the talent, but it was never on the cards this year. Your easy pace and threshold pace should've made this clear. It did to me. The 10m race was a big surprise to me, but yesterday proved there are no short cuts. Women don't go sub 3hr by accident, and anyone that does it deserves all the credit they get.
I think you will do it with the correct approach (if you still want to). This thread has shown your naivety towards training, mileage and schedules. I don't think you were helped along the way as much as you should've been. Forum support (ignorant or not) is one thing, but when you're stood on that start line you're on your own!
The key sessions had very little to do with RW or this thread. The mileage was too low. The mara pace sessions were few and far between. The threshold sessions never struck me as adequate (sub 3hr guys should be capable of 5 miles at 6'30"/m pace once/week). I remember one key session when you did some 400s at 3k pace and then tried following it with a threshold pace run. Crazy, your legs were already full of lactic acid.
The sub 3hr became a weight around your neck. I don't believe you ran any of the race on feel. You ran it on a pre- determined pace, and it must have felt too fast very early on.
I refrained from saying too much prior to the race because negative vibes are not great. I did say a few weeks back the target was not on.
I wonder how many magazines RW sold off the back of the super 6? Just a thought! Did any of them succeed? I've only had a quick look at the 3:15 guy, he had a bad day too!
Hi Christina - good effort, you gave it a good go, going though halfway on target, and then having problems with your quads cramping up, it was very humid out there this might of played a part, I saw you at 22 and then got your finishing time, obviously you are disapointed but you will be back and I am sure you will crack 3 hrs next time, my advise is to take a couple of weeks off running and reflect on the last 4 month, and decide what you want from the sport? it would be good to see you doing some shorter distances, 5k's & 10k's and then having another go at sub 3
You have been a star from day one, the way you dealt with everything, injury included
My first 2 marathons I DNF, and knowing you " all be it on a forum" you will be back!
Well done Christina
Take care !!
Unlucky MM. The few times I looked at your thread I did believe you were going to achieve your goal. You were unfortunate.
The main aim of the competition?...Well to me it was or should have been to get the 6 under their target time. Of course in the real world that wasn't RW priority.
Smurf - if JBFAR had toed the line in genuine sub 3 shape then yes any of those variables could have conspired to prevent a 2.5x.
It's tricky picking a sub 3 contender for this project because if you pick a youngish guy with some previous evidence of talent then getting into sub 3 shape is pretty straightforward for most. A woman or an older guy presents more of a challenge, but the bigger the challenge (which makes it a more readable thread / magazine article) the more things have to go right with the preparation to achieve the end goal.
I did say at the start that I thought to get someone into sub 3 shape that the pre-thread preparation was important and that I thought endurance was the key element for JBFAR. That she could get herself into 64.xx shape with a few decent training weeks was testament to the fact that the basic speed would not be an issue. So I agree, 3k pace reps were not focussing on what she needed at that point.
JBFAR - were you to approach another marathon, what are the 3 most important lessons you have learned from this campaign?
Wouldn't it be great if RW wouldn't perpetuate the folly of picking a marathon time and training specifically for it using an off the shelf plan.
All the ingredients are in place for the runner to train hard with a tailored regime designed / adapted by a personal coach and then to arrive at a realistic marathon goal during the training process so on the day the runner has a realistic target. Everyone would learn more and the runner would be put in the best position to have a successful day - time wise and enjoyment wise.
Does it not strike anyone else as utterly perverse that the program forced jbfar into a sub-3hr marathon schedule off a 3:13 previous whereas the 4hr guy was asked to duck under 4 hours with a 1h 42 hm best. So you have two runners - one with an extremely tough target and another with an extremely soft target, both shoe horned into inappropriate schedules.
This ludicrous slapping on of target numbers 16 weeks before the day with no thought to the realism of the target is such amazingly bad practice - worsened by the fact that there is no control or guidance in the weeks approaching the 16 week countdown. Whatever happened to training to train?
The way the super six is run is a curse more than anything. RW - next year please extend your potentially fantastic offer but do the thing sensibly this time.
The sad thing is the forum is full of runners going for completely inappropriate times because they read these RW sponsored threads and think the right way to go about it is to pick any old time and base their training paces on that aspirational (or otherwise) goal. You have 1:30 HMers aiming to break 5 hours and 2:00 HMers going for 3:30. Set a good example RW, for God's sake.
I would just like to say i ran a lot of the marathon near to you as i was on 3 hour pace too. You looked consistent and strong and thought you'd get close to the 3 hour mark. I too didn't achieve goal and did 3:17. Things can just go wrong on the day and they did for me on 22 when i just ran out of fuel.
The main mistake i made was drinking a little from each and every water station which was just not enough. At races where there are fewer stations i take more on at each station and hydrate better. I am not sure if this was an issue for you but i felt that there was so much hydrtation on offer that i became overwhelmed and got confused as to where/when take on water/gels.
Maybe consider a less popular marathon, where the pressure is not there and you can just enjoy the race. I am going to do this and hopefully do London again in few years time.
Still it was a great day and you will be back and get under 3 with determination and hard work.
Congratulations Cristina and everyone who completed the marathon! I can’t really comment on the finer detail of marathon running but I think everyone will have learnt a great deal about themselves over the past 16 weeks.
Thanks also to the other forum users for testing my brain power and asking me lots of tricky questions. I’ll be hanging around on the Runners World Forums for the foreseeable future so feel free to carry on asking me questions.
Gareth I had some questions a few days ago that I posted on this thread:
Moraghan wrote (see)
GarethMany of the elite marathoners finish the marathon having lost up to 8lbs of weight and typically consume about 200 ml per hour. Are you suggesting that if they had drunk to replace the fluid they lost they would have run it faster?What is the scientific reasoning behind everyone else replacing all fluid lost and dehydration's affect on performance? Or is it for health reasons you recommend this?What is the factor of key importance - is it total sodium levels or sodium concentration of the blood? If it's sodium concentration then that must go up during sweating surely and consuming water / sports drink (of less than blood concentration) would decrease that concentration further? Sorry for all the questions, but am genuinely curious.Good luck on sunday everyone.
Many of the elite marathoners finish the marathon having lost up to 8lbs of weight and typically consume about 200 ml per hour. Are you suggesting that if they had drunk to replace the fluid they lost they would have run it faster?
What is the scientific reasoning behind everyone else replacing all fluid lost and dehydration's affect on performance? Or is it for health reasons you recommend this?
What is the factor of key importance - is it total sodium levels or sodium concentration of the blood? If it's sodium concentration then that must go up during sweating surely and consuming water / sports drink (of less than blood concentration) would decrease that concentration further?
Sorry for all the questions, but am genuinely curious.
Good luck on sunday everyone.
Thanks in advance.
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