Good length for weekly long runs?

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30/04/2014 at 16:36

Hi,

Bearing in mind I'm not doing marathon training, how long is too much for a weekly long run? Is running 10-13 miles at 30-40 seconds per mile slower than my 10k pace ok for a weekly run? What distance (assuming I worked up to it bit by bit) would be too long to recover from within 24hours?

cougie    pirate
30/04/2014 at 16:46
If you did add just 40 seconds a mile and did a half marathon distance- it would nearly be as fast as your HM race time I reckon. So too fast.
30/04/2014 at 16:52

Depends on your motivation / objectives...  but I think most people can run 16-18 miles without draining their resources.   But as cougie says...  from a training viewpoint, I think you're running too fast to get maximum benefit from your long runs.

30/04/2014 at 16:55

For long run read long S-L-O-W run.

All about getting the miles in and spending time on your feet.  Should be able to hold a converation on the run.  You could also chance a short recovery run the following day just to keep things moving.  No more than 10 - 15% increase in overall mileage per week otherwise you risk injury.  Dont forget to factor in 2 non-consecutive rest days a week (maybe one of those days being a cross-training session).

30/04/2014 at 17:01

90seconds per mile slower than 10k pace is closer to recommended long run pace.

Edited: 30/04/2014 at 17:08
30/04/2014 at 17:11

Ok, I hadn't quite realised that was how slow it was meant to be. So if my 10k pace is 7m/miles then I'd have to run at 8:30m/miles? How many miles is it a good idea to try and regularly do at HM pace during those long runs (not as part of a training schedule, just regular weekly running)?

30/04/2014 at 17:12

None. If you want do do faster stuff put it in a shorter run during the week, especially if you are not training for anything. Long runs are already hard and you are only just starting to build them up.

30/04/2014 at 17:22

Correct.  (of course!)

Edited: 30/04/2014 at 17:22
30/04/2014 at 17:22

maybe 33% of your totally weekly mileage build up to that if its too much  right now.

Edited: 30/04/2014 at 17:23
30/04/2014 at 19:52
literatin wrote (see)

None. If you want do do faster stuff put it in a shorter run during the week, especially if you are not training for anything. Long runs are already hard and you are only just starting to build them up.

They want to do a long run though.  Not everything is about speed here, some is about building up your mileage hence the OP's original question.

 

30/04/2014 at 20:21
Lotus Flower wrote (see)
literatin wrote (see)

None. If you want do do faster stuff put it in a shorter run during the week, especially if you are not training for anything. Long runs are already hard and you are only just starting to build them up.

They want to do a long run though.  Not everything is about speed here, some is about building up your mileage hence the OP's original question.

 

Aren't you just agreeing?

30/04/2014 at 23:04

Cheers, that's really helpful.

I tried out the runners world pace calculator, which I hadn't come across before, entered my 10k best and it did all the calculating for me. The long run pace is pretty much spot on what you guys have been saying.

30/04/2014 at 23:09
Lotus Flower wrote (see)
literatin wrote (see)

None. If you want do do faster stuff put it in a shorter run during the week, especially if you are not training for anything. Long runs are already hard and you are only just starting to build them up.

They want to do a long run though.  Not everything is about speed here, some is about building up your mileage hence the OP's original question.

 

Yes, that is why in response to his subsequent question about whether it was a good idea to do speedwork within said long run, I suggested that perhaps it wasn't.

30/04/2014 at 23:22
The long run is a 'Hard' run. You should be alternating hard and easy days. The ideal maximum length of the long run is 2h40m. After this it is believed you get no physiological benefits, only psychological ones. Ie feeling confident for the marathon.

24hours later you shouldn't be doing another hard training session.

Distance isn't the indicator of hard or easy. Tempo determines this.
01/05/2014 at 03:45

Run for time instead of worrying about pace/distance. If you know the distance you have to run, you are more likely to race it in a faster time. Run for 1 to 2 hours+ and do not care too much about the distance/pace that needs to be covered. A rest day after the long run is usually the best for recovery. 2 to 4+ runs  leading up to the next week long run.

 

Edited: 01/05/2014 at 03:51
01/05/2014 at 08:23

Surely the answer would also be effected by what your goals are?  For example if you are planning to run in 10k races then that would probably suggest shorter long runs with more emphasis on interval and tempo runs during the week.  If your goal was a half marathon race or races then there would be far greater focus on this long run with more suggestions of running some of it at HM pace.

If you are running for fitness or maintenance then I guess you have far more flexibility where there isn't really a right or wrong answer?

The general consensus seems to be that one can run for up to 2h40 mins at an easy pace without an extended recovery - that's interesting.  I find some conflicting points of view on this, not least from J Galloway who suggests a day of recovery for each mile of a long run before full performance is restored - even from an easy pace run.  Of course I may be reading things wrong as I am fairly new to running and it's taken me a year to become familiar with all the terms and acronyms, paces etc!

The other thing that has really struck me in my own training is that there is no 'one size fits all'.  The area that has proven most useful to me is reading all of the available guidance and trying things out.  Getting to read your own body and feel how things are going only comes with time and seems better than following any single plan or information from somebody else.  But it definitely takes time to start to be able to do that.  I feel that many contributors on here are well experienced runners and maybe forget just how confusing it all is for us novices!

The Runners World running books (available in many WH Smiths) have been really useful to me.  I have just picked up the one on nutrition which looks extremely good too.

01/05/2014 at 08:27

As I read about training schedules more Im struck by how some prescribe a 5k(ish) race on Saturday then a long slow run on Sunday.

Surely these are both 'hard' efforts so doing them back to back each week is asking for trouble isnt it?

01/05/2014 at 08:43

Steve, the 2h40m is a general idea for Marathon based long runs. The distance would be a proportion of your weekly run. I think something like no more than 30%.

So if you're running 60 miles then your long run can be 20miles and if you're a slow runner this might be limited to 15-16miles due to the time constraint.

There's a good thread here about training for the right distance.

Training for the Right Distance.


For a 10k you're looking at about 8miles for the long run.

Edited: 01/05/2014 at 08:46
01/05/2014 at 08:58

DMOE - I always thought the hard 5k followed by a long run Sunday was getting your legs used to running when tired/unrested.  Normally you see these runs in marathon training plans.

01/05/2014 at 10:02
I think marathon is a different beast entirely. 5K is not going to be that hard. I'd comfortably do 1000m intervals on Friday night and then run an easy 10miles the next morning followed by 20miles on the Sunday. It's all about pace.

There's a balance to be had.

We're taking 10K so. The max distance is going to be 20-30 miles a week. Running half that distance in two days back to back seems a bit of an odd thing to be doing.
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