HADD training plan

2,401 to 2,420 of 3,777 messages
06/01/2013 at 10:18

I think I have had a bit of breakthrough moment. As some may know I am plagued by calf injuries, which is one of the reasons I turned to Hadd (and started this thread). For the last 2 years I have been alternating 1-2 months of running, feeling myself getting fitter and planning races and targets with another injury which normally takes me 1-2 months to recover from. Frustrating might be one word to sum up my feelings.

I decided to get my orthotics/gait analysis redone and find a new physio who might take a more hollistic approach. Bingo - the first session I had with the new physio identified quite bad tightness in the lower back that leads to glutes not firing/tight hamstrings/consequent calf problems. She proved the point with a simple sitting on a chair exercise which proved my lack of flexibility. I have then got a few friends and work colleagues to try the same test and the only person who has anything like the same lack of flexibility as me is my daughter.

So I am hopefull that a few weeks of work will allow me to move forward. I have an entry for Brass Monkey HM but I may not do it as I do not want to risk injury just now and frankly it will be a hard effort to run 13 miles at the moment. But I have got York FM in October as a reasonable target which is all I need, some positivity and a reason to train

06/01/2013 at 11:21
Interestin posts Johnnybike I can see why people would do race specific training for basically any distance really. Because not everyone has unlimited time each week to invest in training so to some degree there is an element of "make it count" I'm thinking perhaps about seeing how far I can get off 70% & 80% training because my first 2013 goal is sub 5min mile. However I'd like this to be acheivable without going into the to much oxygen debt. Because I fully intend on stretching out the time I can hold 5min pace. Before I started hadd my 5k pb was/still is 16:22 (5:16mm) now I wish I knew what hr was that day. Anyway the other week in a track session 5:30pace was needing 170bpm (85%max or marathon hr). Now the reason I question the need for a training program on top of hadd is because. I know if I can get that lactate threshold hr past the magic pace of 5:16 for a marathon then I could qualify for the commonwealth games 2014. I dont feel there is anyway better than hadd to get me there. May as well aim high.

Hadd makes it all seem doable/achievable because its specific to the runner.
I'm hoping that I can get there 5:16mm for 170bpm because the possible reward/experience would be unforgettable I reckon.

Maybe you could say in simple terms if hadd is the cake and intervals/fartlek ect are the icing/cherry. I want to get the cake massive then when its risen enough I'll decorate it then. Does that seem logical.
06/01/2013 at 11:38

Johnnybike didn't wear my HRM strap today as it cut into my chest yesterday and needs a day to heal with sudocrem.

 Anyway did 18 miles @ 9.05 pace very slow controled running..

Enjoy your day Hadders !!

06/01/2013 at 11:59
Ashman cracking mileage anyway hr monitor or not
06/01/2013 at 12:18

I'm a beginner (38 yrs old, 87kg, 5'11", 2 years of

06/01/2013 at 12:19

Forum cutting my messages off..


I'm a beginner (38 yrs old, 87kg, 5'11", 2 years of

06/01/2013 at 12:21

I'm a beginner (38 yrs old, 87kg, 5'11", 2 years of

Edited: 06/01/2013 at 12:27
06/01/2013 at 12:28

EDIT:  had to replace "less than sign" with the word "under"!  Sorry.

I'm a beginner (38 yrs old, 87kg, 5'11", 2 years of under 120 miles in total, and last year did 4 months and a bit - ~400 miles, HM 1:46 PB relatively ok perceived effort Sept; 1st 4:18 FM in Chester in Oct then nothing until last week).

The problem I've got with Hadd training, is that for me it seems to promote a sort of "marathon shuffle".  To get my HR at the right level (around 135 I think; I hit 186 on my last training run/jog up a 55 degree hill and not all out) I'm down at 12:30mm after the first 15 min warmup, and I can do a fast walk at this pace - though the fast walk and my HR drops to 120 or less as I always have a foot on the ground.  To keep the HR up I need to shorten my stride and turn the legs over more.  If I run "comfortably" with my usual stride my HR is up at 155 and nearer 9:20mm (my 8:05mm HM was at an average HR of 174).

I'm worried that if continue this for 3 months I'll have trained this poor form to become my norm.  Is it ok to run easily for a bit then walk a bit to "average" the HR out - or is it better to be consistant?  I'm also guessing the Hadd document is based on a well established and able runner (like most of you seem to be) rather than someone down at my level.

Am I doing something wrong?

Edited: 06/01/2013 at 12:30
06/01/2013 at 12:32
Edited: 06/01/2013 at 12:33
06/01/2013 at 14:06

Hi all,

JohnnyBike, that is good news, hopefully those exercises will sort out your calf issues

AtD, good luck with your quest for Commonwealth qualification, how long do you have to meet the qualifying time?

Long run today, 12 miles mainly on the flat with some inclines thrown in, it was near on impossible to keep my HR below 75% on the rises, so I let it drift on the way up and let it recover on the flat

stats for the run


 12.11m in 2:21 @ 11:41 avgHR 136(71%) 

06/01/2013 at 14:29



you dont say what you Max Heart rate is, without that all numbers become meaningless.

A consistent HR is what your aiming for in a training run, if you have to slow down at first, slow down, A few weeks /months you should find that you dont need to back off, and try not to focus on what pace you are running that will sort its self out later on, but keep a record of it for future refrence.





06/01/2013 at 14:35
AtD, good luck with the commonwealth qualification.
JB, good to see you are back, and hope you manage the calf situation up to York in October.
SC, good long run.
Daeve, welcome. Patience is the key. Good luck!
06/01/2013 at 14:37

SC - I do like how you post your spreadsheet like that - looks very clear and easy to follow - what is that downloaded from - a Garmin ?

06/01/2013 at 14:41

Cheers guys - I guess I need to do the dreaded "find your max HR" which I detest.  I injured myself doing it a couple of years ago (hamstring) and found it to be 184, hit 185 in the sprint finish of a half last year, but this year I've hit 186 so far up a steep long hill (not a spike) and would estimate to be a beat or two higher.

I guess I'll have to learn to "speedwalk" then - as as soon as I break in to a jog/run my HR goes way over.

06/01/2013 at 14:45
Daeve, I wouldnt risk injury. I would suggest you use max 190 for now.
06/01/2013 at 14:51

Daeve,  if you cannot go above speed walk without HR going over 70% I would suggest not to worry. I would run - but run as slow as you can. Make sure you are not taxing system at any time. ( can chat very esily in full paragraphs etc )  Over a month or so - that will become 70%. 

Another tip is to " run for time" rather than mileage - eg 60 mins running.... as slow as possible. 

Edited: 06/01/2013 at 14:52
06/01/2013 at 15:02

Thanks AGF - I've come around to looking at time rather than miles (though managed 33 miles this week) trying for average 60 mins a day - I've never been able to be conversational while running except in one sentence bursts (must not breathe when talking or something?), even at really low speeds - but can at a fast walk.  I'll give it a go for a few weeks and report back.

06/01/2013 at 15:05

Good Luck Daeve

Well a pleasing week to start the year. 62 Miles at average spped on 9:10mm.  All of it slow except one progressive 7 Miler. So not strictly pure hadd but close enough. 14 More weeks until Brighton Marathon. The plan is to try and average 50ish miles all the way and also lose a bit of weight now the Christmas goodies have disapeared.  

Hope everyones training is going well. 

Edited: 06/01/2013 at 15:06
06/01/2013 at 15:07
JohnnyBike, I upload from my garmin to sportstrack take a screen dump paste it into photoshop crop the image and save it then I just upload image into post, really simple to do only takes a few minutes.
06/01/2013 at 15:23

Daeve, welcome.  I agree with the others.  Be patient as it does fell really odd to start with but you will see a change.  When I started doing this at the end of Oct my 70% pace was coming out about 9 mins/mile - it is now about 8:30.  Prior to taking this approach I had never run anywhere at 9 mins/mile. 

Ashman, good miles.  I bet you're dying to know what the heart rate was.

SC, nice steady mileage.

JohnnyBike, I'm pleased for you that you've had the breakthrough.  Keep doing the stretches to keep the flexibility. Incorporate core stability work as well.

19 miles for me today to round off 50 miles for the week for the first time ever.

Splits were:

Miles 1-11 @ 73-75%

8:53, 8:27, 8:14, 8:12, 8:07, 8:06, 8:04, 7:55, 8:13, 8:01, 8:19,

Miles 12-14 from 76%-80%

8:06, 7:44, 7:48,

Miles 15-19 @ 81%

7:22, 7:24, 7:36, 7:27, 7:38.

Overall pretty pleased with it after one of my 10 milers earlier in the week felt bad.

Previously bookmarked threads are now visible in "Followed Threads". You can also manage notifications on these threads from the "Forum Settings" section of your profile settings page to prevent being sent an email when a reply is made.
Forum Jump  

RW Forums