Rubbishrunner welcome to the best base phase training there is.
My question to you all, on the last page of the HADD document, first paragraph,( run 10miles at HR marathon with no rise in HR and finish confident that you could go round again at the same pace with no rise in HR or loss in pace at constant HR )
It's the word "confident "that I have problem with, when do YOU know you could do the same again? because for me I would not really know untill I had run it.
I dont know Im not there yet! .....but my view would be that the HR is soooo consistent and you feel sooo fresh it feels very easy etc etc
Roy - I guess by the time you can run 10 miles with no HR drift or drop in pace you will have done plenty of training to get there. The confidence factor will slowly be 'built' in during that period. You will know your body better after all that training and what it is capable of. I know for certain that I couldn't do it - so I'm confident from that point of view!
I am 'confident' at this point in my training that I can do 7 miles with no HR drift and no drop in pace (at 75% given a flat course and no wind) and that I could do the same again.
Good luck to anyone doing the Silverstone half on Sunday
Hi. I've been off the thread for a few weeks, but have just read back. Some good discussions as always. Training is going ok for me. Legs tired all the time and I have the same stiff lower back which put me out of VLM last year so I am trying to stretch and massage it frequently.
Last saturday night I had a bit of a break through run in that I covered my furthest distance so far - 32.75m in 4hr 32 mins at the Moonlight Ultra. Despite the cold wind and snow it was almost fun running in the dark with headtorches at times. Was pleased with a steady consistent HR in the mid 150s (82%) for 8.13m/m overall. The pain was less that in a marathon, but the suffering was worse. However I did enjoy the off road aspects and will look to do some more off road ultras or marathons when VLM is out of the way.
As you were.
32 miles!!!! - just about do that in one week - respect Keir
Have you recovered Keir?
Re 80% runs. They should not feel like tempo runs (even though they sort of are). By this I mean after your 80% section finishes the run should continue into you warm-down, with no need to stop, and bendover wheezing. It should be comfortably hard and feeling-wise I would equate it to the first 10miles of a marathon.
good luck in the silverstone HM BeDe, look forward to hearing about it.
Today did a 'run' pace [just up from a recovery level] for 7 miles on moslty xc type terrain. Avg 10/m mile [it was bloomin heavy going!] with an avergae HR 151 around 75% of WHR.
Thats the longest Ive ran since I started all this again after my 27 year break - feel ok tomorrow is 3m at recovery rate [70% of whr]. Must measure my resting rate again soon, as before I went on the run it showed up as 54 and I'd been up and down stairs etc. the last proper reading I did was 55 when lying in bed after waking up ..so im beating that me thinks!
Well done on the longest for 27 years Lee. That's good for motivation.
Not fully recovered Brian. I couldn't run a flat out 5k if you paid me! But certainly will be well enough to run a 20m race on Sunday with 10m @ PMP.
Thanks Lee - I'll post report on Monday.
Keir wrote (see)
Well done on the longest for 27 years Lee. That's good for motivation. Not fully recovered Brian. I couldn't run a flat out 5k if you paid me! But certainly will be well enough to run a 20m race on Sunday with 10m @ PMP.
20 miles by Sunday!!! Id still be in intensive care!
Well how did everyone get on yesterday?
Yesterday I did a 7m training run at less than 70% WHR. Did out and back along the Grand Union canal near Leighton Buzzard/Milton Keynes. Did it in 10m42s per mile, though first out section [it is flat] was much quicker with a HR around 138bpm [my HRM is not sophisticated to do break down so I'm estimating] and back I was some 30s / mile slower with a avg HR of 143. So Im still getting a lot of drift and I am now seeing a plato'ing of improvement .
Keep on goign Lee. It works, Cannot remember if you said what your background was,
Did the Thanet 20 yesterday which was basically a loop starting in Ramsgate ( my hometown) and running along the seafront to Broadstairs, back to Ramsgate, out to Pegwell nature reserve and back to the finish in Ramsgate.
My target was to :
1)Treat is as a training run
2) Finish in around 2:45
3) Run progressively
4) Ignore HR and hopefully not see it spike at the start ( as has been the case in previous races )
So, i reset my garmin screens and just had pace data. Started out at around 8:45 then gradually gathered pace, building to about 8:00 by around 12M. From this point it was basically a fight to keep a lid on things and i finished strongly with the last couple of miles, which were mostly uphill, sticking to 8 m/m and a final mile of around 7:20.
Finished in 2:44 @ 80% HRav
I was surprised that despite feeling very relaxed at the start, my HR when i reviewed afterwards was still up at around 80% for the first mile !!! But overall it seems that my final stats were around what i'd expect for that run.
Also had a brief chat with Keir at the start after noticing his name in the entry list and then spotting his race number on the start line. I notice from your thread Keir that you didn't come out of the race too great - hope things improve soon.
Mace - sounds like it went well.
Spen - Im back running after a very very long break [at aged 17 I was regularly running 10ks and doing sub 35 on very hilly courses] I was xc fanataic as a kid and ran in manchester boys and northern xc representing my home town of Oldham.
So at the tender age of 44 having given up heavy smoking Im back out on the road and on the trails. I started HR training [not Hadd but parker] as it seemed to be the one that would get me fitter without being too risky on injury, so on Jan 29 I did my first 2 miler trying to keep my HR below 70% 145bpm - I pratically walked it all the way and did it in over 13m mile - BIG SHOCK to my system!
So Im now actually running and keeping my HR below 145 and avg 10.5min miles or so - so Im making progress, but the big leaps of progress have passed - I was taking 1min/mile off in some runs.
Some of the old me is coming back as i have broke 24mins for 5k and intend to get below 20 before Im 45 in July. I have 3 10ks coming up - the trail blazers - and Im looking at doing the Oxford HM in October. Im not sure full marathon is me but I might do one one day, just to say Ive done it.
Silverstone - exactly 1 year later than my first HM in more years than I care to remember!! Actually we are talking 30 years since I last did any running prior to 2012. So what happened?
Started off nice and slow but the HR seemed high (mace - I notice you said yours spikes at the start) - anyway decided to ignore and stick to my pace notes. Was 50 secs ahead after 2miles and decided to throttle back a little as I didn't want to overcook it too early. Plan was then to do the next 3 miles at 80% which worked out fine and I was then 1m 8s ahead of schedule - by this time I was feeling really good and nothing was going to stop me getting under 2 hrs. Sometime after 5 miles the HR monitor started going wild, I mean crazy - I was getting readings of 230 and I knew although I had moved up to 85% for the next 5 miles (5-10) the readings were wrong (otherwise I'd be dead I'm sure). Decided again to ignore the HR readings and go off pace and again was making up ground - the next weird thing was my watch was giving me mile marker notifications before the official markers on the course. It was round the 8 mile mark that I really started passing loads of people (6,000+ runners entered) and this gave me such a confidence boost.
At mile 10 the next stage was to up the HR to 90% for 2 miles and then for the final 2.1 miles just give it what I could. Sprint finish to the line and I felt good - not knackered, tired yes, but the legs felt OK - could have done more. So the outcome for me was a PB beating my previous best by 7m 40s and a full 13m 25s on last years race.
There is however a discrepency between my garmin time and the official time - I guess I have to take there time as the valid one. My stats were;
Dist Split Avg. HR Time1.00 9:39 157 (85%) 0:09:392.00 9:56 143 (78%) 0:19:353.00 9:33 142 (77%) 0:29:084.00 9:21 149 (81%) 0:38:305.00 9:13 191 (104%) 0:47:436.00 9:00 196 (107%) 0:56:437.00 9:11 185 (100%) 1:05:548.00 8:46 158 (86%) 1:14:419.00 8:57 145 (79%) 1:23:3910.00 8:40 158 (86%) 1:32:1911.00 8:29 169 (92%) 1:40:4812.00 8:16 147 (80%) 1:49:0513.00 8:12 175 (95%) 1:57:1713.12 0:57 155 (84%) 1:58:15
As you can see there are some HR figures between miles 5 and 7 that were just silly.
Official time taken from the website was 2:00:03 - 3 seconds over!!! Still I'm happy with how it went and 3 secs could have been lost just by getting stuck behind slower runners on the narrow parts just when I was upping the pace (that's my excuse and I'm sticking to it ). Finished 113rd out of 223 in my age category (50-54).Thanks all for the support over the last 6 months - HADD rules OK
mace - nice work on the Thanet. 80% for a race shows great discipline!
I also found sticking to my pace notes helped more than the HR - only because I wasn't sure I could trust it with all those spikes. Final average stats for me in the race were 9:01 @ 88%
BeDe - Brill, really pleased for you .... shame the official time was a miserly 3 seconds out but your a 2hr HM'er. Massive improvement on last year and your pb. Well done
There must have been some back ground electrical interferance ..Ive notice it with low/local power lines, from nowhere my monitor is saying my HR is over 170 when it was just at 130 or something similar. Maybe there is a bit of adrenaline in your system also, so probably makes sense to stick to pace rtaher than HR.
BeDe, Huge congrats on a job well done. Recover well.....
Mace, 80% average for a race does indeed show great discipline. But the positive is that you will be able to continue your training after a couple of days.
Lee, how often are you running, how far and what intensities?
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