HADD training plan

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11/06/2013 at 09:30

 I'm a fan of "minimal" but probably worth building it in gradually?

Day off today (running - I did bike to work) ... plan is to go a little longer tomorrow (7M).

11/06/2013 at 10:42

VTRunner I use Kayano 19's. I wanted to try a 4mm heel drop shoe to encourage a mid foot strike but I didn't want minimal shoes. I bought the Saucony Mirage, which like the Kayano's are a support shoe. I was AMAZED at how light they are!

11/06/2013 at 10:58

Andi, my first few marathons were in the spring. When I trained for an autumn mara, I really struggled to hit the times I hit in the winter. My stats always include the whole of the run, warm-up and cool-down. 

Vt, I don't think the time saving merits the risk of minimalist shoes. But its down to personal preference. 

Rest day today. I race Otley 10 miler tomorrow evening. Will be a low mileage week as i am attending a funeral on Thursday. 

11/06/2013 at 17:10

Maybe I could consider the shoe switch sometime next fall after recovery from the marathon but during the build up back into base training. Raining cats and dogs here today...looking for a window to get out without getting soaked...

Edited: 11/06/2013 at 17:11
11/06/2013 at 19:25

VT, I have a pair of Vibram FF Bikilas but only worn them a few times and built up (slowly) to 1.5 miles. My aim was to do my 3 mile recovery runs in them eventually and maybe carry on building to longer distances - I do prefer inclines to declines in them as they 'force' fore/midfoot striking.

Brian, I know what you mean about how the weather affects times (well HR?) during the Seasons. I went out in the rain today for a 4 mile easy run and felt good so made it 6 miles. Not fast but 10 secs/mile faster than my (planned) Marathon Pace and 65% HRR so quite pleased with that As always splits were all over the place (an undulating 510 foot incline/decline).

11/06/2013 at 19:28

It was warm and humid this evening.   So 10 bpm higher than normal.   Just got to reduce the pace.

12/06/2013 at 00:24

11M @ 72% in the rain...a thoroughly soaking run. Everything felt great though. 13M on schedule for tomorrow.

12/06/2013 at 00:35

spen, finally, I think I'm starting to understand this HR lark and (finally) over the personal stigma I give myself for being so slow - speed can wait

VT, am hopefully on course for my first 30+ mile week then I see your schedule!

Quick question, today it took me 2 miles to get to 70% of HRR (1 mile is the norm) and was happy with that but, should I go out a little faster to get to 70% sooner? and, (ok, so 2 questions) there are no flat areas here but during a 70% run should I try to run constantly at 70% or is it ok to go over by (say) 5% on hills and easier downhill or best to try to stay as close to 70% throughout and ignore pace totally? 

12/06/2013 at 04:07

Andi, good question about the hills. I wouldn't worry too much about letting it go up a bit on the hills. On decent hills, it's not uncommon for my HR to go up anywhere from 8-12 bpm during the climb or by the time I reach the top. Personally, I don't like to slow down much on the hills. A bit, but like to keep the pace fairly even. The key is to keep most of each mile near the target. I've read others say they'll walk hills though. As you get more fit, you'll see your HR climb less on hills and it no longer becomes such a worry. As to how long it takes to get up to 70% after starting a run, not sure that it matters. Low HR = good in my book.

12/06/2013 at 08:27

I tend to use routes without hills at the moment.   Easier to keep the HR in check.  The hill training can wait in my book.   The hills get easier the fitter you get anyway so no point doing them yet.   Im really working on the base as it suits me for the ultras.


Ive done a lot of reading around the subject.   And it seems its best to run at 11 m/m until your hr comes down.

12/06/2013 at 09:09

Andi, that shows how far you've come already- 10s faster than mp IS fast, and only at 65%!!!!! Good stuff! Don't worry about the hr taking its time. That is fitness. But it can also mean you are tired. You will find that it's hard to get it up (phnarr phnarr) the day after a race or a hard session. You can allow your hr to increase on the hills as long as the average remains on target. 

12/06/2013 at 09:53
Brian. wrote (see)

You will find that it's hard to get it up (phnarr phnarr) the day after a race or a hard session.  

Hot humid weather is usually a killer but once you get into the HADD mindset it doesn't seem to matter anymore that the pace drops. I just set my Garmin to display HR only and stick with it. It means I do a lot of rather slow running on some days but as long as we train in the right zone we will benefit.

Many people on other forum threads immerse themselves into speed work right now which is fine as it really works for some. I know for sure it doesn't work for me so I'm quite happily plodding along

Easy for me to avoid hills - I live in a very flat area. In fact, there's about 1 decent hill where I train. I try to do some hill reps every now and again though because they really help with leg strength. I keep those reps short enough not to exceed sub LT HR

Andi: going faster than MP at 65% is awesome

Have decided to bin my planned 15k race on Friday.
a) because I'm shit at evening running
b) because I'm even more shit at racing when it's warm
c) because it's our office away day and there's free beer. So, I much rather get pissed

12/06/2013 at 10:19

Chickadee - good plan!!   Never refuse free beer (unless it's nasty lager!).

All this talk of hills - they're the bane of my life just now!  I'm not having a good week Hadding.  My runs start out fine then miles 3-4ish are hilly and my HR rockets.  I then spend the first 1.5miles of the return route trying to get it back under control which means the second half of my runs are 30-40s per mile slower than the first.  

I'm wondering if I'm in for a cold or if my iron levels are dipping again. Just when I was starting to do well!!  It's very frustrating.  I'm going to increase my iron supplement so hopefully things will settle back down.

Soggy 6miles for me this morning - ended up with a 10.21 average so definitely worse than before.

12/06/2013 at 10:21
Andi McGill 2 wrote (see)

VT, I have a pair of Vibram FF Bikilas but only worn them a few times and built up (slowly) to 1.5 miles. My aim was to do my 3 mile recovery runs in them eventually and maybe carry on building to longer distances - I do prefer inclines to declines in them as they 'force' fore/midfoot striking.

I ran in VFFs for 6 months ... in fact a notched up a few PBs during that period (since bettered). They helped me with sorting out my heel-striking and over-striding ... but too many "ouch" moments when I stood on stones. Nice run by the way.

Good soggy running from VT (rain can be fun once yoiu're in it) ... hope the 13M goes well.

Enjoy the beer Chick ...

Biked to work ... and have 7M (easy) planned on the canal today.

12/06/2013 at 10:35

Hi all

A "work" day for me - 1m w/up then 8m sub-LT.  Came out as 8:05mm, so a tad slower than last week, but the HR was much lower and under control - levelled out at around 81% maxHR, so in all, a good session.


Have fun with the beer, Chick, and good luck in Otley tonight Brian...

12/06/2013 at 11:16

Chick, have one for me.

Tek, ta. Had a look back, done it 5 times (4x66.xx and 1x65.xx). But the lsst time I ran it was 2003! They've changed the start so I'm told, so will be interesting what happens. 

12/06/2013 at 14:41

Nice collection of times at Otley Brian ... it's not exactly flat. Never done it myself, despite it being close to home.

Sounds like another good sub-LT session Teknic!

7M on the canal for me ... sub-70% maxHR and 9:18/m. I'll cycle tomorrow and then repeat today's bike/run routine on Friday. All being well, next week I'll move up to 5 runs.

12/06/2013 at 14:53

Hospital tomorrow - see what doc says. I can still feel an ache in the back so I don't think I'll be back to running for a few weeks. Still cycling - nothing major, waiting for outcome of tomorrow.

12/06/2013 at 16:44

DrDan/BeDe, good progress being made. BeDe, fingers crossed the doc gives you good news.

Tek, solid LT run. Take the positives, it's not always gonna be faster.

12/06/2013 at 19:44

Txs for all the help/advice re hills and HR peeps - much appreciated though took a day off today as felt tired.

Chick, re your reasons for not running, not sure I believe a) or b) but c) sounds like a very good reason

RR, hope your not coming down with anything 

DrDan, I have the Bikilas with a little more sole than other FF's and supposed to be for road running but know what you mean about stones and doubt I'll be going off road with them.

BeDe, good luck for tomorrow and am amazed your cycling already!

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