HADD training plan

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Crash Hamster    pirate
22/12/2011 at 21:46

2012 targets for me:

1 sub 3:30 marathon at Stratford
2 sub 3:15 marathon at Stratford
3 finish Severn Challenge in June

My marathon PB is 3:47 and taking it down to sub 3:15 is a huge reduction, but I've never trained this seriously for running before. Only once have I had 4 consecutive 100+ mile months and these were a) just over 100 and b) done with some 20 mile runs; I'm now hitting well over 100 mile months with a long run of no more than 14 miles.

Admittedly, I was in good general shape at the time as I was training for IM triathlon, so there were a lot of bike and swimming miles in there too.

I'm also losing weight (no intention of doing so this month, but I'm 10lb lighter than three months ago) so my VO2 max should be improving; unfortunately, I also had several pulmonary emboli after completing the Transalpine Run last year, so my lungs have some (ill-defined amount of) residual scarring.

How good could I be with another 4 months of 100 miles a month behind me? I guess I'll be finding out.

22/12/2011 at 22:08

CH... I was curious to when that race was... And the live clock on the web page informed me it was in 128 days 10 hours 22 mins 29 secs, brill!!!! Good luck with the training....

22/12/2011 at 22:20

No running for me over the past 4 days, 3 days away with the family and 1 day in work which got in the way. So it'll be 60-70mins at the crack of dawn tomorrow to start the week.

Stats for 2011 have shown improvements across the board, so it's been a good year

1457miles covered to date as I work towards a 1500mile target, which I may just miss. It's not the priority though.

10K PB 44.10, 34secs off a PB that had stood for 2 years

HM PB 1.38.10, 6mins off Indian Queens in 2010. There was a lot of down hill in this one though

2 marathons, Mittelrhein in May in 4.28.41 - a 13min PB. Blew up at 23miles then Frankfurt in Oct in 4.11.56, a 16min PB and my most satisfying running experience to date

Targets for 2012 - Continue the progress, consistent training and hope to break the 4hr barrier at either Dusseldorf in April or Cologne/Frankfurt in October and see what improvements are possible in 10K and HM.

22/12/2011 at 22:38
No pressure on you SRM.... But with the John HADD calculations on your 10k time, and everything going well... You could be running a sub 3.30 marathon..... 
22/12/2011 at 22:48
SLM - Was just thinking the same as BN, Sub 4 hr based on your 10k and half should be a breeze... I have so far not achieved a sub 1.40 half or a sub 45 10k but managed a sub 4 hour marathon... This will be the year for you !!!
23/12/2011 at 09:25
Cheers BN and NB - I think I epitomise what Hadd said about a lack of relation across my race times, but with a good chuck of his training under my belt I'm very confident of getting there. Each of my marathon runs has been a learning experience, Frankfurt being proof that blowing up before the finish isn't a certainty if I've trained sensibly.
24/12/2011 at 22:13
Merry xmas fellow Hadders, remember xmas day is no excuse for not getting out for a 60min easy run.
25/12/2011 at 20:44

Merry Xmas everyone!!!!

Didn't run today, but ran 20miles yesterday. Hilly road too - 2hrs 40. Happy with that. Don't feel guily having stuffed myself today.

27/12/2011 at 14:09
Hi- am asking for a little advice here- I'm a VERY slow runner, so that, at <70%, 10 miles would take for ever- I am up to 90mins ( just over 8 miles) at this HR without drift, but am not really doing longer runs yet, . Is this a good enough basis to start adding the Z2/ ILTHR/ 80%  runs in? ( I think they're all the same thing) despite not fulfilling the instruction that I need to manage 10 miles without drift.
27/12/2011 at 17:59
I eagerly await an answer tricialitt as my slow running is slower than that but I'll be getting there soon I hope. Brian was talking about time equating to my runs as a pose to distance because of a lack of speed. I'm sure he or someone else will be along soon.

I am absolutely thrilled to be doing the amount of running that I am. I'm going to do the test next Wednesday and see how that goes. I'm aiming for Amsterdam marathon in October and hoping to break 4hrs 30.

Brian do you do anything in particular to keep PF at bay. Notice you said you'd had some time out with it.
27/12/2011 at 19:09

Tricialitt... Is is a snippet from one of john HADD's athlete's, hope this make's sense.... 

During base training, you concentrate on aerobic work sessions, and the idea is to "lock in" each HR range until you could run at that HR all day (well, 60 to 75 min) without slowing down. You do this progressively, starting with lower HRs and shorter "intervals," and over the weeks ratchet up the duration of intervals, total duration of work, and working HR levels, or maybe shorten the rest between intervals.

But don't move up until you've mastered the level you're already working at, which means being able to run more than 60 minutes at that HR without slowing down to keep HR below the target.

So you might begin the program (after getting to 50 mpw of easy running comfortably) working at 80-83% of HRmax on Tuesday and Friday, and stay with that level until you can comfortably complete an hour of work without slowing down, and knowing you could keep on going at that effort and pace. As the pace-HR relationship gets locked in, you can up the second work session to 82-85% of HRmax.

So week 1, maybe you do 2 x 20 min @ 80-83% Tuesday and then 30 or 40 min @ 80-83% Friday. Next two or three weeks, maybe stay at that HRs, but get the sessions up to 2 x 30 then 60 min continuous for 80-83% work, and then maybe start to ease in something like 2 x 12 min, 2 x 15, 3 x 15, 3 x 20, 2 x 30, 60 continuous for 82-85%.

Over the following weeks, work up into higher HR ranges, with similar interval progression (85-88%, and 87-90%).

28/12/2011 at 15:22
I had a good run this morning despite the fact that a branch jumped out of a tree and landed 3foot in front of me. Freaked the life out of me and didn't do the heart rate much good. My quads ached quite a bit for some reason.

BN that makes sense. Think I'll aim for that in a few weeks time. I did wonder if you just jumped in and tried to do the whole session at the next level. Obviously not.

I'm beginning to wish I'd done my first mini test 2 or 3 weeks ago as it would have showed a greater improvement but I haven't run that far since April so here's hoping they will still show improvements.

Have a good week all and a happy new year.
28/12/2011 at 17:29

Thanks BN74- I thought it seemed silly to have to be able to go for such incredibly long periods without drift, just 'cos I'm so slow.

I will be a relief to be "allowed" into the dizzy heights of 80-83% ( 145-150 HR for me) Quite excited, actually! - so this is my plan for a run tomorrow- 2x20 mins @ 145-150.-come hell or high water- (actually, looking at the weather outside, they have both come, here in Glasgow-) high chance that this will be done on tready.

Also, I'm up to 85 mins for my LSR, at < 135 , so will continue to slowly build the length of that up to the usual 3 hrs for pre-marathon long runs ( I never make it to 20 miles without going WAAY beyond 3hrs, but hopefully I can at least manage these without the horrible drift that usually afflicts me- I've been up into the high 160's HR wise on LSR's often in the past!, despite plodding along at a very slow pace). I've decided tot switch into the P7D marathon plan about 12 weeks before the race, but that leaves me short on LSR's, so will start building that from now.- should give me 5 x 3 hour runs before taper, I think.

28/12/2011 at 17:32

Hi Sneglen, glad to be of help...

29/12/2011 at 12:24

Hi Sneglen/Tricialitt, All i would add to BN's excellent advice is to add in the 2hr long run. This moves me up a gear/ or makes everything easier, and significantly lowers the HR for other runs. I am guessing the length of the run causes the adaptations to occur more quickly.

Good luck with the training!

29/12/2011 at 12:50
Thanks. So does that mean that the long run (working up to 2 hours) should be at 70 - 75% HR with 2 of the other runs incorporating the faster runs and then for me (5runs a week) 2 more runs at 75% or should the long run incorporate faster work.
29/12/2011 at 17:45

Just like to echo what Brian put earlier.... I consider the LSR as the corner stone of the HADD training, and doesn't need to be messed around with.... The remaining run's can be played with, and adapted to suit your own needs, as I tried to explain on the 27/12....

 I also consider the LSR as a better gauge to how my training is going, instead of the 5 x 2400mtrs session.... Reason for this is, I consider myself as a FT (fast twicth fibre's) runner, and efforts of 2.4K are very comfortable, so all the improvement I have made recently is in the stamia department, and the best gauge for this is the LSR......

Off to battle the wind.....Happy Running!!!!!!!

29/12/2011 at 18:05

Sneglen, The LSR should be 70%. I tackle PF in 3 ways:

1. Keep the calves loose by regular sports massage, and my own on the foam foller.

2. Flexibility in my ankles was non-exitsant, so I started kneeling, sitting back on the feet toes outstretched. This was painful at first but can now hold the position for a few minutes.

3. Roll the golf ball, applying as much weight/pressure as I can bear.

Edited: 29/12/2011 at 18:06
29/12/2011 at 19:20
Thanks both. Got it sussed I hope. Have worked out what I'm going to do and when, but for now, still base running for another 4 weeks
29/12/2011 at 19:55

OK, I managed to do some 80-83% runnning this morning, but getting a bit of drift after just 11 of the planned 20 minutes, so had to slow pace to compensate- I do find that HR drift is probably more of an issue on the tready in a stuffy gym, than outside in the fresh air.

So back to the slow relaxed stuff til  next week ( next YEAR ), when I'll allow myself another brief flurry of slightly faster running.

Thanks again for the advice.

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