HADD training plan

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15/07/2012 at 05:15

For my sub-lt runs I normally go out and back, generally on the canal but, inspired by mace and DrDan I decided to do a lap based affair.

The lap is a 1.57 mile figure of 8, close to home, with a couple of hills in each lap. This run was an eye-opener for me as the results were a fair way from the results I normally get. It was a little windy too. Thats it for my excuses.

I did 8 laps 12.57 miles in 97:04, avg pace 7:43 HRav=144, as follows:

1. 13:26 8:33 123  (Warm-up)

2. 11:26 7:16  145

3. 11:31 7:20  151

4. 11:40 7:25  150

5. 11:48 7:31  150

6. 11:51 7:32  150

7. 11:49 7:32 151

8. 13:29 8:39  138

Completely knackered and deflated! But at least i know where I am with 14 weeks to go to my target HM. Back in the gym this week with a vengeance.


Edited: 15/07/2012 at 05:18
15/07/2012 at 10:15

aw Brian - we all have runs that we are unhappy with... wind and hills would make a difference though... how about trying again on the flat?

17 miles today with 8 @ MP (and against the wind). HR a tad too high but I blame the wind... felt great all the way though and surprisingly not knackered.

15/07/2012 at 12:13

Brian - Impressive stuff but I get the impression from your comments that you aren't in serious training at the moment or maybe just had a bad run ? what would you expect for that run on top form ? and i guess from the 150's your max is around 190 ?

chickadee - nice run, what's your MP ?

12.8m for me at 6am, in 2:15 @ 69%. Especially pleased that i managed to keep HR down over the last few miles.


15/07/2012 at 14:42

Brian, those runs definitely happen. But you at least get a bit of a lift for gutting it out. Now you can absorb the good work this week.

Chickadee and Mace, well done on solid efforts today.

Well, sad to report that I have not run since Tuesday. Whatever I did has lingered. It continues to improve each day though. Today I jogged for half a block to just to test and no pain on the steps. However, can still feel it if I probe for it. I think I have to take at least take another day or two; perhaps it will finish repairing by then. If I'm pain free I can then try an easy run. If that goes OK, perhaps a week or two of easy running. Wish I could get back out...I've trained solid since January and I am worried this could derail things. Oh well, can only do what you can do.




Edited: 15/07/2012 at 14:43
15/07/2012 at 16:17

Week 4 done... some positives, some negatives... two good runs, but cut today's long run short by 30 minutes as I'm pretty jetlagged... also my shins are both sore... fingers crossed it's nothing serious. The other two runs were impressive... it's amazing what running on the flat can do.

60:01 @ 148bpm - 5:20/km (warm & sunny California)

60:01 @ 148bpm - 5:17/km (as above)

62:11 @ 149bpm - 5:50/km (hilly, windy, rainy, cold Europe - just horrible)

Some impressive sessions done this week.... especially Mace & Chickadee

Next run Tuesday morning along the Promenade des Anglais in Nice... should be a bit more pleasant than today 

16/07/2012 at 08:43

Chickadee, Good combo of long run and MP work. If your not knackered after that you are in good shape!

mace/VTrunner, My max is 186. 2 reasons for poor results - I'm carrying a kg or 2, and I haven't done an 80% run for a month (and that was only 60mins). Also I normally do the run on the flat (towpath). On the towpath when in good nick I would expect sub-7s. So 7:30s was a bit of a wake up call. I am just about to return to HM training, and am hoping to get back in to the gym too.

Having said that I would take 18 months off marathons, I am just about to post my GFA entry form off to VLM2013. This is a contingency plan

16/07/2012 at 09:42

VT and M.arkF ... take it easy. No injuries allowed! Best to be 10% undertrained than 10% overtrained (Hadd said something along these lines).

Chick - great 17 miler!

Brian - a few more sub-LT sessions and I bet it all starts to click back into place.

Well, Sunday was supposed to be a 10M race but it turned into another sub-LT session ... this was due to getting a bit carried away at a party the night before . It was a hilly windy route ... came out at 82.6% maxHR, 7:17/m. I would normally expect to race a 10M at about 157 bpm av HR.

1, 7:52 (inc 13s to get over line), HR?
2, 7:36, 144 bpm
3, 6:37, 144 bpm
4, 7:01, 144 bpm
5, 7:21, 148 bpm
6, 7:12, 148 bpm
7, 7:27, 147 bpm
8, 7:16, 147 bpm
9, 7:24, 144 bpm
10, 7:06, 147 bpm

16/07/2012 at 15:16

Nice one, Dr. Dan

VT runner: sorry to hear you are injured . A week off should do little to no harm. Best to cure it properly ... otherwise you may face an even longer layoff. Fingers cross it mends quickly.

MarkF: crikey, you get around a fair bit ...

Mace: I am hoping to break 3:30 in the autumn (current PB 3:38), so my MP is 8mm, or 7:59 to be precise

16/07/2012 at 18:14

Not posted an update in a while so here goes (nothing spectacular, just a build up of slow miles at 130bpm which is 70% max)


Last Week (45, 60 and 80min runs)

Run 1 - 45mins - 10.10/mile - 131bpm

Run 2 - 60mins - 9.27/mile - 141bpm (yes I know! )

Run 3 - 80mins - 10.28/mil - 135bpm


This Week (20, 50, 60 and 80min runs)

..........but I had a 10k race yesterday so I skipped the 60min run

Run 1 - 20mins - 10.03/mile - 121bpm

Run 2 - 80mins - 10.10/mile - 136bpm

Run 3 - 48.26 - 7.47/mile - 162bpm - New PB!!!

All in all a good couple of weeks and a brilliant weekend, knocking 1min 30 off my best time in the last 2 years and about 20seconds off my previous best!


Edited: 16/07/2012 at 18:15
16/07/2012 at 18:17

Dr. Dan, not a bad post-booze effort.

Well, bad news. Saw my PT today and she's pulled me from all activities for the next two weeks. Apparenlty what I have either is, or is dangerously close to, a sports hernia. So either I take the time to heal now or risk some serious damage. I am really hoping it's not already too far along as apparenlty only surgery will resolve a true sports hernia. So please keep your good running karma coming my way.

Such a bummer. But I'm not going to let it get me down too much. Even if I end up losing 3-4 weeks, I might still be able to be ready for my October race. If not, I'll just get back on the HADD horse and shoot for something next year. All this base shouldn't go anywere and I actually just love to get out there and run (80 or 70% doesn't always matter to me).

Stay tuned...

16/07/2012 at 19:05
Nightmare, I feel for you! I had a sports hernia, had to have it repaired back end of 2007, that stopped my football and brought me to the world of running..... If its close to a sports hernia then core strengthening might help, I was beyond the point of it being any use.
16/07/2012 at 22:00

Right, Garmin on its way, hopefully by the end of the week. Have put a little schedule together to keep myself motivated:

Did three runs this past week, 2 x 45mins and 1 60 mins so a total of 150

Up to 4 runs this week - 35, 35, 30 and 65 so 165 mins and a 10% increase.

Stick to the 4 runs and 10% increase until week 7, where I should be at 60, 60, 50, 90, giving a total of 260mins. Rounding the increases down to make sure I don't do myself a mischief.

The 3rd run is slightly shorter as I plan to do Tues, Thurs, Sat, Sun so want to keep the Sat run a bit shorter before the long run on Sunday.

Week 8 will be an easy week of 45 x 3 and a 60 min to give the aching knees a rest and then back to the 10% increase for week 9.

Week 10 will see a fifth run added on Weds so the shorter runs pop down a bit to keep within the 10% increase. By my calculations should see a 2hr run by mid October and can then think about what to do next.

tl;dr: finally getting a hrm this week and will be slowly but surely eeking up to a 2hr long run over the next few months. Can't wait!

Does the above seem sensible to everyone? My only thought is perhaps I should swap the long run to Saturday so that I have a rest day just before the long run and then a shorter run afterwards?

17/07/2012 at 07:49

F44, congrats on the pb!

VTrunner, Tough luck on the hernia. Best wishes for the recovery.

17/07/2012 at 09:33

madoldtory - that seems reasonable to me... more or less what I'm planning to do in order to up my runs from 3 to 5 a week over the next couple of months. Personally I prefer a day off after the long run rather than before... I know my legs need it.

VTrunner - that's a bugger... any chance you can do something like swimming ? You could use a pull-buoy meaning you'd only be using the top half of your body.

chickadee - I do get around a bit... work... it's a real PITA... in 3 weeks I've had 13 flights and 71 hours in the air.... thank goodness for compression socks... the jetlag has really affected my training though.

Did a 60 minute this morning and although I was relatively slow, at least I had no shin pain so that was a big relief

17/07/2012 at 10:11

Nice running folks !!!

Chickadee - good luck with the MP work and pb attempt, that's an impressive target.

VT - sorry to hear of the injury, wish you a speedy recovery

forty44 - congrats on the pb !!

madoldtory - sounds to me like you're going the right way about it.  Don't try too much in one go. I got carried away a few weeks back when i upped my mileage and added in some quicker stuff at the same time. I didn't consciously do this, it was only looking back at my stats i realised what i'd done and i ended up having to take a few extra rest days with a niggly knee/calf.

I also just do a short easy run on Saturday, LSR Sunday then rest Monday. I'm up to 13 miles LSR with 2 days rest a week and i'm finding the rest day after the LSR very welcome. Last week i tried a 3 mile recovery run the day after and to be honest my legs felt like they couldn't be arsed !! So, i agree with MarkF on that but obviously everyone is different.

Out at 5.30am fresh as a daisy today, 5m @ 71% @ 9:12/m ( 12 seconds /mile better than the same run last week )


19/07/2012 at 09:15

Weekly sub-LT this morning.

Didn't sleep as well as usual due to the excitement !!!

The same 1.3m lap as last week, with a lap warm up and a lap cool down. Total 80 mins with 55 @ sub-LT ( 80% = 140bpm) and the sub-LT bit looked like this ....

Lap       Time           Pace          HR           Last wk

1          10:45          8:10           139           8:22   134

2          10:56          8:17           140           8:22   137

3          11:06          8:28           140           8:26   138

4          11:15          8:36           140           8:40   138

5          11:18          8:37           140          

Managed an extra lap this week and the warm up lap was quicker which helped get me up to 80% on the first sub-LT lap. I also set my HR alarm a bit higher (142bpm this week, 140 last week ) which has upped the HRav per lap to bang on 80%.


19/07/2012 at 10:14
That's spot on mace. Hopefully the pace will improve over the next 4 weeks. Keep the faith. I had lunch out on a client tues so went to the track straight from work. Wasn't sure what to do but after 6lap w-up and drills managed 4x400 (60s), 2x800 (90s), 4x400 (60s).

Came out at 87,83,82,81, 2:52, 2:51, 83,82,82,81.

Been a while since id run on the track and I really enjoyed it. Day off today going fishing this aft.
Edited: 19/07/2012 at 10:18
19/07/2012 at 10:21

Nice track session Brian - enjoy the fishing!

Mace ... nice sub-LT session. You now have your protocol sorted ... just need to repeat it consistently.

I've just been plodding to/from work this week, as I was still tired from Sunday's 10M "race" ... will hopefully do a sub-LT session tomorrow and a good long run on Sunday..

19/07/2012 at 11:30

Good running there Brian and mace. I find trackwork quite difficult and always end up blasting it on the first few reps which means a slow death over the final ones . I do like it though! Shame, since we moved there is no track nearby. Previously I had one a mile from home.

Dr. Dan: enjoy the sub LT run tomorrow. I will probably do one too, depending on how the legs feel coz I did some tempo running today. I am loosely following P&D with most runs being HADDish but I thought I should stick to the tempo and interval stuff as per P&D. Shame that my HR monitor played up (it showed 168-175 during warmup and then froze at 95 ). I guess a battery change is due . So I ran by feel and ended up around 7:30ish. Not rocking the world but I always find it tough at the beginning of a marathon buildup to hit any decent paces. I guess miles are eating speed

19/07/2012 at 13:28

Brian - just out of interest ( i won't be doing them just yet !! ), but do you run the intervals at HR or just by feel ?

Dr Dan - i think i should be keeping it at that distance ( works out at 9.2m incl warm up / warm down ) while my LSR is around 13m.

Does that sound right ? I'm sure i read somewhere it should be around 2/3rds of LSR ?

Also, meant to ask but forgot, is a tempo run the same as a progressive run ?

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