HADD training plan

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18/10/2012 at 11:50

Brian - fantastic!! Brilliant account that had us all on the edge of our seats waiting for that final time.

I bet that beer tasted good after finding out it was a pb after all

18/10/2012 at 11:53

BD2000, Twas only Heineken, but tasted like champagne.

18/10/2012 at 11:59

well done Brian, very impressive, and a good, pacy narrative too

18/10/2012 at 12:08

Not really a question about HADD - I know manufacturers of shoes recommend 500 - 600 miles on shoes and then change. What's the reality? I'm up to 600 now (Brooks Ravenna 3) and they still feel fine and supportive (I have supportive inner soles after binning the originals). Some people here must be changing every 6 - 8 weeks if we are to believe the manufacturers.

18/10/2012 at 12:51

Brian - a pb and getting closer to sub-80. Well done, plenty to be very proud of there

18/10/2012 at 12:59
mace wrote (see)

So i just ran to HR. Surely if i'd gone by pace i'd have crashed. I've seen a few people say don't go by HR in a race and i have to admit i'm struggling to understand the reasoning in that.

Sorry, lurking as a former Hadd-er and had to chip in here! Never ever run a race by HR Mace - the nerves/adrenaline will cause your HR to be higher than normal therefore you'll run slower than you need to to keep it in check. So no, if you'd gone by pace, as long as that pace was realistic, you wouldn't have crashed. HR is handy for determining what that pace should be though. For example, I know from experience that I can a run a HM at a pace that in training is consistent with a HR of 178-179bpm (I've got a high max of 196). So, before my recent HM I did a 6-mile HM pace run with my HR monitor and came out at 6:39mm average for 178bpm. That gave me the confidence to go for that pace at GER on Sunday and I managed a big new PB, Garmin pace 6:38 av, so pretty much spot on with what my test run told me I could do. There was no need to wear the monitor on the day and it would have just been a distraction.

Another interesting point from my Hadd experiment was that although it was a success and my HR/pace improved dramatically over time, when I ditched the Hadd schedule, cut my mileage and starting doing lots of intense tempos/speedwork and races, I still wore my HR for easy runs, and that HR/pace relationship continued to improve dramatically. So, I guess what I'm saying, is don't believe what you've read about anaerobic work destroying your aerobic base or whatever, as, in my case, it certainly didn't.

Edited: 18/10/2012 at 13:01
18/10/2012 at 13:26
Daren F, interesting point on the anaerobic training damaging development. I'm a little bit sceptical on that speedwork hinders training. Although I could be wrong. Thats only my opinion.
18/10/2012 at 13:46

Horses for courses. Everyone will have an opinion. VO2 work doesn't kill aerobic base, it improves it. But it is best used after building a good aerobic base.

Running to HR gave me my first sub-3 mara. I nailed it with a negative split too. The only distance i would use HR is marathon, and generally run on feel all the shorter distances. But it should only be used as a guideline.

I know an elite Canadian 800m runner. He came over to the UK to base train. I couldn't get my head round it at first, but he was running 70-90 miles per week, including runs of up to 20miles. This was his base for 800m running.



18/10/2012 at 14:01

went out this morning to have a another go at 140bpm (70%) and wow i had some serious drift. mile splits were 7:55 8:17 8:32 8:40 8:41 8:57 8:58 9:52 9:30. not 100% sure what effect this will have on racing at the moment (next few months) but hoping that sooner or later this improves drastically. i`m not really after speeding up the first mile obviously but it would be nice if eventually 8-8:15min mile pace could be sustained throughout the run for the same hr.

18/10/2012 at 14:27

Remember AtD, discount the first couple of miles (warm-up). Also, you may not be fully recovered, or maybe dehydrated.

Edited: 18/10/2012 at 14:29
18/10/2012 at 15:39

Brian, well done! A thrilling account to be sure (got my HR up just reading it). The carrot is still there...you'll get it next time around.

This has been a good week of runs. Perhaps I could classify it as a holy sh*t week. Feels like my fitness just rushed back in. Love those moments. Now must continue to fight the voice saying "run more"!

18/10/2012 at 17:17

Chick - great marathon PB!

And Brian - great HM PB and so close to target! You'll get your sub-80 at Brass Monkey (just don't forget to sign up on Saturday morning - it will be full by lunchtime!). I hope to bag a sub-90 there.

Not much Hadding going on here ... I will resume after the Leeds Abbey Dash.

18/10/2012 at 21:53

Nice write up Brian re Eindhoven. As you probably realised Valley Striders had a trip over there and they seemed to enjoy  themselves with a few marathon PBs.

19/10/2012 at 08:01

DrDan, Ta. Setting the alarm for tomorrow morning. Maybe do the parkrun too. I'm sure you will sub90 at BM. Good luck with the training.

JB, Forgot you were a VStrider. One of the guys I run with at lunchtime (Rothwell), his partner is a VS. She gave us the idea of a trip to Eindhoven. Hows things with you? Hopefully lengthening the easy runs?


19/10/2012 at 14:13

Hi Dr. Dan

Well, I'm HADDing again - the usual post-marathon-oh-god-I'm-slow-and-shit phase. Rather than randomly bimbling I'm setting my Garmin to display HR only and work with that. Checking the pace at the end of the run is disheartening ... but pace will come back eventually


19/10/2012 at 15:06



This is interesting.   I noticed this on a 12 mile run the other day.   I kept my pace level and my HR went up 5bpm per minute.


I am currently getting up to 70 miles a week.  With one long 82% run.   How would you split the 70 miles up.

19/10/2012 at 15:32

Brian - there's a group that regularly runs on the canal at lunchtimes that includes a Rothwell runner. I don't know him but I raced against him a  few times last year and recognised his distinctive running style from the canal ... probably V60. Is that the group you run in?

19/10/2012 at 15:41

DrDan, Yep. There can be quite a few of us if we all turn up at once. Quite a good variation of abilities too. We tend to do the tempo stuff as time outandbacks, so we get back at approx the same time. Been on a few run trips with the 2 rothwell lads and partners. They're nice people, as well as keen runners and coaches.

You based near Leeds?

19/10/2012 at 16:35

Yep, I work at the Uni, so either run on the canal or else in Hyde Park. The latter is good at this time of year when it's wet or windy as the trees give you some protection - but the 1M laps can get dull, so the canal still features as an alternative. I have probably run past you a hundred times - if you spot me, say hello ... tall bloke with beard and ponytail, and at this time of year I'm usually in a long-sleeved blue/white Chester marathon top (as I have 4 of them ... they were selling them off after last year's race for 3-for-£10).

19/10/2012 at 21:22
DrDan, 3 of us were lapping Hyde park on wed. We tend to go up there if it's wet on the towpath. Hopefully will spot u on a lunchtime. We meet at the top of the steps to the canal on whitehall rd at 12.20, if u fancy some company.
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