Moraghan Training - Stevie G

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23/01/2013 at 21:20

Popping in with a newbie question: so I ran 5 miles on the treadmill on Monday at 8:30 minites per mile pace, then did the same on Tuesday at 8:00 and today 7:30 pace. So obviously I will carry on gettign faster and faster so once I am running at 5:00 minutes  per mile, how can I train so I can do a 2:12 marathon at that pace? Is it going to be soon enough that I need to enter London this year?

23/01/2013 at 21:41
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Edited: 23/01/2013 at 21:42
23/01/2013 at 21:46
PMJ: 2:12? What, are you planning on running in fancy dress or something? Honestly, its this kind of lack of ambition that's holding back marathon running in this country. Do a couple more sessions a week, and you should be aiming for 2:06.

Anyway, my thoughts are:
- your aim seems realistic, but you probably need to check progress regularly, so get yourself to a parkrun every week and try to take 30-45 seconds off each time.
- try one of the 8 week marathon training programmes recommended by sports drink companies. These are well known to be foolproof.
- if in doubt, employ a run-walk strategy. You will need to do the walking bit at 5.30 minute mile pace
- make sure you post the same thing again and again in multiple threads across all forums, just to cover all the bases.
IronCat5    pirate
23/01/2013 at 21:50

I think you'll be fine for Rio PMJ.

23/01/2013 at 22:01

Phil, you'll have to add to the title 'Can I' or 'How Long' as well.

 Why do posters stick those on threads? All I can answer is 'I don't know, I'm not you!'

23/01/2013 at 22:14

You will need to stick to a protein only diet and fast every Wednesday if you want sub 2:12 at this year's VLM mind.

Where've you been Philip?

Seb - will be interested to see how those Yaktrax do. I waited as long as possible to go for my run today, as the delivery tracking for the Orocs said the courier had them at 10.01 - never bloody turned up though! Given the ice is all gonna be washed away over the weekend, I might be sending them staright back!

23/01/2013 at 22:14

I just posted on some similar thread tonight

A guy with a pure meltdown as he goes longer distances. He's probably trying to run halfs and marathons off 20miles a week or something, because he can blag a decent 5k off that.

23/01/2013 at 22:20
PMJ - forgot to mention the most important bit! You've got to REALLY want it, and make sure you believe in yourself. This is scientifically proven to be more beneficial for your running than any amount of training you could do.
23/01/2013 at 22:23

RJ - I totally agree with you on the long run making a difference to 10k/HM performance. I upped my long runs of 14 miles (I'd go 2-4 weeks without one sometimes) to consistent 18-19 milers and my fitness rocketed. I hit the line at Leeds Abbey Dash knowing I was fitter rather than hoping as previously. That's why now I do 17-18 every Saturday. Base endurance gets overlooked I feel, and like you say speed work is the icing on the cake.

I clipped off 12.5 tonight in 7:20 average with a lovely low HR of 158 beats per min. Well within my 'areobic' zone. So pleasing, bloody cold though!

Edited: 23/01/2013 at 22:24
23/01/2013 at 22:56
Possibly Stevie but I don't know many that actually get injured during the marathon. Granted a hard raced marathon will take a few weeks to fully get out of your system but if its your main goal for the season then theres no problem with that. It could be that a change in focus actually reduces your chance of getting injured even if overall volume goes up. Your interval work wouldn't have to be high at all.

Lol dachs - you jest but belief really really does go a long long way. The training helps back up your beliefs sure but if you dare to dream then there is more of a chance than if you don't. Just look at my football club bradford city! There is no logical reason for them to be in the final but they are. They wouldn't have got there without a big dose of belief.
24/01/2013 at 01:35
The Bus wrote (see)
Where've you been Philip?

IIll, but seem to be better now and foot is OK so a campaign begins.

24/01/2013 at 07:38

Jase, there's a few cautionary tales from this thread alone of what the marathon can do! Ranging from a couple of weeks of injury to completely ruining half a year!

I covered 26.2miles in an odd Marlow club event once on a boiling hot day. Feeling like death didn't quite cover it!!

Edited: 24/01/2013 at 07:38
24/01/2013 at 08:14
But is that because the person has done a marathon or because running just happens to be a relatively risky sport from an injury perspective? I see plenty of folk getting injured from training for halfs and below. I used to get far more injuries when hammering out vo2max intervals every week than when I realised that to run a decent marathon (or half) they just weren't necessary.
24/01/2013 at 08:39
And indeed last autumn when building for my half I seemed to have far more niggles than I ever do in marathon training despite mileage being much less. I put that down to more vo2max interval sessions. But of course I could be wrong.

Adrenaline is a funny one and also sure it gives competitors something extra but I suspect this is far more relevant to explosive sports rather than long distance running.

I guess some folk do their tempos as part of races, which is cool and these will no doubt give you the same physiological benefits as a good hard tempo run on your own. But I'm not convinced they will give you the same benefits psychologically.
24/01/2013 at 08:41

I'll quote Bruce Tulloh from his article on Half Marathons.

" In the half-marathon you are running 11 miles or more at a steady state, as close to your maximum oxygen uptake as you can go without accumulating lactic acid".

He then added that therefore you need to do most of your good training at around your best 10k pace.

Also he said that its more important to work on speed than endurance.

So a few ideas about the event from that. One that stuck was the lactic acid thing. Implies cruising until the final two miles when hopefully we can finish like Dean R.

 

24/01/2013 at 08:56

Adrenaline gets you geared up to smash a race, and it always seems to mean I monster the first mile.

I like it a couple of miles in when things calm down a bit, you're at the right pace, amongst the right people.

There's always a time later on where it starts becoming very clear what your mission for that race is, whether it's to beat a certain person, or the time you can get is very black and white!

Ric, hard to disagree with working on the speed, as that's something that won't go on forever, whereas to some extent, you can always go for longer. I know a chap who seems to do it the other way round, doing monumental mileages and is ALWAYS talking about how he'll add speed later. He's around mid 40s, so not entirely sure how infinite he thinks his ability to add speed will be

24/01/2013 at 09:27
The lactic acid thing is bang on and even at 10k pace this is what you are developing. So not really 'speed work' more 'speed endurance'. true vo2max intervals 3k-5k pace are what will develop your speed and bring you to a nice peak for race day.
IronCat5    pirate
24/01/2013 at 10:01
So that's tempo training then Ric,!
24/01/2013 at 10:31
Stevie G . wrote (see)

Jase, there's a few cautionary tales from this thread alone of what the marathon can do! Ranging from a couple of weeks of injury to completely ruining half a year!

I covered 26.2miles in an odd Marlow club event once on a boiling hot day. Feeling like death didn't quite cover it!!

but RJ said after his marathons he took about a month off running, allowing everything to settle nicely and recover.  Are the stories of injuries in 2012 following a marathon from this thread because they got back into it too quick?   Im not in any way criticising them as i would have done the same.

also you felt like death running 26m as a one off, i would too,but i imagine it feels different if you build upto it after 4 months of solid mileage.

After all this talk of marathons i was thinking ahead last night about my shot at one in 2014.  first off i was thinking delay it until 2015 and enjoy the short stuff but then i thought it could be my winter/spring thing to try and get a breakthrough by doing all the mileage.  I wouldnt miss many A races if i train for VLM

Edited: 24/01/2013 at 10:32
24/01/2013 at 11:33

Deano - go on, do VLM in 2014.  That's my plan.  I'll see you on the champs start if I can break 1:15 or 2:45 this year, which ought to be within my capabilities.

In my case, it was almost certainly an issue of coming back to running too soon, as the injury appeared after my first run back.  I took a week off as all the advice says, and started back gently, but maybe I should have left it longer in recognition of the fact that I'm still a relative novice.  And certainly shouldn't have aggravated it by running again the next day, just to make sure.  And then shouldn't have delayed seeking any advice on it for a couple of weeks.  My own fault really.

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