Over 60s training.

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23/07/2016 at 15:47

Parkrun: 21:31, so not too bad. A category win BUT a VM70-74 clocked under 21 which put me in my place.

Longish cycle ride to the event and then back home in the glorious sunshine (if a bit too warm for comfort in the run).

Achilles is a bit sore but nothing like as bad as of late, so hoping I'm on the mend. No run though tomorrow.........but a bit of a short, sharp bike ride planned.

24/07/2016 at 14:21

good day

Columba
ouch to your swollen knee - when is the x-ray appointment?

WD60
hot everywhere just now but it has broken here with some rain

John
good gallop at the Parkrun. 
Beware of that achilles though - if it is inflamed it does not go away and will flare up again.

Ceal 
warm enough for you??

MIck
it's called Sods Law
When you laid your motor bike up for the winter did you drain all fuel out of it?
I have heard from a couple of friends who are summer riders that they have had problems because of old fuel in the tank and its ethanol content which absorbs moisture making it misfire and eventually stop. only solution was a complete flush out and new petrol.

I have been struggling now all a week just trying to run, no energy at all,  not helped by a near forgotten back spasm on Wednesday which was a painful reminder of how things used to be so I have taken it very easy only doing a couple of miles at near walking pace!

Managed 4.25 miles this morning - slightly better in 40 min (9:25m/m) with av HR 132 and a max of 145 as I cheated on the Rambo Hipps Hills and went up the wimps way.

Felt very guilty passing the 1,000's of runners getting ready for the Great Yorkshire 10K in town this morning so I went and cheered them on a little later as they tackled the tough course just as it warmed up and almost ran past my house at the 5K mark.
Surprisingly the very big field looked to be mainly in pretty good order with only a few walkers at that stage although I did not have the heart to tell them that there was another mile of climb before the downhill started.......................

Edited: 24/07/2016 at 14:23
24/07/2016 at 15:08

managed 5 times up and down local hill on bike. This was quite tiring but then a few hours with grandchild number 2 has finished me off.......... Thanks for Achilles advice; a frustrating condition indeed.

24/07/2016 at 18:48

John,

I must reinforce Tony's comments on your Achilles. If inflammation is still present be very careful about running, a good way to tell is the pinch test. Just gently pinch your Achilles and if it is painful do not run.

Well done on your time.

TS,

I find that now 70 is very close, a matter of weeks, I get periods where I seem to tire easily. Yesterday I ran 10k in the heat and really struggled. Legs felt fine but just no omph. I ran with two younger friends who seem unaffected. The pace would normally be well within my capabilities.

I don't drain my tank, I just add a fuel stabilizer as it is what is recommended by the Triumph dealer. I suspect my problem is associated with a vacuum hose that runs from the inlet manifold to the ecu. One of the connectors was cracked and I changed it but that didn't fix it. I think the complete connection needs to be changed.

Fixed the leak in the pool filter, chopped up the tree and my bike is in the shop. I am now sitting on my porch, feet up, sipping  on my drink while watching my computer programming course on my tablet totally chilled. Well that is until something else breaks.

Mick

 

24/07/2016 at 19:01

Thanks Mick. Regarding the 70 issue, as I said I was beaten by a 70 year old on Saturday. I looked up his stats and found that he's ranked 21st in the UK. When I saw him warming up I thought he might be 65 years old, tops. He 'looked the part'.

It does make you wonder how some folk just keep going and at a very high level. I guess the gifted Ceal would be our in-house expert (by far!) on this. For all the prudence shown by these elite folk (eg not training on sore Achilles) there are clearly two extra variables

1. natural talent, plus

2. the ability to either not sustain injury and/or to shake it off quickly

There's probably loads of research out there that might be of interest but you'd need to be a serious exercise physiologist to be able to master it.

Looking at it with a bit more detachment I suspect that anyone who still runs after 60 (as that's  our thread) is statistically highly unusual. But to run at a high level (let's say AG 85%) is a wonder to behold.

And I'll have half a pint of what they are drinking..................... 

 

 

25/07/2016 at 12:11

TS - I'm curious to know what the "wimp's way" up Hipps Hill is; a different route, or just dropping to a walk?
My x-ray is due tomorrow, and if it shows arthritis I will then be offered a steroid injection.

Mick - re approaching 70 - I think we tend to be dominated by our use of a decimal system for counting (reinforced by age categories for athletes which go in 5-year jumps), and consequently dread reaching what people will call "significant" birthdays. Certainly, age-related things are going to get us sooner or later, but not necessarily at 70, or at 60, or at 75...  They will happen when they happen. Sufficient unto the day, and all that. There's someone on the Fetcheveryone website called "Canute", who is extremely knowledgeable about effects of aging on running and other athletic pursuits; he also has a website; if I can track it down, I'll give you the link.  

I went for a long walk yesterday, all cross-country, full of hills and lumps and rocks and ruts and stiles and very squishy bits. My knee seems to have tolerated this quite well, so all is not lost.

25/07/2016 at 13:20
https://canute1.wordpress.com/

That is the website Columba has mentioned
25/07/2016 at 13:30
John
Your cycling is certainly keeping you fit for your running. A good park run. Julian Goater (ex international runner, now aged 63yrs) cycles many miles and finds he doesn't have to train at his running in order to put out a good time. His body holds a good history of what is needed for running.

TS
I expect the weather is not helping your energy issues! Still very humid here, but am starting to like it!

Mick
You now have most of your jobs under control. Fingers crossed that you don't have anymore diy to deal with for a good while yet. I have to say that my energy has dipped massively for the past 18 months.

Columba
All best with the X-ray and the possible steroid injection.


I ran 3.6 miles this morning, hot and sweaty but enjoyable too.


We had a great weekend singing with the best experience being on Sunday. A group of us travelling up to London Bridge on the train partook of champers and orange juice and crisps. That started the day well!

Singing in The Scoop was brilliant, the acoustics were fantastic as were the appreciative audience. I hope we sing there again. Both days I was standing out in the sunshine for a few hours, but apart from resulting tiredness when we got home, I feel fine. All good.
25/07/2016 at 14:02

Thanks, Ceal.  I do remember Julian Goater but only vaguely. So I did a quick bit of research. Obviously he was pretty awesome in his younger days and his Power of Ten profile has some fantastic achievements. But then there is a solitary recent entry: a very ordinary parkrun (23 mins+) from earlier this year. Odd, given his pedigree.

25/07/2016 at 14:21

I've just lost quite a long post (my own fault) and can't face repeating it at the speed I type so I'll save it for later and just wish everyone well and all the best for those coping with injuries.

25/07/2016 at 14:32
Graham
Oh that is so annoying isn't it!

John
That Parkrun time will have been done with no running at all. Most likely he will have ridden zillions of hilly bike miles earlier that week. I trained with Julian for a while with his triathletes. It was hard but rewarding and taught me that one doesn't necessarily die when one feels like one is going to!!! I have the honour of having my photo in his book on running. He suffers from Achilles problems if he trains!!


Talking about Julian, he has very recently had a shocking accident on his bike on the road. It was a wet road and going round a bend he managed to somehow or other come off his bike and landed badly on his hip. Luckily he was with 2 of his clients and they were obviously able to call the ambulance but even more importantly than that they were able to stop the traffic, coming around the blind bend, which would have killed him if it had been allowed to.

He has had an op and is now recuperating. He is and has been in a lot of pain. A lot of it coming from his hip flexor. Hopefully, in time, a full recovery will be made. He is far from being a happy bunny.
Edited: 25/07/2016 at 14:35
25/07/2016 at 15:11

Ceal: Oh my goodness: the perils of riding a bike especially on slippery roads; I shiver at the thought. I'm a much more 'conservative' rider since my mishap last year and it was a mere glancing blow compared to Julian's incident.

On the Achilles issue, I've got a theory that cycling doesn't just not hurt the Achilles but can actually help it - somehow the pedalling is a gentle stretch. Moreover, a few years ago I was plagued with this problem and one day visited a gym  and had a go on the rowing machine. It was as if I'd taken a miracle tablet!

Unfortunately I can't use a rower these days as I've got dodgy finger joints!

Graham: I do that sort of thing all the time too! Technology can drive us all nuts - even if it is 'operator error'.

25/07/2016 at 20:37

evening all

Columba
I would have expected a walk like that to aggravate the knee just as much as running on roads so maybe there is a small tear or suchlike in the meniscus or a bit of stuff floating around in the joint that needs cleaning out.
Hopefully the x ray will reveal all. I would b every cautious about cortisone injections - the relief is only temporary and they accelerate deterioration of the joint.

The wimps way on Hipps Hill is about 1/3 of the way up where I can veer off to the right and run on a lower slope to get home without having to go right up to the top!!

MIck
it may have been the heat but it didn't really feel like that - just general CBA which is unlike me!!  I had done 4 days of good running before my break travelling with no ill effects and I expected tocome back refreshed and ready - that's how much I know!!
Good list of chores done - you deserve the feet up and a cool one

John
longevity can also be due to  not having had serious injuries previously.
At times I can feel by old broken ankle and torn ligaments, torn knee ligaments and severe hamstring tear, all from other contact sports, almost as badly as if I had just done them!  Running injuries have all been of the type that stops one running rather than stops one moving

Ceal
These ladies on trains drinking in the early morning
Sounds like a very good time indeed .

Nasty fall by Julian - there were quite a few in the TdeF as well but at least there they only got run over by cyclists!!

Easy 3 miles this morning - bit cooler and with a breeze so conditions good but still felt listless. It may be the hay fever and the tablets taken to ward off the effects of the massive pollen levels just now but I would normally run through that

26/07/2016 at 08:17

TS - a very valid point you make about historic injuries - and puts those sustained when running into context. I watch a bit of rugby (mostly on TV but some live) and I wonder how any of them can emerge from a training session without major injuries let alone the sort of game-contact. I'm glad that neither of my sons played, to be honest.

Can you give the dimensions of Hipps Hill (length/gradient - even a profile)? I am intrigued. We've all got our strengths (and weaknesses, needless to say) and I rather fancy my running and cycling uphill .........yes, mainly because I am quite light. (I hate down hills though on both foot and bike.) So I wonder if HH is steeper than the ones around here? I'm guessing it is because it's in the north and everything in the north is 'harder' than everything in the soft south - the climate, the criminal fraternity, the runners (those fell-runners!) and the terrain. Whereas it's a well known fact that we southern types are softies who only venture out of our mansions if the ambient temperature is acceptable and our valets have correctly and expertly ironed our kit.............

(Was Alf Tupper the legendary boys' comics working class hero-athlete  from the north? I can't remember!)

So being a softie, today I shall get about as far as the billiard-table flatness and beautifully manicured lawns of my local park!

 

26/07/2016 at 11:49

good morning

John
it was fun at the time and when one is young and fit it doesn't seem a problem. it's only later that the long term effects manifest themselves.................

When I ran fairly well I used to love hills, now they are just there.
Of course my hills are bigger, badder and worse than anyone else's and I can take you to places where they really are. Hipps Hill is not in that category - its just that it bars my way home on most runs. It rises about 62m, - 200 ft in just under a mile.

Typical Garmin plot

http://s3.runnersworld.co.uk/members/images/126536/gallery/hipps_hill_2.jpg?width=216&height=393&mode=max

 my house is at the end of the green line!! There is actually a dip down after that first little rise that takes one almost back to the start of the climb before going back up but it is in a beautiful parkland setting so one can be distracted a bit

I remember running up the cliffs at Bournemouth and over the Iron Age fort ramparts at Hambledon Hill in Dorset to know that they exist elsewhere - even in the soft south

Alf Tupper (TTOTT) was indeed a northern lad - I emulate his passion for fish & chips

No run this morning but I will attempt the Hash from a local hostelry this evening which has a very large range of guest ales....................

26/07/2016 at 11:50

The hills in Wales are pretty tough too, John!

Thank you for the link to Canute, Ceal. You knew of him already?

Sorry to hear about Julian Goater. I have one of his books, - or I had, but can't see it now, may have passed it on to Middle Son.

Graham - how about typing long posts in Word first, and then just copying and pasting them into here? Not so easily lost, that way.

X-ray done, - I arrived early, and was in-and-out before my appointment was even due! - Have to wait a week before the results will be with my GP, apparently. It was the physio who suggested the steroid injection, and it didn't occur to me that there might be negative effects, so thank you TS and I will do some research. Years ago I had injections into the joints at the base of my thumbs, where they join the wrists; the injections had no noticeable effect (the joints had been paining me). What did apparently have a beneficial effect, some time later, was taking glucosamine with chondroitin, - all the more impressive since it was an effect I hadn't been expecting. Though as Ceal said once before, taking glucosamine coincided with taking up running, and it could be simply that the running improved my circulation generally, which improved the thumb/wrist joints.

26/07/2016 at 13:42

TS: thanks for the map! We both know that Alf T would have run up it whilst still eating his fish and chips ................and overtaken all the toffs in the process (who invariably seemed to enjoy significant head-starts over or hero).

Upon reflection I think that Alf was my major sporting hero; a great athlete with as many chips on his shoulder as were in with his fish!

Columba: indeed Wales is rather hilly. I started my running 'career' just south of Carmarthen on the Towy estuary. Absolutely fabulous to run along the coast road with the Gower in the distance. And while it was hardly the most hilly part of Wales it was certainly quite challenging. Indeed, so hilly that I only once managed to ride out of my village on my bike in the 4 years I was there: to get to the hospital to see my first son being born. Nostalgia time!

Managed a 25 minute (flat) run. Legs were very heavy; the aftermath of hill work on my bike. (One big issue around here is the aggression of the seagulls who seem to get more stroppy with each passing year; I now find myself plotting routes to avoid the buggers.)

 

26/07/2016 at 14:27
John
Stroppy sea gulls. One can do without their interference when running.

TS
I had the same problems with my further lack of energy when taking anti histamine tabs. Glad you recognise that in the soft south that we do indeed do have 'some' hills!!!

Luving the Alf T chat

Columba
I hesitated yesterday with the steroid warning, but pleased that TS has brought the subject to your attention. An X-ray may not show up any small tears, may need MRI for that. However, don't let me jump the gun, let's wait and see what the X-Ray says. But it may show some OA but that doesn't necessarily mean that it is that which is causing your knee problem there may be another factor involved as well. There are tests in the form of putting ones legs in different positions (by a physio or a Dr) to determine possible tears of cartilage etc. I didn't know Canute but I googled him!


No running today, lots of housework instead.


Here is a YouTube link to one of our songs which we sang on Sunday at the Scoop. I am standing on the right of the stage (on the ground), on the front row just behind a microphone. I am wearing dark sunglasses.

Will you still love me tomorrow (a Carol King song)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=DIaN5LQ4PGY
26/07/2016 at 14:29
Sorry you will have to copy and paste the web address.
26/07/2016 at 14:53

Ceal: saw the clip. Lovely, lovely song very well delivered and received.

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