Overdone it?

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15/09/2012 at 18:04

Hi YC - think its the week after your marathon with Nessie - 7th October.

Coach - another change to your plan - if i miss this 1:34 it won't be your plan - it will be my failure to stick to it - with being away last week and next week Friday night run just didn't fit in with family plans - so shelved the 6 mile easy and moved the 14 miler forward to today as wife has other plans for before I go tomorrow.

So 14 miles + 0.5 mile WD - splits as follows:-

8.25,8.50,8.54,8.31,8.42,9.02,8.31,(7 miles easy) 8.08,7.42,7.34 (3 miles steady) 7.18,7.15,7.16,7.13 (4 miles just inside MP).

Felt good - good stretch tonight and I'll go for a few good embarrassing stretching exercises in the airports to pass the time but will be harder during the flights. Sure I'll be fine - ready for next week - again next week Friday is not going to happen as full travel day so Monday, Wed, Sunday sessions required.

Cheers, Skinny

15/09/2012 at 18:33

These things happen Skinny...that America trip was always slightly dodgily placed, but it's your work so we can't complain, that's more important.

You got the medium quality 14 in, which was by far the main session of the week, and you got that in, and it was so comfortable for you, you added an extra mile to the steady to MP bit

I don't have my spreadsheet at home, but for Monday, think 8miles easy to make up for the run you'll be missing.

I'll have a look at the best bet for Wed and Sunday on Monday when I'm back to work...

Edited: 15/09/2012 at 18:34
15/09/2012 at 18:47
Haha - mile 8 was supposed to be around 8.15 to 8.20 pace to move towards the steady pace but I went a bit too fast so it sneaked into the steady zone!

Not sure work is more important than hitting 1.34 but family is so need to ensure they get enough time with me.

8 miles Monday it is - cheers!
17/09/2012 at 09:47

Right, skinny, this will be an odd week due to your work commitments/travel, therefore, only the 3 sessions you asked for, but the quality is tough, and will be your last running at above Half marathon pace before your big race. After Wednesday it'll be HMP and slower.


Monday            8miles easy
Wednesday      4.5mile progressive warm up,(2miles easy, 1mile steady, 1mile MP), strides (5x75metres), then 5x1mile at 10k pace (6.45-6.48), with 90second recovery in between each, cd 1mile.  (totals about 11miles)

Sunday    15miles easy (don't even dream of pushing pace!)

If you can manage to fit in a light very slow 3miler on Thursday that'd help too...

I was torn on giving the full session, or 4 reps on Wednesday....so let's leave the full 5 in, but if you feel smashed after 4, feel free to stop then!


Edited: 17/09/2012 at 09:52
17/09/2012 at 12:37
Hi coach - 5.30am here and still pitch black - as don't really know where I am going waiting for it to get light. Just to prove 1.34 more important than work just sent an email to my boss telling her that she can't pick me up at 7am as got to go for a run first!

On Wednesday run do I do strides periodically while doing 4.5 mile warm up or all at once at end with a rest in between each one?

Cheers, Skinny
17/09/2012 at 13:40

The strides are after the MP mile, so you get your 4miles in, then the strides.

Normally when i do such a warm up, i'd have a stop to focus after the strides are done, before starting the hard section.

17/09/2012 at 14:33

8 mile easy done - 69 mins.

Did it round a 0.6 mile loop round some waterfall gardens - not exactly seeing the world but its done and no traffic or roads to cross which was nice.

As will almost certainly be pitch black when I start the Wednesday run will probably use same route (so about 18 times round!) - based on my boss's mail wanting to pick me up at 7am I don't trust that she'll let me out at 4pm one afternoon to go running.

Wednesday looks like a real challenge - I like challenges!

Let you know how I get on Wednesday.

Cheers, Skinny

17/09/2012 at 14:36

loops can be tough, but can be quite useful for knowing the lay out.

At least you're only doing 1mile reps, so less than 1 1/2loops per rep.

I often do a 6.5miles at MP session round a 0.9mile loop!

Make sure you're safe if it's going to be dark in an unfamiliar place!

19/09/2012 at 14:26

Done it! TOUGH!! I need to write down some of the pain I have just been through.

Firstly it was too dark to see Garmin so rather than do 5 x 1mile reps I made it 4 x 1.2 and started and finished under a lamp - I do have a light on my Garmin but you can't be pushing that on and off all the time (it also gave me a halfway point time). I also gave myself an extra 10 secs recovery so 100secs as slightly longer effort.

It was without doubt the hardest training session I have ever done. The loop was down the waterfall for first 0.3 miles then uphill for second 0.3 so last 0.3 of my 1.2 miles were uphill every time - these were done to an in my head chant of 'Ste - vie G, I hate you' until about last 0.1 mile where it just became, 'No, No, No'.

When I had done first one I was certain I could not do any more and I felt the same after the second and third ones. After the fourth one I just punched the air and colapsed on the ground prompting another jogger to enquire if I was alright - I wasn't quite sure what answer to give him so I grunted which seemed to satisfy him.

Anyhow full session below - the amended target times for the 1.2 mile instead of 1 mile session would become 8:06 - 8:10 (not allowing for any slowing down as slightly longer).

9.02, 8.37 (2 miles easy) 7.49 (1 mile steady) 7.21 (1 mile MP) 7.54 (1 mile easy containing 5 strides) 8.05, 8.20, 8.10, 8.17 (4.8 miles of total hell with 100 sec recoveries), 11.17 (1.2 miles warm down).

Total 11 miles.

Thank you coach - that was a harder session than I would ever have done on my own - I am presuming I will get a lot of benefit from it in a couple of weeks.

19/09/2012 at 19:10
I should add for clarity that the waterfall was like a stream running downhill with the odd small waterfall - I was not running up and down a cliff!

Although towards the end it felt like it!!
20/09/2012 at 10:49

Nice on Skinny, although you made my brain seize up after driving 360miles yesterday and just waking up today, trying to work out what the pace should have been for the 1.2mile reps ( there's a reason we use 1miles for the ease of calculations )

Sounds like you made a good re-adjustment in the circumstances, being abroad, being dark, and a loop with ups. So good work.

Being able to lay down the equivalent of your 10k pace (our NEW 10k pace) will hold you in good stead, not only as a hard workout now, but for when we come back to beat your 10k time in future.

However, you can give yourself a pat on the back now, as that's the fastest work you'll do before the big race day.

If you can get a nice little 3miler in today, as slow as you can muster that'll help get rid of the stiffness in your legs, and tide you over for the weekend long run.

PS no need for longer recoveries next time due to being longer reps, as the total mileage was still the same as the planned 5x1mile session (slightly shorter even). ie if you were doing 10x400, or 5x800s, you wouldn't get longer recoveries necessarily on the 800s just because double the distance, as the reps are reduced.

But i'll let you off, as you made such a stirling effort to get this session in whilst away!

Edited: 20/09/2012 at 10:52
20/09/2012 at 13:51

3 miles 27 mins - that's me done running in Denver.

You've come to wrong place if you're looking for sympathy on the travel miles and just waking up!

22 hour door to door journey to get here on Sunday; total of 18 hours sleep in 4 nights while here (combination of 7 hour time adjustment and altitude); off to work in an hour and then at end of my day at work today get picked up to start my 22 hour journey home arriving Friday night at around 8pm. Based on past experience I will get max of 2 hours sleep on plane.

So 6 days, 5 nights away - total travel 44 hours, total sleep 20 hours!

Looking forward to my own bed and a good couple of nights sleep before my 15 miles on Sunday which should be a breeze in comparison to this week.

PS Your 360 mile journey led me to do a bit of hotel lurking on your thread - at least they won and congrats on the 5 mile PB - I must be inspiring you!!

Will report back Monday - cheers, Skinny

20/09/2012 at 13:56

Haha ta Skinny, my car took a mileage battering this week.

Pleasure never comes without pain, and today, the dentist has had a right go at my mouth...

enjoy the easy end to your week now.

21/09/2012 at 01:52
Hi coach, bored at airport so just reading my own thread again - what a saddo I am!

You know what you said about the recoveries being same for 4x1.2m and 5x1m because that would be like 10x400 or 5x800. Well I've been thinking about this because session nearly killed me as it was!

Surely 5x800 would be run at a slower pace than 10x400 so hence same recovery.
Whereas I tried to run 4x1.2 in same pace as 5x1m therefore a slightly longer recovery time? The fact I failed to run the required pace is beside the point! (I would add a winky smiley here but can't do it on my BB!)

Cheers, Skinny
21/09/2012 at 21:31

It's a good question Skinny.

But the logics is as follows.

When I set you 400s and 800s, I'll designate it at a pace, say at 5k pace, or 10k pace.

If the session was "run the rep as fast as you can", then of course, you wouldn't be able to keep the same pace for the longer distance. Or if you could, you'd need longer recoveries.

However, as we're using your personal pacing zones, and we're looking to work you at a controlled but hard level, we keep the overall mileage similar, but the rep length and repeats will vary. Thus 10x400, and 5x800 being the same overall distance. Similarly you converted the 5x1mile, into 4x1.2miles which was fine, but no need to increase the recoveries as you're doing the same total mileage as the 5x1mile (ish...200metres less )

It challenges you to keep the pace for a longer distance, as come race day, you need to keep that pace for the whole distance.

It also keeps things interesting, as you have loads of different distances, and a few different pace zones. If I set you the same session every week your motivation would naturally drop.

That 10k session is quite a hard session, I find it so, and you're quite new into structured hard running.

Also, that 10k pb has given you new pace zones to live up to, and we pitched your target zone high.

It's something I'll monitor with each passing week.

But the good news is that compared to that, half marathon pace will feel a right old doss

Edited: 21/09/2012 at 21:36
23/09/2012 at 17:50
15miles done in 2 hours 10 mins - Garmin battery packed up almost straight in to run (thought I had left it charging overnight but obviously not) so spent most of run worrying I was going too fast - delighted to see I wasn't when got back - had to check distance in old fashioned way after finishing by driving route!

Anyway that week is done - 2 hard training sessions and two weeks to go - fingers crossed for 2 weeks more injury and illness free.

Had 26 hours sleep in 2 days since I got back!!

Thanks for detailed recovery explanation above - would like to try that session again after the race but over a flatter mile not at altitude and on a proper night's sleep.

Cheers, Skinny
23/09/2012 at 18:28

Good work on the longest long run. It should give you the confidence to know you're strong in the final stages of the target half marathon.

Are you able to do 5 runs this week? To the below framework?

  1. Mon                   5miles very easy
  2. Wed                   Total 10-11miles, details TBC
  3. Thur                  3miles very slow recovery run
  4. Fri                     6miles easy
  5. Sun                   14miles quality long run, 7.5miles easy to steady, 3m MP, 3m HMP (1/2mile cool down)

Total 38-39miles, quality is a little on the high side for your mileage, but this is a one off, last big week before an ease down last week of tapering.

I'll devise the Wednesday run tomorrow on checking the overall plan. Sunday I've had in mind for a while. Is a session that definitely helped me to pb the week after when I built up aggressively for a half.

The 3miles Thursday is super slow...just eases your legs out after a probably hard Wed session.

Edited: 23/09/2012 at 18:29
23/09/2012 at 19:47
Okay Coach - 5 runs it is - that Sunday run sounds longer than I would have expected week before race but I've trusted you this far so no going back now!

Cheers, Skinny
23/09/2012 at 20:01

Don't worry, when you smash that it's a perfect confidence booster for the next week.

Then in the final week it's 3 runs, 2 easy, and 1 very light speedwork session, something like 3x1mile at HMP off 90secs recovery. Just to tide you over.

However, as always I'll monitor off your feedback as the week progresses.

Edited: 23/09/2012 at 20:03
24/09/2012 at 16:28
Stevie G . wrote (see)
  1. Mon                   5miles very easy
  2. Wed                  3miles WU, 6miles MP, 1/2m cd
  3. Thur                  3miles very slow recovery run
  4. Sat                  14miles quality long run, 7.5miles easy to steady, 3m MP, 3m HMP (1/2mile cool down)
  5. Sun                  3mile recovery run

 Right, I've wrestled with myself about the session to give you Wednesday.

In an ideal world it would have been a quality sesson involving HMP repeats, but I've decided that it's too much to suddenly throw 2 hard sessions into 1 week, especially when you're so close to a race day.

I hope you're able to do the sunday session on the saturday instead as a one off? That'd give you a key extra day recovery, the Friday run would disappear, and instead Sunday would be a  3mile recovery.

Another benefit is that you're not running 3 days in a row, and you have a nice structure of the 2 main runs of the week with a slow recovery run the next day.

Next week would then have some light HMP reps on the Tuesday, and a couple of other low effort runs to tide you over until race day.


Edited: 24/09/2012 at 16:34
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