Shades Marathon Training

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18/03/2013 at 10:31

I've been having a niggle in my knee, but due to work and study commitments, I've taken time off running to allow it to get better. I had the same thing last year but it just went after a while however that was running shorter distances.

Anyway, the last long run I did was the first 20 miler and then I did the 5 recover afterwards before taking a break. I won't be able to start again until later this week though and this weekend coming should be the second 20 miler.

Considering the break, Brighton being in four weeks (minus one day) and the fact that I don't want the problem to come back with my knee, what's the best way to tackle the last four weeks without impacting Brighton to much?

18/03/2013 at 11:18

Well done Molly .

And a big well done to all our home racers too . It's all getting very exciting!

Hope all those with niggles recover soon. I know how frustrating it is. Sleaver - don't jump back straight into your 20 miles will you. Shades will be able to advise on what to do.

VR - my marathon pw is 7:43! I've already vowed not to do that one again

Had a good time at Great Barrow-in-the-mud yesterday . Finished in 5:17 - pleased with that. 10 mins slower than almost same route last Sept, but the going was tougher this time because of the mud, and also I'm definitely not as fit. Made me smile that after avoiding the puddles on the road out from the start, within a mile we were ploughing our way through the mud. The stream bed, which was dry last time, had filled up with stream (and mud) and necessitated wading through with shoes and socks completely submerged . Terrain improved (mostly) after that until about 2 miles from home when the grass track was under water and our feet got wet all over again (colder this time too). Didn't have much recollection of the route at the start, but recognised bits on the way and it all came back. Ran with a 'pack' (usual suspects) so navigation was fine and as I was prepared for the hill in the final quarter mile I managed to run up it. Very lucky with the weather - despite the forecast it didn't rain until I was driving home . Had an hour sleep when I got back, but still went to bed early and then slept for 12 hours . Now have to scrape the mud off my shoes - yuk!

My typing seems to have shrunk (!?!) - so apologies if you need a magnifying glass to read this.

18/03/2013 at 11:19

Oh - small font when I typed, but ok on the post

18/03/2013 at 11:20

well done mowzer! mud run sounds fun! I can't believe you missed all that rain!

18/03/2013 at 13:11

Emmy - god luck with the new club.   Are you in a running club now?

bootsie - how did you sort out that injury last time?  Will your doctor refer you to NHS physio or podiatrist?

Molly - well done. you did a great time and even splits is amazing.

Sleaver - I think you need to be careful and only do one more long run before your marathon and drop it to 16 to 18 miles and only do it when you are pain free.   Are you happy that your shoes are providing enough support and cushioning for your marathon training?

mowzer - we've been using this small font for a while now...whilst you've been AWOL...LOL

Fancy sleeping for 12 hours!!!!!!!!

18/03/2013 at 13:15

Hi Shades,

This is a 'new' club... my first prospective club. The first one didnt work out (i didnt like their elitest attitude) so i'm hoping this one is better. Let's see!

Mowser - Yep - we all have little font at the moment. well done on the race. I saw some pics yesterday night from the race and it looked like a complete mud fest! A friend of mine ran it with her husky and it looked so happy!

18/03/2013 at 13:31

shades.. I think sports massage and physio.. i really need to start keeping a log of how these things get resolved!

I think biggest problem for me is with Raynauds I dont get great circulation to feet so takes longer to heal

18/03/2013 at 13:47
marathon molly wrote (see)

lactic acid rules ok! Yesterday I was fine, I trotted round and "steady pace" was my mantra. My 5k splits were exact from start to finish so I'm well pleased. I finished in 4.14 - last 300mts upped a gear and overtook about 20 people  and I felt wonderful. Today I'm walking like a 90 year old  no aches, I'm just stiff, VERY stiff!

You are a legend! 

18/03/2013 at 14:25

Hi all! Brilliant running from everyone..

Slowkoala - you REALLY need to change your name, that is an awesome time.. well done!

Rattler and Khani - fab results for Reading too - great PB Khani

Big_G and Sofaboy - well done on your long runs (in awful conditions by the sound of it.. see if Khani has any room in his suitcase perhaps..? )

Molly - well done on your marathon - even!!

Bootsie - good to hear your news.. sports massage sounds like a good idea (especially if it made a difference last time)

Emmy - If you are out with a club I take it that you can run again! Hope your session goes well.

Mowzer - mud run sounds fun! Made me laugh to hear about everyone avoiding puddles at the start! Bit like when you see people jostling to get car parking space as close as possible to the gym then going in and going beserk on a treadmill!

Am also now typing with nose glued to screen due to this small type!

18/03/2013 at 14:27
SHADES wrote (see)

Sleaver - I think you need to be careful and only do one more long run before your marathon and drop it to 16 to 18 miles and only do it when you are pain free.   Are you happy that your shoes are providing enough support and cushioning for your marathon training?

Hi Shades

The last time this happened was around the last time I brought new shoes but that is a whole story in it's self. Back then I was running shorter distances so I'm wondering if it's more pronounced now. I recently brough a new pair of shoes but I haven't worn them yet as they were only delivered after my last run. As per previous advice, I brought the same make, model and version so hopefully that will help.

So would I be right in saying that if I'm pain free, drop the 20 miles this coming weekend to 16/18 miles and make that the last long run? If so, would I still do the long runs during the taper period (14 and 10) or should I change those as well?

I've done two 18's and one 21 so I know I can get to within 5 miles of the finish. I know I haven't got a choice, but should that be enough come the day considering the last long long run would have been six weeks previous?

18/03/2013 at 14:37
All those on the injury bench should take inspiration from Paula Radcliffe's autobio. I picked it up in a 2nd hand shop and read it over the weekend. The number of painful injuries and equally painful treatments that woman has endured is huge. It's amazing she has ever completed a marathon yet alone got a WR!!

Mamafox, how is your injury?

Marathon Molly, BIG congrats on Rome. Even splits plus no aches? I think the Pope must have blessed you!

Mowzer, well done too, I don't think I will ever attempt a marathon in the mud.

Shades, I'm not that OCD to complain about the 10 second discrepancy in times, although I would have if they had recorded it as 2:35! There were no chips so the times were recorded manually by a guy with a notepad who stood after the finishing line. Didn't help that I didn't walk for about 10 secs after passing the line
18/03/2013 at 17:42

Slowkoala - slow you most definitely are not!! I did the Finchley 20 as well yesterday and finished in 3.27, which according to Shades' pacing is probably too fast!! It is literally round the corner from me, so you can imagine my excitement when looking for a 20 mile race that there was one so close on the weekend when I needed to do one. Shame the weather was so bloody awful! Slightly demoralised when I realised at the end of the first lap that the men who lapped me were going to have finished before I had finished 2 laps. Very very quick at the front.

My splits were:


10'36"/mi 10'24"/mi 10'26"/mi 10'22"/mi 10'23"/mi 10'27"/mi 10'47"/mi 10'30"/mi 10'32"/mi 10'23"/mi 10'14"/mi 10'23"/mi 10'23"/mi 10'32"/mi 10'06"/mi 10'10"/mi 10'15"/mi 10'13"/mi 10'06"/mi   Still had lots left in my legs at the end, at least until I stopped when I felt awful! For some reason my lower back was hurting from mid-way through the race, a niggle I've never had before. Hoping it was just a one-off, its fine today. I am knackered today. Can't imagine how painful I'm going to feel after doing a full marathon.    marathonmolly - wow - fantastic time, well done!    mowzer - mud running must be hard (i'm guessing you have some trail shoes though?). I can only dream of having 12 hours sleep. Last night I got 4.5...   Khanivore/Rattler - would you recommend Reading half, or did you think it was too busy. I would like to do another half (once I've got the marathon out the way) and try and get below 2hrs. Great times!    Big_G - running on any snow is hard though, so its going to feel harder than normal. Hope you are less achy today  
18/03/2013 at 18:20
Louey, well done on the Finchley 20, looks like you had plenty of energy left at the end. I sometimes get a sore lower back at the end of long runs and I think for me this is to do with my core giving in a bit as I get tired. When I do Pilates regularly, I don't seem to get the pain ever as my core is then stringer but I am finding it hard to go the the Pilates class regularly this year. Are you in a local club at all?
18/03/2013 at 20:00
Some great running going on ..... Nice work shadies.

I did a recovery run in the gym today, after Reading HM in the rain I've gone a bit rusty so decided the gym made sense as it continues to chuck it down.

My calves are feeling it though. But the compression socks do seem to help. I'm going to get a sports massage this week too I think.
18/03/2013 at 21:27

Hi Shades, you were kind enough to send me a copy of your training plan quite a while back, but I've only just got around to signing up for my first marathon. Trouble is, I may have been a little stupid and entered a pretty unsuitable one for a first timer: The Purbeck Marathon.

I do prefer running off road though, am quite happy training on hills and have done a half over similar terrain. Anyway, enough of justifying myself, I have a query about the training plan. I plan to do most of my training off road, including plenty of hills, and was also planning on doing the optional extra runs but am not sure if I should do the fartlek runs or not. Do you think these should be replaced with hill repeats or maybe alternate between the two? I feel I ought to do some faster running as I do tend to be a bit of a plodder otherwise, although this may be good when it comes to a marathon.

I'd be really grateful to hear what you (and any other marathoners on here) think, and if there are any other changes you might make to the plan to take account of the kind of marathon I've entered.

18/03/2013 at 22:25

My post seemed to go all awry - not sure what happened there!

Slow - I did wonder whether it might be my core causing the problem. 3 kids and my tummy muscles are pretty weak. I had planned on trying to start doing some core work after the marathon - just haven't got a lot of time at the moment. 

I'm not sure whether you mean running club or pilates club! But I'm not in either. Given that I literally live round the corner from Hillingdon AC its a bit rubbish but their training runs are 6 or 7pm and I need the kids to be in bed and my husband to be home to get out of the house. That doesn't happen before 7.30pm. Maybe when they're older. 

Hi Matt - I'm sure someone will be along who can answer you soon - I'm very much a novice!

19/03/2013 at 07:23

Sleaver - yes I do mean to replace the next 20 miler with a shorter long run, you know you have to be careful.   For the 14 and 10 miler, if you are pain free run them, but keeping to LSR pace

Slowkoala - yes, I agree about Paula's book, she's one tough cookie.  

Louey - well done at Finchly, and that's good pacing.   I'm not going to tell you off for running too fast as it was a race after all.

An ache in the lower back is common, usually caused by holding the upper body in a tense position for a long time, such as on long runs.   A little gentle stretching before the start and try to remember to relax your shoulders during the run should help

MattDA - it's up to you if you want to do the fartlek.   I think fartlek is better off road as the nature of the course usually dictates the speed of run in a more natural way.  But the optional runs can be of your choice.

Must go and look up Purbeck Marathon

Frosty this morning but going to be another nice day

19/03/2013 at 07:33

Fecking snowing here.... Not overly heavily but still. Bring on the warmer weather. Better still bring on the sky repair man so i can go back to bed Two days off and i have to be up as early as usual for both as car going for MOT tomorrow morning.

19/03/2013 at 07:54

Brilliant running Molly! well done!
I'm thinking of 'sticking' to a plan!

19/03/2013 at 08:00


Slowkoala - thank you for encouraging comments re Paula Radcliffe.. could use a bit of inspiration at the moment! Tried to run 10K yesterday but had to stop at 7k and hobble back - Not looking good AT ALL for marathon end of April

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