The Middle Ground

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05/11/2012 at 20:29

Hilly, I used to record weather on runs, but then I realised I never actually did any analysis that made it useful. I was considering keeping a daily weight/ hours of sleep/work weather diary this year. I think those are the things (outside of sessions of course) that affect races and workouts the most.

I think my longest journey for a race was this summer's 1500 smackdown with Phil. Because of traffic it took me two hours to get there.

Duck, had a v. brief skim and it seems like you're in fine shape at the moment. Good stuff.

On the training front, nothing's going well for me. I am either suffering from niggles or illness. Just had a really nasty bout of flu which has seen my shoes hung up for a week. Really hoping I can start proper base training this Sunday.

05/11/2012 at 21:16
Evening all,

I've done a couple of 2+ hrs drives to races, but typically that's been for a half marathon or longer.

Chichester, Gosport and Eastleigh would be a decent trek for me as well, but luckily my in laws live in Chichester, so it's an easy way to get the family to spend some time with them, while I get to go out and race

Curly - good luck with the change in direction. Well done for taking the plunge and making something happen!
05/11/2012 at 21:37

Simon - I record the temperature when I believe it has affected a run so I can see why my pace or HR looks unusual when I read my diary back.

All I am doing is trying to improve my flexibility and patientily waiting for 23rd of November  

05/11/2012 at 21:44

Blimey Simon, thought I was sickly this year.  Vibes and virtual grapes your way...  As it happens, our 1,500m smack-down was the fourth most local - just under 2 miles - race of my running career. The others are an Assembly League race 0.5 miles away, a 10k in Greenwich Park, 0.9 miles away... and my local marathon - ''blue start'' 600 metres from my front door - which is a very popular race indeed. 

Simon Edward wrote (see)

I was considering keeping a daily weight/ hours of sleep/work weather diary this year.

I wouldn't be very good at that.  I've weighed myself about three times all year.  Back in my school days, I used to keep paper training diaries for my cycling, and used to have great fun drawing bar charts of weekly mileage / training hours.  Proper little geek. 

05/11/2012 at 22:56
I have travelled to London from Newcastle for a 10K and up to Inverness for a marathon. Lots of other places all over the country. I see them as a weekend away with a race at the end.

Can't quote on ipad.

Stevie - don't forget about me. I have 101 parkruns under my belt. Ok, I'm not a tourist and 98(?) of those have been in Newcastle. I currently have 2000+ miles on one pair of my trainers and 1000+ on the other. No plans to replace them but can't wear the 2000 ones when it is wet as I've worn a hole into the toe. Saved me a fortune

Alehouse - great news. 200m is 200m, long may it continue.

Tom - wonderful progress.

Duck - your development has been amazing, it is great to read.

Josh - flipping heck, what an ordeal. Hope you are recovering well.

BR - I really feel for you. Hope you can sort it out. I'm still way off form, I can't seem to speed up at all, there is nothing there. My 5K is still 30s/mi off my best and 10K probably closer to a minute. I was shaking my head earlier in amusement as there is a 5M (even rarer than 10M around here) race that I want to do in a few weeks and the last time I did it was in 2009. Realistically speaking, I still probably can't even pb on such a soft time as 35.17. I did a 6m session avg 7.30 last week and it hurt. Ho hum.

Phil - I'm too scared to weigh myself this year, ha. I got down to 8st exactly this time last year with extremely diligent calorie counting and was in the racing shape of my life. I'd be too depressed to find out how much I weigh now. I used to track weather, etc as it was easy enough to click on the field when logging in Fetch, but haven't been bothered with the extra details in a long while. Still obsessive about my running data though!

Curly - good luck with the change in direction.

Glad I did my run this morning, so much smoke around tonight. I took the kids to a firework display and it was such fun. I last attempted with Jack a few years ago and he freaked out so badly. I was a bit worried as he either loves something or hates it but thankfully he decided he LOVED it tonight. He had everyone completely amused with "WOW, I love it" after every single firework. A kid in a wheelchair is great for getting to the front too
06/11/2012 at 00:58

Stevie G - that would have been a sight to see with all those drinks! Talking Portsmouth one last time, have you ever considered doing the 5k series races which are held monthly in Hilsea between May and August? It's a very fast course and always has a good field! 


Hilly - It's the 2nd time I have raced Lordshill and both times it has been a washout! Combining a park run/race with seeing new places is also something that has great appeal to me! I just wish I could do it more than I intend to! I may have done a park run in Weymouth the other week whilst away for a long weekend there but the closest park run to there is Poole - I thought it was a bit too far to go for this with already being away for just a long weekend...and Weymouth has some great scenery to enjoy so it was great getting out for a couple of runs there for this reason alone. It's obvious to state this, but for me it really is a good way to start the weekend in many ways and it gets me up (I used to have very long lie ins years ago!). It certainly was the case with there being a good start to the weekend on Saturday just gone even though I wasn't running and supporting my partner with her park run effort! 


PRF - I have had the experience of running the Saunders Lakeland Mountain Marathon a few years ago in the Lake District and found the weather very punishing.  The Saturday was just a normal sunny July day but the Sunday was in complete contrast with howling gales and driving rain! Being on the sides of some of those mountains with loose scree beneth foot was certainly an experience I will never forget, nor that of my faster than expected running partner in the race! Hopefully we will do that up there again one day...  


The issue of monitoring weight in particular is something I have been obsessed with this year too so can relate to a lot of you on here with this! I think I have had this discussion briefly with you before PhilPub actually on another thread a while back...being 5 foot 9 and currently weighing between 79 and 80 kilos, there is definately room for cutting down a bit...a huge weakness for me is food and over indulgance in things I really shouldn't be eating so much of having been 15 and a half stone about 4 years ago and up again to 14 and a half stone by the beginning of this year. However, I feel that I have been too hung up at times on monitoring my weight over the course of the year though. As discussed previously, I need to start thinking of the other variables and factors which help to assess performance such as heart rate. I have only noted the weather conditions this year if it has been very hot, windy, cold, etc! 


After hockey training tonight and a match yesterday after Lordshill, I think this week will consist of easy paced running as previously advised by Barnsley Runner (hope your form comes back as others have said!). I will be in Winchester tomorrow night and am avoiding my club monthly 5k time trail so will be aiming to do a easy paced 8-8:30 m/m paced hillyish workout instead.


As a final point, I have started reading this thread from the start and I hope you don't mind me saying Curly as feel like I have turned up at a party uninvited but I am finding reading through it very useful and informative! 

Edited: 06/11/2012 at 01:01
06/11/2012 at 06:16

Kaysdee, consider yourself added to the park run loving club! 100+ is huge, a minimum of 2 years service!!

WJH, i did hear about the Prom 5k series. Might be worth a look if I've still not managed to find anything flat and more sensible before then. 

But risking BR's wrath, I wonder if a 90min drive for a 5k is sensible, or just plain mentalism! Especially midweek

06/11/2012 at 06:40
Morning all,

First early morning run with the head-torch for me this morning, and I did a very relaxed 60minutes with the dog. Average heart rate was 130bpm, average temperature was 0 Celsius, enjoyment level was high

I'm hoping that this type of run can become a habit over the winter months, and will form a staple part of my base miles.

Now it's time for caffeine
06/11/2012 at 06:47

well done YP, early morning runs in the week are one of those things i only rarely do. Finished by 6.40 is top work!

I'm off for a rare morning 4 now, as it's one of those rare days a lunch and evening combo can't be fitted in.

06/11/2012 at 09:44

WJH I am hopnig to collate the thread into a nice easy read summary over the next few weeks

Hilly/BR Philosophy of metaphor will likely be the focus of my thesis but I am probably going to look at a few other areas of understanding and language as well.

06/11/2012 at 10:30

YP - Nice early run there, but the HR is meaningless unless we know the dog's max. 

Er... "Language is the house of being." - Martin Heidegger.  Did my nut in, trying to understand Heidegger.  I vaguely remember Wittgenstein as well, saying something about not being able to understand lions if they could speak.  We should talk about this over a coffee some time Curly

I'm sticking to one-a-day sessions this week as part of tapering for Sunday's duathlon, so no gym session today, and I'm planning on doing half of the B group's 10 x 800m session this evening, definitely not flat-out.

06/11/2012 at 11:00
Barnsley Runner wrote (see)
Dr.Dan - I reckon Leeds is work perhaps 25 secs at this time of year with that mud section.  Take the lad to Hull.  Broaden his mind as well as improve your times

MrsDan and the kids had a day out in Hull over half-term while I was at work ... and they really enjoyed it. Not very useful for our 5K PBs though.

Get well soon Simon!

Keep the faith Kelly ... it takes a while to rebuild. Oh, and I haven't been brave enough to step on the scales for a while either ... but I have eaten lots.

Vague plans for next year are taking shape. Main problem this year has been getting in the mileage ... I have consistently failed to be consistently consistent. Main 2013 initial  target race is going to be the Leeds HM in May. It's not a fast one, due to a couple of long climbs in the first half, but I'd really like to nail a good time there ... never been race fit at that one. So, after the Abbey Dash recovery, I'm going to try to get into a good basic routine ... thinking of run-commuting to work on Mon, Wed and Thurs to get some time-efficient mileage in my legs ... coupled with lunchtime sub-LT sessions on Tues & Fri ... and LSR on Sunday. A couple of months of just being consistently consistent will get me up to Brass Monkey HM, which I'll race straight from base. Afterwards, I'll start to put in some faster sessions again during the 5 week build up for Snake Lane 10M and further 4 weeks to Bradford 10K ... hopefully I'll be able to do something fast by then ... which leaves me a 7 weeks of HM training for Leeds.

Edited: 06/11/2012 at 11:02
06/11/2012 at 11:38

Must be a morning for getting the gentle miles in.  40 mins for me this morning.  Still a little weak in the legs after Sunday but a double will sort that out!  Tonight's sprint session is 1x550, 1x450, 1x350, 1x250, 3x150, or the MD session is 400s.  Sprint tonight, I think.

Curly45 wrote (see)

Philosophy of metaphor will likely be the focus of my thesis but I am probably going to look at a few other areas of understanding and language as well.

You had me at "Phil", and my next thought was "Pub".  Language for me is yet another one of those subjects I'm incredibly interested in and know absolutely nothing about.  So when is this thread summary coming together?

I have noticed that my planning for the spring marathon is looking suspiciously like P&D, based on my output from last season, but with Reverse Periodisation thrown in more violently.  I am watching that P&D thread with interest!  By the way, if anyone wants to see my planning, it's written in chalk on the silver lining of a thunderstorm.

Stevie, 90 mins midweek drive for a 5k is mentalism.

06/11/2012 at 12:24

Ratzer The thread summary is awaiting Simon to put the search back up (which he is working on as we speak I believe). then I need to finish a few formatting bits and turn it into an ebook by making sure the XML set-up is correct. Then I should be able to put it on a self publishing place for you all to download.

Phil if you want to understand ignore Heideggar and check out Ricceur and then Lakoff and Johnson. Gadamer is also very good, although he really only wrote one good book.



06/11/2012 at 12:33

WJH, good luck reading the entire thread from the start. The problem is you end up reading debates you really want to get involved with, but obviously can't.

SG, I wouldn't think twice about it. The Wednesday night league we have meant I was often driving 60-90 minutes through rush hour traffic for an 800 or 1500. Then you get a PB and a McDonald's onthe way home. Great night out.

Sounds like a good plan, Dr D. What are you going to do on Saturdays? I never like taking a rest day at weekends because there is more opportunity to recovery properly from sessions when not working.

Curly, I did plan to get that finished at the weekend, but the illness took over a bit. But I am on the case now,.

I felt a little better this morning. Doubt I'll be fit to run until the weekend though. My legs feel really really really good though.

06/11/2012 at 12:40

Nosemi - the Kinvara is a great shoe isn't it? 

Dan, yeah i got pushed more towards physical but biogeography killed all the enthusiasm off. The good news is there's a ton of scope in either area, way more than I initially thought.

prf - welcome back stranger. Get that flab moving! 

Simon, hope it picks up for you soon. 

WJH, how far through are you so far?

Curly45 wrote (see)

Philosophy of metaphor 


Dan, sounds like a good plan. Just being consistent will help a ton. The sub-lt stuff worked wonders for you before so getting back into it will get you into shape I am sure.

Down to the boulevard today - 6*1k (1 every 5 minutes). Ran 3'40, 3'38, 3'32, 3'31, 3'27, 3'22. Good, strong session, never felt like I was going beyond my limits. 

06/11/2012 at 12:40

I wasnt hassling Hope you are feeling better!

06/11/2012 at 12:47

Simon - Good news on the legs at least! Saturdays involve a riddiculous to-and-fro of transporting my 4 kids to various activities. In between MrsDan and I somehow manage to food shop, hoover, clean the bathroom, etc. So, in short, not a good running day!

xpost - Duck ... great session! Might try that one (but slower, obviously).

Edited: 06/11/2012 at 12:50
06/11/2012 at 17:40

Gosh don't you people work in the day...

Stevie - I don't think I'd drive 90 mins mid-week for a 5k unless I had got the afternoon off work or full day as teatime traffic etc after a full day at work would make me so tired it wouldn't be worth doing the 5k!

Simon said - Hilly, I used to record weather on runs, but then I realised I never actually did any analysis that made it useful. I was considering keeping a daily weight/ hours of sleep/work weather diary this year. I think those are the things (outside of sessions of course) that affect races and workouts the most.

I used to find recording the weather was useful to understanding why I might have recorded the run feeling difficult.  Also in heat HR was affected on long runs especially and when cold I took longer to warm up for reps.  All obvious things I know but it was useful to look back on as another variable of why I felt a certain way on a run. 

WJH - yes Weymouth does have some lovely scenery and places to run.  I used to love my winter runs from where I lived along the seafront, especially when the sea was wild  Didn't think the same when doing the Weymouth 10 along the front though in conditions that was one step forward, two or more steps back

Curly - sounds really interesting!  I nearly did a course on metaphorical language...  Would you look to still stay in the same line of work or hope for it to lead you somewhere else?

Going to venture to the prospective new club tonight to do their 2 miles time trial.  Weather a bit yuk, but going to a club does help to motivate one out of the door!


06/11/2012 at 17:45

Simon, the dreaded Maccy D's?! I'm shocked, talk about undoing the good work

Hilly, agree. In my more obsessive days, I used to take half days off work to prepare for evening 5ks! And they were all reasonably local!

Duck, nice 1ks, do you mean each km and recovery were done in 5mins, or did you have 5mins between reps? Presumably the former?

Sounds like you're gearing up for a comeback at the real distances, none of this over in under 10mins malarky!

As for me, the day's work was the morning 4miler, and then a lunchtime session of 2x3miles at HMP. I'd never done more than 3miles at HMP before (outside of races!), so that and the fact my zones have increased following the 10mile races, meant I wondered how it would go, especially as i'm getting a tightness in the hamstring/glutes that i can't seem to shift with normal stretching (hence sports massage questions the other day).

However, ignoring a windy mile, the others came out on average in the 5.52 mixer, bang in the middle of the target zone. Will enjoy a nice lazy evening now!


Edited: 06/11/2012 at 17:51
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