The Middle Ground

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13/12/2012 at 15:53

Mr V – nope, mileage has been purposefully low, I had two weeks of low mileage around the recent 5 and 10 mile race, then followed that with 13 miles (2 runs) in 6 days last week, I only started training properly again with the 20 on Sunday. Looking to build up the miles now, should finish with 55 ish this week, looking to build into the 60s over Jan. Then I will see where Marathon specific training takes me in Feb, March and April.

Sounds like a sensible plan on the tempo front, getting a mix of upper aerobic paces is certainly the way to go IMO. Don’t neglect straight tempos, 4m@ threshold, 5m@HMP etc….

Phil – cant watch the video at work, will check it out later.
Just read that Ryan Hall is now working with Canova, apparently before that he was using a ‘faith based’ training system, what the feck is that?!!

Agreed on the dark chocolate, I sit next to the tuck shop, I need to do something to stop me using it. Also think I might get a some frozen berries in to spruce up my porridge on a morning.

As for Marathon plans, your long run plan isn’t dissimilar to mine, long and slow before adding in the pace later on in the year. Though my approach to MP work is different. I am not planning on doing any larger blocks of it until Feb, though I may touch upon it at the end of progressive runs (med long at this stage) in the meantime.

13/12/2012 at 18:58

Ryan Hall's 'faith coaching' appears to be God as his coach and Jesus as his physio. Or the other way around. 

Hilly, that i sa fair point re: WAVA improvement although the chasers and the chasees will have different motivations!

Very nice session Mr V. A success you managed to stay upright!

YD, not too bad actually, so far. Easy runs are ok as I can run commute, and I have enough time to get the other sessions in. 

5M today, I think (Tuesday aside) I'm in a little bit of a trough right now running-wise as nothing feels flowing or easy. All part of the rollercoaster!

13/12/2012 at 20:41

TBH, I'm quite happy at the bottom of the table, it gives me something to aim for!

A rest day Phil? You could almost be accused of slacking

The discus was always my least bad throwing event (still very bad!), I'm not sure my PE teacher ever trusted me near a shot putt!

Hope YD's enjoying his cold 12 miler.

Some nice tempo intervalling going on. I've got some pencilled in for January once I've built my MP runs back up to 10 miles.

6.5 gentle chilly miles with the club tonight.

13/12/2012 at 21:05
So, my attempt at a steady-pace 4 mile tempo. Splits: 5:38, 5:39, 5:38, 5:38. That'll do! HR max'd out at 175 = HM effort, so satisfied it was nice and controlled.

In culinary news I think I've perfected the black bean stir-fry. The usual garlic, ginger, spring onion, red pepper and mange tout, and as green leafy veg goes i've discovered that chard works brilliantly with the black bean sauce, served up with brown basmati rice and salmon. Oof!
13/12/2012 at 21:30

Not a bad time for a MD runner to have a slump Duck, don’t stress it and keep ticking over.

Nice immune system building Phil, sounds delicious.  Good consistent splits n’all.

10 miles is a big chunk at MP CB and yes it was chilly.

I am sure that’s the coldest run I have embarked upon. When I got in the first thing Mrs YD said to me was “Your eyelashes are frozen!” lo and behold a look in the mirror confirmed icicles had started to form! On top of that my hands were pretty painful, even with two pairs of gloves on!
Anyway 12.31miles @ 8:08/m.

13/12/2012 at 22:49

Good tempo work there PP, and a good icy session noted from Mr V last night.

Hilly.. good to see you enjoying it again after all your frustrations

Similar run to me Y D.  0 degrees and thick fog (about 50-60m visibility) around our country lanes.  Did 10.5m late morning with a clubmate in hi-viz gear and a fleece hat!  BTW might be worth trying some of those gloves with merino wool content.  I suffer from Raynauds and I've tried all sorts of combinations.

After all this talk of gay marriage my thought for the week has to be...

'Should a married couple be frank and earnest'.

Edited: 13/12/2012 at 22:51
13/12/2012 at 22:54
Evening all,

Congrats to YD for a hardcore 12m in very cold conditions - I snuck in 11+ miles today, and have to admit I was in a hat, gloves, tights, the works!

Phil's chard black bean stir fry sounds yummy
14/12/2012 at 12:27

Wardi, re: gloves the Gore-tex Mythos Windstoppers are great too. A bit pricey but you get what you pay for with them.

PhilPub wrote (see)
In culinary news I think I've perfected the black bean stir-fry. The usual garlic, ginger, spring onion, red pepper and mange tout, and as green leafy veg goes i've discovered that chard works brilliantly with the black bean sauce, served up with brown basmati rice and salmon. Oof!

That looks great. Might have to give it a go sooner rather than later 

YD, nice going in the cold, it really was something else yesterday. Yeah I'm not too bothered about a slump period, my thinking is if I get it out the way with over the next month or so I'll be ok for the indoors and the final few XC races of the year  

Going down to the indoor track later on, was planning 8*400 today but I've swapped it for next week's 2*8*100 as it's awful conditions outside. 

14/12/2012 at 12:46

Good running going on guys, especially PP and Mr V enjoy your track session later Duck.

nice to see the Northern contingent keeping up the hardness stakes with sub zero running! Glove combinations  I'd like to find a pair that didnt have to come off after a mile or two

I gave in and went running today, just 3.5m but no twinges which is good, and done some massage now too to help keep things loose. Going to run again tomorrow and go from there...

14/12/2012 at 13:01

Nice tempo Phil.

YD - after this morning's effort I'm a way off (admittedly former) MP for 10 miles. Took short breaks after miles 1 and 2, managed to string together miles 3 and 4 before another rest, but binned it 0.2 miles into the next effort. Not too bothered considering I've had a good couple of weeks.

Well done on the cold runs YD and YP.

Enjoy the track Duck.

14/12/2012 at 13:31

Jeez, icicles on eyelashes.  You're a hard lot up north!  My lobster mits were showing their limitations on Tuesday evening so I think I need to invest in some liners for extra protection.  Silk / merino wool, anyone??

Curly - good stuff, fingers crossed for no more twinges.

Duck - The only other details to add about last night's dish were the obligatory hot pepper sauce (Encona; other brands are available, but frankly not as good!) and the fact that I've started using rice bran oil - supposed to be as healthy as olive oil but a higher smoking point, so better for frying.

I've started my plain chocolate (70%) odyssey with a very quick nutrition survey in Waitrose.  Compared to Waitrose own brand and Green & Black$, Lindt "Excellence" has the lowest fat and sugar content, and I seem to remember liking Lindt choccy generally so this'll be my accompaniment to afternoon tea.  Since I'm planning on making a regular event of it, I need to work out what a reasonable portion size would be.  Suggested serving is 40g (4 chunks of a 10 chunk bar) = 208 kcal.  Sounds quite a lot on a daily basis, so maybe I'll go with 30g = 156 kcal... or more on quality days...  Decisions, decisions! 

(And give or take 1.5 hrs walking/biking commute, today is officially a rest day!)

**edit** Cheeky buggers put in an automatic link to G&B chocolate. Pi$$ off. 

Edited: 14/12/2012 at 13:33
14/12/2012 at 13:32

Hi all. Since my last post it's gone all a bit wrong over the last ouple of days. I went out for a short 4 miler on Tuesday night in Winchester and got back to my partners house to realise my hair and eyelashes had froze. Yes we do get frost in the south too  

More to the point though, I felt rather chilly on Wednesday evening and didn't think too much of it - particularly as I am not one of the southern softy types - often a topic of discussion and conflict with my partner....particularly over who wants and doesn't want the heating on... Woke up feeling very sick in the middle of the night and went into work yesterday feeling like i'd been dragged through a hedge. Either it's a virus going round or perhaps I tried to do too much with the running in the conditions on Tuesday. Either way, it's just one of those things which seems to be of the 24 hour nature or a little longer which comes about once every year or so. Hoping that I will feel fresher for picking things up again tomorrow. Enough moaning from me anyway or otherwise I will be seen to be a closet southern softie! 

YP - Chichester pacing definitely sounds like a good idea. I remember you have said before we are on similar paces and it seems to make sense. A lot of members from my club will be running the Ryde 10 mile race that day as part of the Hampshire Road Race League so it will be good to get some pacing on the way round - it's a few months away yet so hopefully I will be on target for sub 40 pace by then! 

PP - If I don't do the 7 Hills this year then I will do one day - one of my best friends lives very close by in a town called Wijchen so I am out there once a year or so normally. 

Duck - Good luck with the shot put. You have already got me starting plank routines in my front room ....not sure I want to be influenced in the same sort of direction there thank you very much! In all seriousness though, good luck with that! 

CB - good early morning work out the other morning...very impressive coming from someone who struggles to get out of bed most mornings! 

Edited: 14/12/2012 at 13:37
14/12/2012 at 14:23

Lo Wardi

Jeez Phil I am sure you are allowed 4 blocks of choccie with all the training you do! I am sure my kit kat chunky at lunchtime comes in at a higher calorie count! Agreed on Encona, btw lovely stuff.

As a Raynauds sufferer here, I might also look into some merino wool gloves to go under my thick gloves as they aint cutting it at the moment!

Nice work on the miles YP, like you I had tights, long sleeved t-shirt, jacket, hat and two pairs of gloves on last night.

Wish I had a local indoor track Duck, enjoy

Good news on the niggle Curly

CB – do you run to effort or pace? It might be a good idea when doing quality workouts on a morning to just run to effort instead of worrying about pace.

Take it easy WJH don’t push it if not 100%

Just been having a pow wow with my training partner, he’s having a hard time with Pneumonia, looks like those midweek med long runs are going to be solo affairs for a while yet

14/12/2012 at 14:40
Y D wrote (see)

CB – do you run to effort or pace? It might be a good idea when doing quality workouts on a morning to just run to effort instead of worrying about pace.

Sort of effort. I'm not too worried if I'm not hitting the pace, but this morning I was struggling disproportionately to get somewhere close!

14/12/2012 at 16:23

PhiPub - A bit concerned that a chocolate post has got me back on list, but ... try Tesco own Ivory Coast 17%. 20g = 110kC, but mmm.

Curly - Flicking back, did I see you're doing Brighton? Target?

SimonE: After your sub20 parkrun pacing in the spring, I've been languishing at 22ish, as just finished 6wks Daniels' base. Did the first Phase II sess of 3x(1km@4:00km pace, 3min rec) and now foolishly agreed to pace someone for a sub21 this weeked - should be hilarious. Toenail just about come off now after The Grim, where Team Sandy Crack knocked 5 mins off last year's combined team for 14th team of 72. Pleased, as 7 of the teams before us were Posh Nob School XC yoof.

All - some great training there.

14/12/2012 at 16:24

PhiPub - Or even ... try Tesco own Ivory Coast 74%. 20g = 110kC, but mmm.

14/12/2012 at 17:56

Thought I would give a quick update...
Achilles: walked 5.5k yesterday (in the company of a 2:22 marathoner, and a 2:26 who is just recovering from heart surgery: we looked like a scene from Last of the Summer Wine with a combined age of 185: 58 + 63 +64!). Physio has told me I could run as the Achilles has repaired...but it would be silly to do so as there is so much calf muscle wastage.
Prostate: saw radiologist last week, who, being a radiologist recommends radiology (brachytherapy) and today saw a surgeon...who not unsurprisingly suggests surgery. Rather like car salesmen recommending their own brand as opposed to another. The good thing is that today I was remined that there is no great urgency for treatment, and that I don't need to make a decision until the new year. If anyone knows anything about treatments, or knows anyone who has had prostate problems, please message me: the more info I have the better. In the end it will be my decision...a bit like whether to wear cushioned or minimal shoes!

Off to a club get together for the 2:22 guy who is over from Aus. There will be a couple quicker than him there!


14/12/2012 at 18:27

Alehouse, good news on both fronts! 

Curly, good news the niggle isn't too bad and you can run again. 

WJH, sounds like it could be illness related so take it easy.

Shame YD, hopefully if you can get some mental stamina (i'll trademark that if no-one has taken it yet) through doing MLR's on your own then come the time you have to run with others you should be fine. 

The indoor track was enjoyable! Seeing as it was pitch black and blowing a gale outside we were quite smug inside  

2*5*100, walkback rec between reps & full recovery between sets. Essentially strides @ 400m pace. Ran 13.1, 13.6, 13.4, 13.4, 13.7, 13.2, 13.5, 13.5, 13.3, 13.3 (13.4 avg). 

The fastest 2 were at the start of each set, so I think when I'm racing I need to make sure I don't hammer the first 100 too hard and pay for it later on. But nice and quick while maintaining relaxation. Got some video too which I will post in a bit. 

Edited: 14/12/2012 at 18:48
14/12/2012 at 18:57

Phil, I'd suggest a read of which sum up my feelings about chocolate and antioxidants.

14/12/2012 at 19:38

alehouse - things sounding much more positive for you.  Best to wait for the running to start as you say.  I'm not in contact with the guy I know who had the same condition or I'd ask, sorry!  Hope you find someone to help you decide!

Excellent training threaders!

So icy here this morning that it was like a layer of glass all over the pavements and roads.  Our school didn't open until 11am as staff couldn't get in due to roads closed etc.  I don't think I've ever witnessed such unusual icy conditions in my life!  It really was like an ice skating rink, with people holding on to railings to walk down a road, cars sliding down roads etc and freezing fog everywhere.  Yes I think  you have to be hard to live oop north;-)  I have to say that with such icy conditions last night meant I didn't venture out as  not hard enough!  Thankfully the rain came today and temperatures rose enough to melt it and we managed a run this afternoon.

Edited: 14/12/2012 at 19:40
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