My Forum

Bob - working that middle teir aerobic system (if you imagine base endurance - threshold - vo2 max as a very basic aerobic 'teir') if really critical - it's easy to run the mileage and drill the interval workouts but lack that bit inbetween, and it will affect you in races - 5*800 in 3:00 can mean you can run 1.5-2M of a 5k at 18:40 pace, but not stressing that threshold area (by both working slightly below, at or above as Simon has mentioned) means the whole picture never really comes together well. 

Simon says it well when he mentions pushing it up from below - HMP or roughly 80 -90 minute race pace is good for this IMO. While 10kp stuff will help LT to a certain extent, if you wanted to run cruise intervals I'd progress them by pace over the session and average just under LT overall. So for example, 4*1M w/60s rec where you go 7:10-7:05-7:00-6:50 (based on a theoretical LT pace of 7:00/m exactly). DT's session too (MP/HMP/10k/10k/HMP/MP) is a good example.

Then of course there's progression runs which are probably my favorite. You could start by doing the above cruise session then progress it into 4M @ 7:10-7:05-7:00-6:50 over time (assuming your fitness stayed the same during that time, which it probably wouldn't so you would probably have to adjust somewhat). 

Simon, the 100s don't start until quite lateish, by the time they are finished I really don't want to be hanging around! Planning the 600 for about 2 hours before they start, I agree it'll impact performance but I don't see 100s as especially crucial - were it anything longer I would have considered the 600 after. 

Mr V, shame about the mile but it sounds like you have a strong aerobic system but not much in terms of lacic glycolytic stores. If you want me and Simon could expand on how to improve this.

cb - keep an eye on their names. Could be big in a few years!

Aah, Hattoris. Wanted a pair for a while. Got a pair of Brooks Puredrift last Monday which are great. I'm a bit of a shoe hoarder myself 

Watched the Beach 10k tonight. Mum ran 40'03, cs 52'42 in a decent headwind for long portions. Both happy. Good evening 

Evening everyone. End of a bit of a busy week for me.

Mr V, I wrote out quite a big section then realised I was probably overcomplicating things. I'd stick to the following:

• Race pace work - start off w/8*800 @ 5kp, and progress it to 4*1M by the time you want to peak.
• 3kp stuff - same idea, less volume of course. Perhaps finish off with 2*1M or 3*1k.
• 1500m pace - 400s w/short rest - 2*1k w/longish rest. Icing on the cake stuff!

I'd probably keep a once-fortnightly threshold run too, and 90 min long run w/a steadyish last 15-20 mins (~6:50/m or a bit slower than MP).

Simon, don't give up on the season yet. I've hardly got started yet! What have you run this year aside from the 800 pb? Doesn't sound like - performance wise - the year has been too bad so far.

That's a great session, might give it a shot myself. That final 200 must have been close to flat out? I'd agree close to 2:07 shape - a good predictor is 600 @ 800 pace, multiplied by 1.35. If you can run 94.5 then I'd be confident of 2'07.xx

Simon Edward wrote (see)

Dan, I agree that Duck and I  definitely need a smackdown. I need to get revenge for last year's race.

Bring it on  

Bob, great session, I'd expect a 5k pb soon based off of that. Sorry for forgetting but have you been doing many shortish tempos recently? That would give a pretty decent indicator too I think.

Garmins.... useful as a tool but I don't rely on one for pace. My 5k pb has an average pace of 5:45/m on the Garmin but I squeaked a 17:59 which is 5:48/m.  On the track I use it in indoor mode and use it as a stopwatch, on the road in races etc I use it to ensure I don't go off way too fast.

YD - who are you?  good to hear you are still kicking about and training well

Andrew, nothing more to add to what's been said. Get the miles in, some tempos and forget about the magical interval session for now. You'll improve just by doing something on a regular basis. 

God Phil, sounds very nasty  get well soon!

I've had more good sessions. Today I did 2*300 w/15'00 rec - a good predictor for the 400. Basically I think if I'm splitting 40.00 for 300m and it not being flat out then sub-54 should be possible. 

Ran 39.9, 39.4. I was breathing hard at the end but I wasn't tying up and throwing myself at the line. That 53.xx is close!

Rest week now. I am doing a 4*100 & open 100 Thursday, and am going to run a 600m TT about an hour before as well to see what I can do. I'm parkrunning Saturday for the first time since March  I literally have not had a single Saturday off since! 

As for the WAVA table, while my mile is the highest I won't put it down if the time isn't 100% accurate.

MIDDLE GROUND WAVA LEAGUE (March - June 2013) 

Calculator here: http://www.howardgrubb.co.uk/athletics/wmalookup06.html

82.02% PhilPub (Marathon, 2:35:54, April)

80.98% Velloo (5k 18:53 May)

79.47% Simon (800, 2:08.8, May)

77.35% Wardi (5K 19:52 March)

76.67% Duck (400m, 56.64, May)

73.23% MrV (5K, 17:37, June)

70.16% Dr.Dan (5K, 20:22, April)

69.22% DT19 (HM, 1.27.07, March)

68.76% WJH (5M 30:55, May)

67.16%, BBB (5 mile, 34:07,

Bob, I did 600/500/400/300 all well under 5:00/m pace a few months ago w/jog recoveries. My first recovery was under 7:00/m pace! It's difficult to keep them slow to begin with, walking sounds like a good plan.

Mr V, what kind of splits are you hitting for 6*1M? I would actually suggest the opposite, feeling good on mile reps probably means you're quite fit in that area but shorter stuff is difficult because you're not used to turning over at that speed.

Those sessions sound brutal. 

Yep, really frustrating. Alehouse's point is very valid, and also if they realised instantly the stopwatch had failed why didn't they call a false start and get us to start again?

FWIW I am going to stick with 4:54 as my time. 4:50 would be great but I just can't be sure how accurate it is anymore. Still, can't keep me down and I've been at the track the last 2 days for back to back sessions.

Yesterday was 200/150/100 flat out w/16'00 rec after the 200 and 11'00 after the 150 (was meant to be 20 & 15 but I couldn't be buggered standing around anymore than I already was). 

Ran 25.2 , 18.9, 12.9 into a bit of a headwind. FWIW my 200 pb is 25.55 and my 150 is 19.4! 

Then today - 600/600/300 w/12'00 rec. 97.0, 95.2, 41.5. The 600s felt great, I do really think I am approaching some great 800 form now. I could have run a few more seconds quicker in the second 600 and still not been flat out (went through 400 in 63). Don't think I'm too far from 2:04 now, from mid-July onwards I am (hopefully) going to be racing every weekend so by the time the season comes to a close I should have run some good times. 

Mile is on PO10.... 4:50. As 1MNAD. 

The reason is on the results: 

"Senior race times not eligible for rankings due to following message from organisers "NB: The stop watch failed at the start of the race. We have estimated the time it took to get the stop watch to work to 5 seconds and have allocated the time based on this. If you have a discrepancy with the time you have for the Union Street Mile, please let me know and we will re-evaluate the results"

Not impressed.