Latest posts by Teknik

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HADD Training Method

Posted: Today at 13:58

Stewart  - difficult to say, but my guess is the pace was dropping a little so that probably kept it flat

Dr Dan that may well be the key - my subLTs were getting worse in the last 4 weeks before Frankfurt, so early peaking may well be the issue for me too.  Treat yourself to those missing 7 seconds at the Leeds Half !

Nayan that subLT / MP connection is the subject of some debate.  The best answer for me was from Paul on the Fetch Hadd thread:

"My approach is that my sub-LT 10-milers just gradually 'evolve' in to MP 10-milers. I start them off in the base building phase at about 80% maxHR, and by the end of the specific marathon training phase they're at about 85% maxHR.

I probably improve by 50-60sec/mile during that process. About half is probably due to using more bpm, and about half due to improving fitness.

The pace that I see for that 85% is then pretty much my goal race pace. By the time the kitchen sink goes in then race HR average might then become 86-87. But it will have sat at 84-85 for much of the race."

I have never managed to flat-line for 10 miles above 83%, so I tend to stick with my average subLT at 83% as "MP".  Or I chicken out and add 15 seconds to it....lol

7.8m easy for me this morning.  Another subLT tomorrow... 

The 2014 Marathon Thread.

Posted: Today at 12:22

Stewart nice JS run Tuesday, and well done on the runs and gym class yesterday.  I can't help on the heal pain, but maybe it's a good time to see a fizz before starting a new plan?

Colin ouch! Get on the roller, and maybe take a day off...

OH that looks like a fun action-packed week ! LoL at the population blip

mathschick enjoy the holiday rest

HM hope there's no ill effects from the long car journey

Stuart nice weights and swim session

MG good steady run

NP sounds great  Enjoy the holiday

Kaz hope you clear that niggle soon

Fiona enjoy the long weekend

No races on the list for the next 2 weeks.


7.8m this morning, 2m on my own, then the rest with the club.  HR a bit high so took it very slowly.

HADD Training Method

Posted: Today at 09:00

VT another great subLT, glad the calf is ok. 

I definitely overdid it, so lesson learned.  But I was rambling, my point to Dr Dan was that maybe, as an FT type, he could try sticking to pure Hadd phase I and avoid P&D for a change:

  • 18 week P&D up to 55m: 4 runs at MP, (LSR with 8/10/12/14m finish), 13 runs either at HMP or 5k pace (alternate tempo or Vdot weeks)
  • 18 weeks Hadd - assuming a cut-back week every 4 weeks with no subLT - probably 26 "MP"/ maraHR runs of 10 miles. 

Maybe the emphasis on mara pace/HR will work better than the faster stuff?

HADD Training Method

Posted: Yesterday at 22:39

I hear you Dr Dan.  I've just spent the last 3 months flogging myself stupid with 2 lots of intervals a week (one short at 5k pace, one long at 10k pace) plus one long tempo, plus a marathon length LR.  60 miles a week in pursuit of a 4 minute PB at the Half. Result?  60 seconds PB.  That sucks.

Last year I did (almost) pure Hadd and achieved a 9 minute PB at the same Half.

The comparison is not entirely fair as the 9 minute gain was off a soft old Half PB, but I have come to the following conclusions:

(1) I am FT and love intervals, but they are useless for me in mara training - in fact they didn't help much with the Half either.

(2) I've never really given "pure Hadd" a proper go - I have always drifted back to P&D at some point in the cycle.

(3) The intervals and tempos interrupted my aerobic conditioning - I ran my Half in March at a 3% higher HR but only 5 seconds a mile faster pace.  I can take more pain now but that's a poor pay-off.

(4) So now I'm looking at a 25 week pure Hadd with no phase II.  Jack the miles back up to 75 a week and do nothing faster than the subLTs. (Plural: Two a week).

I hope to find that, as an FT, I'll not only break 3:30 in October but break the 1:30 Half en route in September.  But don't hold your breath...LOL

HADD Training Method

Posted: Yesterday at 19:34

Dr Dan well done in London, I'm sorry it didn't quite work out to plan.  My pet theory is it's the weather - we train for Spring in the cold and then it rapidly warms up in April.  A hot day is going to knock your HR up versus training stats - I ended up with sunburn and a DNF in MK last year. 

October marathons are usually the other way around - Frankfurt two years ago was 0C !  Having trained in the summer heat, my HR stats on that mara were about 10 beats lower than I had trained ! (Pity it was a heat wave last year...)

So if you stick with HR, you will run more slowly, and if you stick to pace, you'll suffer/fade/bonk in the heat.  You can't win if it's hot.

The 2014 Marathon Thread.

Posted: Yesterday at 11:39

Stuart nice pace on those 1m reps - good to hear you're still on for Loch Ness

matsmum good luck for Sunday's 20 miler

OH what's the schedule between the Half and the whole at CW?  Well done on the kayaking.

Stewart cricket training already ! Hope the JS run went ok

mathschick enjoy the rest - plenty of time before starting anything for York

HM I've made the changes.  Well done for getting out, and I hope the hip is ok this morning

MG nice 4m steady and well done on the PT session too


MP run for me this morning - 1m w/up then 2 x 4m at 80% max with a 2 minute rest.  Both came at around 8mm, so quite happy. 

The 2014 Marathon Thread.

Posted: 15/04/2014 at 14:58

...well the rest of the year looks like....

03/5/14 National 100k & Anglo-Celtic Plate  Jason D
05/5/14 MK                 Barbara D
11/5/14 Halstead  Moore06
12/5/14 Cape Wrath Half  OH
17/5/14 Cape Wrath  OH
18/5/14 Hook 2.5  HM
25/5/14 Edinburgh Half   Daveymck
25/5/14 Edinburgh StuartG, Laudi, Kevin Wickham, Matsmum, Colin Lee
31/5/14 Stockholm   MG1
08/6/14 Strathearn Tricialitt
21/6/14 The Wall Ultra Kaz
20/7/14 Dundee Half Stuart M
02/8/14 Devil o' the Highlands    Kaz
07/9/14  Great North Run  Colin Lee
14/9/14  Victory 10k HM
21/9/14  Pleshey Half  Teknik
21/9/14  Sydney   RoadWarrior
28/9/14  Loch Ness  Stuart M?, Kaz
28/9/14  Robin Hood    Iluvstaffies
05/10/14 Jersey  MG1
12/10/14 Budapest  Teknik
12/10/14 York  Daveymck,Fran-tic
19/10/14 Abingdon Jason D
25/10/14 Snowdon Jason D, OH

HADD Training Method

Posted: 15/04/2014 at 13:11

Roy great time for a relaxed HR - enjoy the holiday

Nayan - I agree with Bede and Chick, recovery to pre-mara stats can take ages: In my case about 3 months (comparing average pace and average HR per month). So after an early April marathon, I wouldn't beat March stats until July or even August.

Andi good luck with the test !

Dr Dan hope you're ok fella

Chick not long now - when are you flying over?

VT hope the calf is holding up

I'm now back on Hadd properly.  40m last week with one mini sub LT at 80% lid ( 2 x 3.5m). 54m planned this week with 2 subLTs, again with a 80% ceiling, (first one 2 x 4m, the second 6m straight). 

The 2014 Marathon Thread.

Posted: 15/04/2014 at 11:56

HM: good news on entering the race.  Hope you manage to get Chris moving later on today.

Stuart nice 6.5m.  Like the new piccie !  Enjoy the week off work

OH super 21 miler - good running ! 

mathschick I hope your youngest enjoys showing off your trophy

AGF glad you're getting the core work in - must start mine again

Kaz some friends of mine did The Wall a couple of years ago - over 2 days, as a relay !

MG impressive long tempo - I just can't do those on my own, so well done on sticking to it

Chris well done


7.6m this morning, a bit on my own then 6m through the woods and fields with the club.     

The 2014 Marathon Thread.

Posted: 14/04/2014 at 11:04

Fiona top running ! Well done  Gloves ?

Colin well done at the race - that did sound like a shambles, though !

NP super report, great reading! I agree with NN, you're a massive inspiration to all of us

mathschick I'm glad you're ok this morning


3m recovery jog, nice and sunny here

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